Australian Rugby / RA

[Bullrush]

The biggest problem isn’t the quality of the rugby, it’s the lack of competition

Ummm…this is exactly what I’ve said.

Instead of trying to be competitive, you’d rather not play anyone better than you.

And sure, if you think a Covid-effected season is a good measure of what is normal then cool bro. LOL

 

[SouthernX]

How does everyone feel about resting players at the international level? In hindsight I’m disappointed with the strategy knowing what World Cup campaign we had…

The super rugby boys effectively had 4-6 weeks off of no rugby between super rugby ending & that first test in South Africa.

There was a weekend in June where it was rumoured wallabies were coming back to club rugby… but they pulled the pin. We could of potentially had a quade cooper (gps) vs Carter Gordon (wests) club rugby match which would of hade eye balls on screen and the media talking about this fascinating position dual weeks out before Eddie decided on his France squad…

But nope. Let’s wrap these players up in cotton wool, have them hold some tackle bags and do some pyro stretching in preparation for a tournament 2 months away.

Any rugby review that’s about to go down needs to consider if we can move super rugby fixtures back to midweek so how contracted players can make themselves available for club rugby on the weekend.

 

[Derpus]

Or you could try and improve?

The only people interested in watching 3rd rate rugby are already rugby fans.

The defeatist attitude and cowardly approach to excluding anyone who you can’t beat right now is everything that’s wrong with Australian rugby.

With this kind of thinking, the Wallabies should only play the likes of Georgia and Portugal and stop playing any Tier 1 teams.

I mean, based on how things are going around the world I'd suggest not that many people are interested in watching rugby period. Going broke in Britain and Aus, the two biggest economies it's played in outside France.

The problem with this argument which we've heard a lot (besides being completely wrong) is that you never address how. Its fucking smooth brain shit.

Super Rugby is shocking. Its terribly run, its boring, its predictable and its way too short. Only myopic Kiwis still genuinely believe it has a future.

 

[Tomthumb]

Ummm…this is exactly what I’ve said.

Instead of trying to be competitive, you’d rather not play anyone better than you.

And sure, if you think a Covid-effected season is a good measure of what is normal then cool bro. LOL

It’s really not what you’ve said

Who said we don’t want competition? We just don’t see why the Kiwi teams add to the comp from an Australian perspective

It was a good measure of what a bit of rivalry and fan belief that they might win

 

[NoName]

The only thing that has kept Australian rugby competitive for the last 20 years has been super rugby. Without a weekly dose of reality from south Africans and new zealanders, Australian rugby would have applauded itself into mediocrity long before now.

 

[wamberal99]

I had no idea rugby league were paying for kids to go to private schools, You have to admire their creativity and spread.

Kids as young as 10 (or rather their parents) get financial inducements to sign up for an NRL club.

 

[Brumby Runner]

How does everyone feel about resting players at the international level? In hindsight I’m disappointed with the strategy knowing what World Cup campaign we had…

The super rugby boys effectively had 4-6 weeks off of no rugby between super rugby ending & that first test in South Africa.

There was a weekend in June where it was rumoured wallabies were coming back to club rugby… but they pulled the pin. We could of potentially had a quade cooper (gps) vs Carter Gordon (wests) club rugby match which would of hade eye balls on screen and the media talking about this fascinating position dual weeks out before Eddie decided on his France squad…

But nope. Let’s wrap these players up in cotton wool, have them hold some tackle bags and do some pyro stretching in preparation for a tournament 2 months away.

Any rugby review that’s about to go down needs to consider if we can move super rugby fixtures back to midweek so how contracted players can make themselves available for club rugby on the weekend.

Resting was a poor option and had next to no benefits, but considerable downsides.

Almost half the Brumbies squad (or perhaps more) were rested on two weekends over the course of Super Rugby, but only five got the call up to the Wallaby squad. The only effect was to denude the team against the Force and the Crusaders. One extra win from one of those sides would have put them in third or second place overall and likely improved their results in the finals.

 

[Derpus]

The only thing that has kept Australian rugby competitive for the last 20 years has been super rugby. Without a weekly dose of reality from south Africans and new zealanders, Australian rugby would have applauded itself into mediocrity long before now.

Whether or not that is true of the past is largely irrelevant. Its trash now.

 

[Joe Blow]

Yeah but the numbers of registed players in nsw is the lowest percentage in aus & its not growing

But the good ones go to the AFL states to play

 

[Bullrush]

It’s really not what you’ve said

Who said we don’t want competition? We just don’t see why the Kiwi teams add to the comp from an Australian perspective

It was a good measure of what a bit of rivalry and fan belief that they might win

You said

‘its the lack of competition’

and I completely agree. Where we differ is that you want competition by weakening the tournament instead of trying to improve, produce better rugby players and compete against the tougher opponents.

 

[Tomthumb]

You said

‘its the lack of competition’

and I completely agree. Where we differ is that you want competition by weakening the tournament instead of trying to improve, produce better rugby players and compete against the tougher opponents.

Improve how exactly? Feel free to provide an idea other than “just play better”

On top of that, this is about trying to find ways to make the Rugby product more marketable. Having a comp where less than half the teams are of any interest to the Australian public is a Hardly appealing to broadcasters. Just as I’m certain the Waratahs vs the Force would do dreadful numbers in NZ

 

[half]

With due respect to all, and the many good thoughts people have.

Key to our issues is we never want to both face current facts, and current future directions and trends we are heading towards.

Rugby, folk from the top down draw on previous years, and assume what we are experiencing is almost a one off and things will improve, or worst look how good things are.

I am yet to see any attempt, to identify where we currently are, and we keep spending our resources to solve the wrong issues as by never getting down to the core, we never identify the mega dangerous issues in advance, but often identify knee jerk issues as being major issues.

Until we solve this we will continue to slide.

 

[HogansHeros]

You said

‘its the lack of competition’

and I completely agree. Where we differ is that you want competition by weakening the tournament instead of trying to improve, produce better rugby players and compete against the tougher opponents.

As said earlier, please enlighten us on your grand plan to "just be better".

If you want to improve pathways, high performance centres and professionalism in general, you need money. How do you get money? You need a good product. How do you get a good product in sport? You get people watching and increase ticket sales and eyes on screens, increasing the value of broadcast deals. How do you do that? Well you need a competition that people want to watch. What do people want to watch? NRL and AFL... or a competition where their Australian side is winning. Simple solution, stop playing NZ. Create a competition that creates revenue and maybe we can restart the path to being a highly professional sport.

 

[Derpus]

Improve how exactly? Feel free to provide an idea other than “just play better”

On top of that, this is about trying to find ways to make the Rugby product more marketable. Having a comp where less than half the teams are of any interest to the Australian public is a Hardly appealing to broadcasters. Just as I’m certain the Waratahs vs the Force would do dreadful numbers in NZ

He can't because, like everyone else, he doesn't have a clue. Because Super Rugby is completely fucked.

 

[KOB1987]

Resting was a poor option and had next to no benefits, but considerable downsides.

Almost half the Brumbies squad (or perhaps more) were rested on two weekends over the course of Super Rugby, but only five got the call up to the Wallaby squad. The only effect was to denude the team against the Force and the Crusaders. One extra win from one of those sides would have put them in third or second place overall and likely improved their results in the finals.

Absolutely. The best fitness is match fitness, and our players don't play enough as it is. Resting players made no sense considering the schedule. And then our two most important players get injured at lineout practice anyway. At least it's only a World Cup year thing - currently at least.

 

[Goosestep]

The only thing that has kept Australian rugby competitive for the last 20 years has been super rugby. Without a weekly dose of reality from south Africans and new zealanders, Australian rugby would have applauded itself into mediocrity long before now.

I don’t think so, Rugby was in far better spot then … we would have probably started a national comp

 

[KOB1987]

I'm a bit Switzerland on the Tomthumb v Bullrush thing. Super Rugby Pacific is fine as long as we are competitive and is probably a better player development competition in that scenario. But at the moment we need eyes on screens and bums on seats, and Super Rugby AU or another domestic comp has more appeal in that regard. I reckon the ideal (and simplest) outcome is both nations have a domestic comp before the inbound tours, probably a winner v winner game at the end of that. And then a comp with the current 12 teams while the inbound tours and RC are on i.e. SRP (Super Rugby Pacific) without the test players.

 

[Goosestep]

I'm firmly of the belief that the Brisbane and Sydney clubs should be focusing their recruitment around the guys playing 2nds and 3rds at school that don't necessarily look like they're going to be anything. More than anything clubs run of warm bodies and a 100+ gamer playing in the grades who brings a few mates down, helps out with the bbq and does a bit of coaching of juniors is invaluable. That's not a knock on the guys playing first grade and aiming for more, but anyone in that high performance space costs money, which is where you need the guys just there for the joy of it to find the top teams.

If a few of them fill out and find their feet at the top level than even better, but the majority of a clubs effort should be community, rather than trying to masquerade as professional high performance setups.

I know for a fact they do it for 1xv players at certain schools but honestly they should do it down to say the 3rds or 4th… some of those schools are stacked with talent, who waste it after school cause they have no direct

 

[hoggy]

I'm a bit Switzerland on the Tomthumb v Bullrush thing. Super Rugby Pacific is fine as long as we are competitive and is probably a better player development competition in that scenario. But at the moment we need eyes on screens and bums on seats, and Super Rugby AU or another domestic comp has more appeal in that regard. I reckon the ideal (and simplest) outcome is both nations have a domestic comp before the inbound tours, probably a winner v winner game at the end of that. And then a comp with the current 12 teams while the inbound tours and RC are on i.e. SRP (Super Rugby Pacific) (Super Rugby Pacific) without the test players.

And that is where a lot of us are as well, NZ & Aus both run there own domestic. And then explore cross-over options, maybe a champions league with Japan & SA.
But it must come from a domestic base, NZ may have a 12 team domestic comp, Aus 8 teams whatever suits there own market & financials.

But as soon as we mention Domestic competition, its like we're advocating to turn into North Korea.

 

[dru]

The only thing that has kept Australian rugby competitive for the last 20 years has been super rugby. Without a weekly dose of reality from south Africans and new zealanders, Australian rugby would have applauded itself into mediocrity long before now.

Sorry. Did you just say that the thing that Wallabies have relied on is the top pro comp we are in? No shit Sherlock. The question is whether Super is the right pro comp in Australia. And by the commercials it just is not. By the engagement and strength of the grass roots, it is not. By the success within that comp, it is not.