Highlander35
Steve Williams (59)
Please please please appoint Johnson as head Coach. The minibus sutrely deserves another go 
Australian Rugby / RA
- Thread starter Dave Beat
- Start date
Quick Hands
David Wilson (68)
Alas, no coal miners or blast furnace operators on the BHP board unless they've hidden their talents.
https://www.bhp.com/our-approach/our-company/leadership-team
Seems that the "mining experience" on the BHP board relates to running mining operations and mining companies. There's a difference. Similar to the difference between a former rugby player and someone with successful elite sports management experience.
If being a director was rocket science, then RA would have flamed out on the launchpad and aborted mission.
In contrast, and following your theme, I wonder how many members of the RA board have experience in elite sports management? One? (being the CEO Ralene Castle)
By this I mean actually running the sport as opposed to reading a few papers.
http://www.rugbyau.com/about/who-are-we/board
I like to watch
David Codey (61)
Sounds like you’ve been reading the minutes of AMP board meetings......
The ones that are going to survive/thrive are where each of the directors takes their role more seriously than the ‘80s model you’ve just described.
formerflanker
Ken Catchpole (46)
I quite enjoy your contributions but have to make a stand against your use of climate deniers.
You invoke horrific memories of the Holocaust by associating Holocaust deniers with Climate sceptics.
Your obvious deep thinking about rugby leads me to assume you don't use climate deniers accidentally.
It's a poor way to make your point.
I'd enjoy debating you on CAGW but the mods deleted that thread a long time ago.
formerflanker
Ken Catchpole (46)
"Pip Pip" Pierpont saw not reading papers as a plus.
half
Dick Tooth (41)
Profound apologises on my part.
It never entered my head until you pointed that out. It is becoming a very common term usage "phase", and I used it in the context I had read it.
Please understand, I have huge respect for the Holocaust stories, and those who survived. In fact after i left my first job in the bank I was employed at 18, by a parent / relative who lost many family members and one of his own children in the Holocaust and to this day he was the best person I ever worked for. BTW he was an engineer and employed almost 800 people.
On a brighter note, I am a deep thinker about rugby issues and have been for many years, often falling well outside what is the current thinking prevailing at the time. I don't say this with pride but with huge sadness almost everything I predicted would happen has. Its not that I made a pack with the devil and sold my soul for inside knowledge or have a mystical crystal ball its simply common business sense.
Again please accept my sincere apologises, it was never my intent nor did I even think about the Holocaust which is not really an excuse and I won't do it again in any forum or discussion I have on climate change.
formerflanker
Ken Catchpole (46)
Thank you.
ForceFan
Peter Fenwicke (45)
Retreating Rugby Australia shaving with a bayonet
Wayne Smith - The Australian - 3 January 2019
A little like those Allied troops who were ordered to shave with their bayonets before retreating during Operation Market Garden in World War 11, Rugby Australia is putting the best possible face on an otherwise disastrous situation as it ventures hesitantly into 2019, the year of the Rugby World Cup.
There is no other way to describe 2018 than as an unmitigated catastrophe for Australian rugby.
The first season without the Western Force in Super Rugby did not end well for the Australians, with the Waratahs limping into the play-offs after being beaten at home by the Brumbies. Still, they were the team to end the embarrassing run of NZ triumphs over Australian sides, though not before it had climbed to 40. The Rebels and Brumbies, with seven wins and eight losses, couldn’t escape the fact they had losing seasons, while the hapless Reds had their best season since 2013 and still won only six matches. And the pain was only just beginning.
Little did anyone realise that the Wallabies would play their best rugby right at the outset of the international season.
Their series against Ireland was in the balance literally right up to the final seconds of the deciding Third Test in Sydney, and though they were deservedly beaten, it was in truth an honourable defeat. As the year gradually unfolded, the Wallabies’ Brisbane win came to be raised in status as the only blemish on Ireland’s year-long record.
Thereafter, however, the year spiralled into hell.
It was no surprise that it was the All Blacks who nudged them over the cliff, by a collective 17 tries to five over the three Bledisloe Cup Tests. Those optimists who suggested all sides needed to “bat” against New Zealand before a judgment call could be made on the quality of the pitch were hushed into silence as the Springboks and Ireland both inflicted defeats on the men in black.
Had it not been for a hairsplitting offside call, Eddie Jones’s Eng*land side, too, would have claimed a rare win over the southern hemisphere titans.
But the Wallabies weren’t just losing rugby Tests. They were losing fans, some so “rusted on” they almost had to be removed with an angle grinder.
Yet removed they were.
Australian rugby shame knew no bounds when the Wallabies were beaten at home by the Pumas, with one disgruntled fan taking out his spite on flanker Lukhan Tui — which was understandable but unfair.
Tui, who later changed his name to Salakaia-Loto to honour his stepfather who had died only 24 hours earlier, was one of the Wallabies’ best performers and finished as runner-up to David Pocock in the John Eales Medal.
There was almost worse to follow when the Wallabies trailed the Pumas 31-7 at halftime in the return match in Salta. Yet while coach Michael Cheika was able to conjure up an extraordinary 45-34 victory with an emotional appeal to the players’ pride in their jersey, he had played his “one time only” get-out-of-jail card.
Thereafter, the Wallabies could manage only a 26-7 win over a modest Italian side and even managed to evoke mild derision from Warren Gatland after losing to Wales 9-6.
It was an utter dog of a game but Gatland still felt moved to suggest his side had never felt more at ease against the Wallabies.
Cheika ended the year virtually friendless, with rumours circulating many of the Wallabies were utterly relieved to be returning to their Super Rugby programs. But Rugby Australia, bereft of ideas and, as it critically turned out, money, voted to keep him in place.
The command from on high was for everyone to spruce up. A director of rugby, the likeable Scott Johnson, was appointed to mentor Cheika; a third person — yet to be identified — would join them both before the start of the Super Rugby season to form a long-needed selection panel. Other face-saving alterations were hinted at.
As days went by, turning into weeks, the rising belief was that Cheika and his four-man coaching team might all have dodged a bullet after all, but that would be to totally discount Rugby Australia CEO Raelene Castle’s repeated references at last month’s press conference to the need for change.
Shaving with a bayonet is every bit as dodgy as it sounds and it may well be that the bloodletting nicks account for one or more of the assistant coaches.
It’s difficult to apportion individual blame to a coaching collective. Had Simon Raiwalui’s lineout functioned properly and not turned over ball after ball on the spring tour, might Steve Larkham have shown what he could do in attack?
Still, Australia’s general multi-phase attack has been pitiful all season. Having the best ball-*pilferer in world rugby, David Pocock, should have produced a flurry of turnover tries for the Wallabies yet time and again Australia’s first response was to kick the Gilbert away. Individually gifted as they might be, Australia’s coaching staff aren’t jelling.
The other issue, of course, is how receptive Cheika will be to Johnson or to any other “mentors”. He has made it clear he intends standing down once the World Cup is over — unless Australia wins, he did note — and it is now way too late in the day for RA to take corrective action if he forms the view the Wallabies will do it his way and the rest of you can all be damned.
Funnily enough, that is almost what RA is wishing for. They acknowledge that, against all odds, Cheika took Australia to the World Cup final in 2015 by coaching the team in his own unique fashion, so they can hardly now rein him in if he gets too excited.
Judging by the missteps of 2018, thoughts of a revival seem far-fetched but then, as TS Eliot put it, “last year’s words belong to last year’s language and next year’s words await another voice”.
Castle probably stayed up till midnight on New Year’s Eve to make certain 2018 was dead and buried before deciding it was safe to head to bed.
She, like everyone, is desperately praying the second year proves more profitable for Australia’s rising “young” coaches, Dave Wessels (Rebels), Dan McKellar (Brumbies) and Brad Thorn (Reds). If she is smart, too, she will be wishing Andrew Forrest every success with his Global Rapid Rugby project because a buoyant competition in Asia, especially one involving a rampaging Western Force, might give her and her SANZAAR partners much-needed options for the post-2020 era.
Most of all, she will be sending prayers aloft that Cheika and the Wallabies can pull it off. Not a World Cup win, because that’s like praying selfishly to win the lottery, but a performance in 2019 that all Australia could take pride in.
What a godsend that would be.
https://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...202f782993046a
Wayne Smith - The Australian - 3 January 2019
A little like those Allied troops who were ordered to shave with their bayonets before retreating during Operation Market Garden in World War 11, Rugby Australia is putting the best possible face on an otherwise disastrous situation as it ventures hesitantly into 2019, the year of the Rugby World Cup.
There is no other way to describe 2018 than as an unmitigated catastrophe for Australian rugby.
The first season without the Western Force in Super Rugby did not end well for the Australians, with the Waratahs limping into the play-offs after being beaten at home by the Brumbies. Still, they were the team to end the embarrassing run of NZ triumphs over Australian sides, though not before it had climbed to 40. The Rebels and Brumbies, with seven wins and eight losses, couldn’t escape the fact they had losing seasons, while the hapless Reds had their best season since 2013 and still won only six matches. And the pain was only just beginning.
Little did anyone realise that the Wallabies would play their best rugby right at the outset of the international season.
Their series against Ireland was in the balance literally right up to the final seconds of the deciding Third Test in Sydney, and though they were deservedly beaten, it was in truth an honourable defeat. As the year gradually unfolded, the Wallabies’ Brisbane win came to be raised in status as the only blemish on Ireland’s year-long record.
Thereafter, however, the year spiralled into hell.
It was no surprise that it was the All Blacks who nudged them over the cliff, by a collective 17 tries to five over the three Bledisloe Cup Tests. Those optimists who suggested all sides needed to “bat” against New Zealand before a judgment call could be made on the quality of the pitch were hushed into silence as the Springboks and Ireland both inflicted defeats on the men in black.
Had it not been for a hairsplitting offside call, Eddie Jones’s Eng*land side, too, would have claimed a rare win over the southern hemisphere titans.
But the Wallabies weren’t just losing rugby Tests. They were losing fans, some so “rusted on” they almost had to be removed with an angle grinder.
Yet removed they were.
Australian rugby shame knew no bounds when the Wallabies were beaten at home by the Pumas, with one disgruntled fan taking out his spite on flanker Lukhan Tui — which was understandable but unfair.
Tui, who later changed his name to Salakaia-Loto to honour his stepfather who had died only 24 hours earlier, was one of the Wallabies’ best performers and finished as runner-up to David Pocock in the John Eales Medal.
There was almost worse to follow when the Wallabies trailed the Pumas 31-7 at halftime in the return match in Salta. Yet while coach Michael Cheika was able to conjure up an extraordinary 45-34 victory with an emotional appeal to the players’ pride in their jersey, he had played his “one time only” get-out-of-jail card.
Thereafter, the Wallabies could manage only a 26-7 win over a modest Italian side and even managed to evoke mild derision from Warren Gatland after losing to Wales 9-6.
It was an utter dog of a game but Gatland still felt moved to suggest his side had never felt more at ease against the Wallabies.
Cheika ended the year virtually friendless, with rumours circulating many of the Wallabies were utterly relieved to be returning to their Super Rugby programs. But Rugby Australia, bereft of ideas and, as it critically turned out, money, voted to keep him in place.
The command from on high was for everyone to spruce up. A director of rugby, the likeable Scott Johnson, was appointed to mentor Cheika; a third person — yet to be identified — would join them both before the start of the Super Rugby season to form a long-needed selection panel. Other face-saving alterations were hinted at.
As days went by, turning into weeks, the rising belief was that Cheika and his four-man coaching team might all have dodged a bullet after all, but that would be to totally discount Rugby Australia CEO Raelene Castle’s repeated references at last month’s press conference to the need for change.
Shaving with a bayonet is every bit as dodgy as it sounds and it may well be that the bloodletting nicks account for one or more of the assistant coaches.
It’s difficult to apportion individual blame to a coaching collective. Had Simon Raiwalui’s lineout functioned properly and not turned over ball after ball on the spring tour, might Steve Larkham have shown what he could do in attack?
Still, Australia’s general multi-phase attack has been pitiful all season. Having the best ball-*pilferer in world rugby, David Pocock, should have produced a flurry of turnover tries for the Wallabies yet time and again Australia’s first response was to kick the Gilbert away. Individually gifted as they might be, Australia’s coaching staff aren’t jelling.
The other issue, of course, is how receptive Cheika will be to Johnson or to any other “mentors”. He has made it clear he intends standing down once the World Cup is over — unless Australia wins, he did note — and it is now way too late in the day for RA to take corrective action if he forms the view the Wallabies will do it his way and the rest of you can all be damned.
Funnily enough, that is almost what RA is wishing for. They acknowledge that, against all odds, Cheika took Australia to the World Cup final in 2015 by coaching the team in his own unique fashion, so they can hardly now rein him in if he gets too excited.
Judging by the missteps of 2018, thoughts of a revival seem far-fetched but then, as TS Eliot put it, “last year’s words belong to last year’s language and next year’s words await another voice”.
Castle probably stayed up till midnight on New Year’s Eve to make certain 2018 was dead and buried before deciding it was safe to head to bed.
She, like everyone, is desperately praying the second year proves more profitable for Australia’s rising “young” coaches, Dave Wessels (Rebels), Dan McKellar (Brumbies) and Brad Thorn (Reds). If she is smart, too, she will be wishing Andrew Forrest every success with his Global Rapid Rugby project because a buoyant competition in Asia, especially one involving a rampaging Western Force, might give her and her SANZAAR partners much-needed options for the post-2020 era.
Most of all, she will be sending prayers aloft that Cheika and the Wallabies can pull it off. Not a World Cup win, because that’s like praying selfishly to win the lottery, but a performance in 2019 that all Australia could take pride in.
What a godsend that would be.
https://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...202f782993046a
Quick Hands
David Wilson (68)
Excellent article, thanks for posting.
Is there a greater indictment on the development programmes of Australian rugby that 2 of the 3 "young coaches" mentioned above are from South Africa and New Zealand, while the 4th super rugby coach is also a Kiwi?
Is there a greater indictment on the development programmes of Australian rugby that 2 of the 3 "young coaches" mentioned above are from South Africa and New Zealand, while the 4th super rugby coach is also a Kiwi?
Strewthcobber
Simon Poidevin (60)
Just thankful we have introduced a cricket style selection panel so the strange teams full of favorites will be a thing of the past
Rugbynutter39
Michael Lynagh (62)
I suspect nzru and rugby Australia are cottoning on how important investment in rugby in asia region for simple fact unless we have this sort of investment we risk losing more and more of our talent base in the region to not just Europe but emerging and other growing professional rugby competitions (eg. Major league rugby in North America). I am just disappointed NSWRU under Hore does not have the same foresight with turning away opportunity for major investment in pro rugby in western Sydney. Actually I am just dissappointed and disillusioned with nswru period.
Quick Hands
David Wilson (68)
You'd be hard pressed to find professional sporting administrations so bereft of any strategic forward planning as the ARU/NSWRU have been in the past 20-30 years. Not only haven't they had a strategy to expand rugby into non-traditional rugby demographics and areas, but have failed to even have a strategy to maintain a strong presence in once strong rugby areas such as Parramatta. This is actually the long term cause of the woes in which the Wallabies and the super teams currently find themselves.
It shouldn't have taken a genius to work out that if the game has fewer junior clubs and thus players in it's traditional areas than it did 40 years ago, and hasn't made any meaningful attempt to attract more players and/or clubs in expansion areas of Sydney that it would somehow affect the elite level. The current state of the professional game is a result of the decisions/non-decisions taken by ARU/NSWRU in the 90s and early 00s. The muddled thinking that if the Wallabies were successful then all would be well has proven to be a failed strategy - unfortunately it's still a mantra of some current senior administrators and posters on these threads. Rugby in Australia must be the last hold-out of "trickle down" thinking in the world.
Rugbynutter39
Michael Lynagh (62)
I personally think twiggy and global rapid rugby at least challenging the status quo that is Rugby Australia and NSWRU to be more open to new thinking but problem is for me I liken the situation like trying to get an organisation ready to move from the quill to the biro pen while the rest of the world is looking at what newer and latest digital technology and features they can leverage to create the best consumer relevant products and competitive advantage.
In a competitive sports market only those prepared to innovate and adapt their sporting product to meet the needs of the modern day sports fan will thrive. Cricket is an example of a former very traditional and bureucratic organisation that adapted to being more innovative and consumer relevant sporting product focus. It took someone like packer back in the 70’s with his ‘pjama cricket’ to change the mindsight in cricket and here we are nearly 50 years on hoping something like twiggy and global rapid rugby can move the dial with the dinosaur that is Australian rugby (and sanzaar probably deserves mention also here).
I see some positive signs of change but no where near the speed required. What will be the catalyst to get this speed of change or will it just won’t happen and we continue to see Australian rugby shrink in ever diminishing relevance?
Next few years will be interesting as some opportunities been given to Rugby Australia, NSWRU and Sanzaar for someone else prepared to invest in their markets in players, pro opportunities and experimentation with new products to create a more engaging fan experience. Do these organisations have the foresight to grab these opportunities and run with it. I am skeptical but would love them to prove me wrong.
wamberal
Phil Kearns (64)
Trickle up is the way to go, eh? I can only talk about my little patch. Eastwood has worked out that we have to trickle well away from our traditional home, towards the north, where there are still some people who grew up with the game and love it, warts and all. There are fewer and fewer people like us in Eastwood, lots and lots of people who come from totally different backgrounds and ethnicities. They are not interested in organised sport of any kind, for themselves, or for their kids, who are all striving to get into James Ruse High (where tiddleywinks is the sport of choice). Maybe it is all the fault of the GPS/Banking consortium. Or maybe the problems are actually a lot more complex than that.
Anyway, we have worked that out what we have to do, down here at our grass roots.
I cannot speak for the grass roots at Parramatta today, but I do remember when Parramatta was actually a pretty swish place to live, and when Parramatta High School was a formidable rugby school. Mind you, that was a long time ago, and a lot has changed since then. All the fault of Rugby Australia, of course.
Anyway, we have worked that out what we have to do, down here at our grass roots.
I cannot speak for the grass roots at Parramatta today, but I do remember when Parramatta was actually a pretty swish place to live, and when Parramatta High School was a formidable rugby school. Mind you, that was a long time ago, and a lot has changed since then. All the fault of Rugby Australia, of course.
half
Dick Tooth (41)
Quick so very very very true especially the Wallabies is a save all ...
RNer
It is far more complex me thinks, our playing stocks i.e. real junior numbers and quality of those juniors as QH posted above has rugby in a scary position those that think we need to slowly rebuild are wrong very very wrong we need repaid action today and IMO we need capital and expertise rugby cannot afford.
The longer we wait the less likely it will work as getting investors will be less likely and maybe PUTS ON HELMET, soccer will have grabbed investors looking to invest in Australian sport.
We need to set up a franchise model based on USA sporting models, any of them Gridiron, Baseball, Basketball, Hockey and Soccer. They all operate similar models the MLS being the last to set up me thinks has the best see other posts I made. But they are all very similar.
Wam
Eastwood is the poster card, example of how to take a big business and make it small. The miss management from say the early 80's thu to today beggars belief. That Paddy and his mates suddenly discovered they had so K Hunt..ed the local area they have decided to cash in their inheritance and move to Castle Hill and people bow and say how smart they are is beyond even my old mate Stew to understand. BTW his full name is Stew Pudd, along with his mate Arthur Buse or A Buse.
QH has nailed it arguably over 60 years of poor management and its starting to show.
Quick Hands
David Wilson (68)
Interesting how other sports have taken steps to appeal to non-tradtional supporters. Your dismissal or fear of people who are "different" is sadly common among rugby supporters - which is a significant part of the problem.
Nobody has said that it would be easy to address the problems. You and others who stoically defend the establishment are the only ones who I ever see write those sorts of comments. However, addressing problems requires a couple of things (1) a recognition that there is a problem exists and (2) An integrated long-term strategy to address the problem/s
Sadly we've seen that the rugby establishment has been slow to recognise that there was a problem (some are still in denial) and we're yet to see any overarching strategy to fix the problems. At best we see piecemeal reactions to individual issues and tinkering at the edges.
And you finish off with your favourite straw man. Welcome back for 2019.
half
Dick Tooth (41)
This constant rebooting of the same failed plan must surely be ringing alarm bells somewhere?????????????
hoggy
Nev Cottrell (35)
And that's exactly what they are likely to do. They will sign up to whatever format super rugby is proposed (regardless of the fact that this competition has long past its ability to even maintain its market share in Aus, let alone improve it).
And then it will be all in on the new Test calendar format come 2021, which will undoubtedly fill the coffers for a couple of more years, so nothing will have to change, you've gotta love self interest.
So without stating the bleeding obvious, at what stage and when does the floor eventually collapse!!!
