Australian Rugby / RA

[half]

No, I disagree with your point.
I don't believe Andrew Forrest is going to "save" Australian rugby, nor was he ever. He had an agenda with the Force, and fair play to him, but the oft repeated $50 million "offer" was highly conditional, and why would a national body accept those terms. It was a big gesture, a popular gesture, but he knew that there was almost no chance that he would have had to follow through on it.
GRR so far has been somewhat underwhelming.
Most of the other issues have existed for years, and are endemic within Australian rugby. Expecting seismic changes in the time she has been there on most of those is laughable. Especially given the parlous financial state of things.
The Folau issue is of his making, and his alone. If he abides by some simple conditions, it's a non-issue.
All of this IMO.

I don't believe Andrew Forrest is going to "save" Australian rugby, nor was he ever. ====== Agree

He had an agenda with the Force, and fair play to him, but the oft repeated $50 million "offer" was highly conditional, and why would a national body accept those terms. ===== Agree

It was a big gesture, a popular gesture, but he knew that there was almost no chance that he would have had to follow through on it.===== Agree

GRR so far has been somewhat underwhelming ==== Agree

Most of the other issues have existed for years, and are endemic within Australian rugby. Expecting seismic changes in the time she has been there on most of those is laughable ===== Agree but for me she has been quite bland and not at least publicly made suggestions that could change our course.==== you could argue she was handed the poisoned chalice and give her brownie points for taking on the challenge.

Especially given the parlous financial state of things. ==== Agree but there are no new ideas being discussed either

The Folau issue is of his making, and his alone. ==== Totally disagree and IMO the over reaction by RA could sent RA bankrupt, if nay when they loose unless they have insurance cover they are in deep trouble.

On Andrew Forrest I don't see him having a life long involvement in rugby as say Larry Kestelman in Australian Basketball, or Frank Lowy in soccer. Although Andrew is wealthy akin to both Kestelman & Lowy, these two guys would bleed for their chosen sports.

On the Folau thing not wanting to revisit or rehash old stuff, in court IMO RA are gone for all money, hopefully they can find a way out before they get hammered in court ==== similar case in England and as the headline states Folau lawyers will be cheering from on high ... https://www.smh.com.au/national/fol...reedom-ruling-in-britain-20190704-p5240w.html

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Twiggy does have a history in the game, though. He played it as a schoolboy and his son has also. Whether that translates into a lifelong involvement in the game I guess we'll wait and see.

 

[Braveheart81]

Very good question. I'd go for bias/blinkered views of many Fox commentators.

Or the analytical quality of said commentators ..

I do wonder how much of it is not giving away too much inside knowledge and playing devil's advocate.

I mean you can't really push out articles saying Cooper is a shock omission if your experts have written him off as being very unlikely to feature in the squad halfway through the season.

Likewise if they all end up suggesting the similar players that are very close to the final squad, does it make them look like experts or just that they know who is going to get picked?

I feel like they are so varied in what they can do. Multiple great Wallabies name Horan as the best player they ever played with (the last I heard was Matt Burke at a lunch last week). Clearly his understanding of rugby is incredible but he completely fails to articulate it on most occasions.

Of the current lot I think Hoiles and Mitchell are actually pretty good at providing analysis.

 

[Slim 293]

On the Folau thing not wanting to revisit or rehash old stuff, in court IMO RA are gone for all money, hopefully they can find a way out before they get hammered in court ==== similar case in England and as the headline states Folau lawyers will be cheering from on high . https://www.smh.com.au/national/fol...reedom-ruling-in-britain-20190704-p5240w.html

Nah, the author has twisted the facts of that case to suit their agenda, because.........

John Steenhof is managing director of Human Rights Law Alliance Limited. HRLA is an independent sister organisation to the Australian Christian Lobby.

 

[Braveheart81]

The case in the UK also isn't an employment law case.

 

[Ignoto]

Of the current lot I think Hoiles and Mitchell are actually pretty good at providing analysis.

Interestingly enough, Turinuri has said multiple times on the Ruckas that as a commentator, you're forced into saying everything in sound bites and never given an opportunity to actually dive deeper into something.

 

[Braveheart81]

Interestingly enough, Turinuri has said multiple times on the Ruckas that as a commentator, you're forced into saying everything in sound bites and never given an opportunity to actually dive deeper into something.

That's kind of how TV sport has to work. You've got your main caller who does most of the talking and then the others get crossed to for a comment that generally has to be prepared (i.e. you can't just chime in when you've got something interesting to say). It's difficult to get around that because it becomes very messy when no one is clear on who should be talking when.

Pre game, half time and post game are really the only times where anyone can spend longer discussing something.

Sports like cricket and stuff are easier to provide analysis for because you don't have to do as much play by play commentating and can just discuss the game for periods of time.

 

[Slim 293]

The case in the UK also isn't an employment law case.

And passages like this from the judgement summary do not read too favourably for Folau's camp.........

The right to freedom of expression is not an unqualified right: professional bodies and organisations are entitled to place reasonable and proportionate restrictions on those subject to their professional codes; and, just because a belief is said to be a religious belief, does not give a person subject to professional regulation the right to express such beliefs in any way he or she sees fit.

 

[Quick Hands]

I don't believe Andrew Forrest is going to "save" Australian rugby, nor was he ever. ====== Agree

He had an agenda with the Force, and fair play to him, but the oft repeated $50 million "offer" was highly conditional, and why would a national body accept those terms. ===== Agree

It was a big gesture, a popular gesture, but he knew that there was almost no chance that he would have had to follow through on it.===== Agree

GRR so far has been somewhat underwhelming ==== Agree

To anyone underestimating the impact that the demise of the Force might have on the future of Australian rugby. For the first time in many years Western Australia haven't sent a state team to the Australian Schoolboys Rugby Championships and their place has been filled by a Barbarians team. Meanwhile in Brisbane, there is a Western Australian team competing at the Australian Schools u/15 rugby league championships (and presumably will also have a team in the open rugby league schools championships).

I fear that we have handed rugby league a huge opportunity in the west.

 

[RugbyReg]

Rugby Australia have stopped funding the champs which would have paid for WA to come out (they are broke). Instead they are funding the academy program (schools and under 18) which WA is a part of.

 

[half]

To anyone underestimating the impact that the demise of the Force might have on the future of Australian rugby. For the first time in many years Western Australia haven't sent a state team to the Australian Schoolboys Rugby Championships and their place has been filled by a Barbarians team. Meanwhile in Brisbane, there is a Western Australian team competing at the Australian Schools u/15 rugby league championships (and presumably will also have a team in the open rugby league schools championships).

I fear that we have handed rugby league a huge opportunity in the west.

Quick,in no way am I under estimating the effect of kicking out the force, how beyond crazy that was especially with Andrew Forrest on board.

My response was I don't think that AF, has that life long deep deep deep down in the soul relationship with rugby as has say Larry Kestelman in Australian Basketball, or Frank Lowy in soccer. Nor do I think he has the desire say determination to develop rugby, again if compared to Kestelman & Lowy.

This is not to say he will have a significance say or influence in Australian rugby's future.

 

[Kenny Powers]

Nobody knows Andrew Forrest's level of commitment until the money hits the bank account fair enough. However if Raelene is to schmooze anyone to be a financial patron of the game if not Andrew Forrest then whom?

Also with the stance Rugby Australia took with the Folau case plenty of talk sponsors would have walked if no action had been taken, well should the reverse be true that sponsors would join because of the stance taken. Is anyone aware of new sponsors coming on board at Rugby Australia?

 

[Derpus]

Nobody knows Andrew Forrest's level of commitment until the money hits the bank account fair enough. However if Raelene is to schmooze anyone to be a financial patron of the game if not Andrew Forrest then whom?

Also with the stance Rugby Australia took with the Folau case plenty of talk sponsors would have walked if no action had been taken, well should the reverse be true that sponsors would join because of the stance taken. Is anyone aware of new sponsors coming on board at Rugby Australia?

You come up with some real nonsense.

 

[Kenny Powers]

You come up with some real nonsense.

I have never considered anyone wanting to put money in an organisations bank account as talking nonsense nor their suggestions as to how to do so, kind of Business 101 and basic good manners.

But given my personal opinion that the CEO and the Chairman need all the help they can get, here is some unsolicited and free advice.

Raelene and Cameron below is a link which has all the Businesses that considered it important in the conduct of their operations to come out in support of same sex marriage.

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/...the-yes-campaign-for-same-sex-marriage-2017-9

Start at the beginning and work your way down the list, your pitch is

‘Rugby Australia has taken a stance thru its players and official’s code of conduct, that see’s it having to defend these principles in the court of law and court of public opinion. These challenges come in addition to the financial and competition issues the sport faces. Given your support for same sex marriage and your support for the principles of inclusiveness we unitedly share and defend, Rugby Australia would like to engage with yourselves regarding mutually beneficial sponsorship opportunities available across Australian Rugby.’

Raise $2.2 million in sponsorship (not a donation) from these cashed up businesses over the next week, (the other side did it from less well-resourced individuals in a little over 48 hours) and a lot of people including myself who believe Rugby Australia have handled this poorly, will have food for thought and will be questioning their stance.

 

[Forcefield]

Where do you actually think that $2.2 million has come from, Kenny? I'd wager a testicle that very little of it comes from "average Joe's".

 

[Adam84]

Also with the stance Rugby Australia took with the Folau case plenty of talk sponsors would have walked if no action had been taken, well should the reverse be true that sponsors would join because of the stance taken. Is anyone aware of new sponsors coming on board at Rugby Australia?

no, RA aren’t breaking any shackles by what they did, they’re simply following a social norm and expectations. People aren’t going to throw more money at an organisation for doing the basics right, people will however produce less money if they’re doing poorly.

 

[dru]

RA are doing poorly. And yes they are producing less money.

 

[Show-n-go]

no, RA aren’t breaking any shackles by what they did, they’re simply following a social norm and expectations. People aren’t going to throw more money at an organisation for doing the basics right, people will however produce less money if they’re doing poorly.

Ya kidding right

If RA aren’t looking to capitalise on their very public stance then they’re doing something very wrong. I don’t neccisarily agree with how this whole situation has unfolded but if you’re going to run with something RA may as well go 100%

The Mardi Gras are pretty much funded by businesses ANZ, QANTAS, Accor Hotels, Google, absolute, Holden, Myer, the Star, vodofone, Woolworths. Plenty of money there to tap into

 

[wamberal]

It is possible to be inclusive, without being doctrinaire about it.

 

[Adam84]

RA aren’t trying to be the Madi Gras