Aussie Player Exodus

[Braveheart81]

Not sure if it has, but I was told on the weekend about it. I find it very odd that a player of his talent isn't wanted by any of the 5 super teams in Australia, but is wanted by an NZ super team.

He also wants to play for Fiji so he'd need to become a marquee player in Australia if and when he is capped.

I'm not sure that he couldn't find a contract in Australia, it's probably more a case that there is an opportunity at the Crusaders following the departure of Carter, Slade and Tom Taylor this year.

 

[Train Without a Station]

Not sure if it has, but I was told on the weekend about it. I find it very odd that a player of his talent isn't wanted by any of the 5 super teams in Australia, but is wanted by an NZ super team.

Probably because he is playing for Fiji

 

[Wilson]

Ah there is a spot in the Rebels and or Qld to start and I am doubtful about the long term prospects of Roach at Super level just on the basis of his scrummaging.

Really? The rebels have Hansen and siliva siliva next year aswell who'd both make the 23 over porecki and qld have saia and ready, who was probably the standout hooker in the nrc and certainly played better than porecki. On current evidence porecki has shown nothing that would place him better than third in any of the Australian super squads and that's if he's lucky. At that point most sides are going to rightly prefer there local talent.

 

[Quick Hands]

He also wants to play for Fiji so he'd need to become a marquee player in Australia if and when he is capped.

I'm not sure that he couldn't find a contract in Australia, it's probably more a case that there is an opportunity at the Crusaders following the departure of Carter, Slade and Tom Taylor this year.

I think you'll find that the Fiji option came after he was left unwanted by the Australian super teams. He's played for Australia at 20s level and played for the Waratahs as a local player i.e. one who was a potential Wallaby.

The first mention of playing for Fiji that I can find is AFTER he was unsigned by any Australian super side.

It's not correct to say that he always wanted to play for Fiji, he was born in Australia, went back to Fiji for a few years and has been back living in Sydney with his family since about 12.

 

[Quick Hands]

Probably because he is playing for Fiji

No, he wants to play for Fiji because he wants to play at test level. He previously played for the Austr u20s and then the Waratahs as a local player not an import.

 

[qwerty51]

He means Volavola sought to go overseas once he decided to play for Fiji. His options in Aus were non-existent once he wanted to play for Fiji.

 

[Braveheart81]

I think you'll find that the Fiji option came after he was left unwanted by the Australian super teams. He's played for Australia at 20s level and played for the Waratahs as a local player i.e. one who was a potential Wallaby.

The first mention of playing for Fiji that I can find is AFTER he was unsigned by any Australian super side.

It's not correct to say that he always wanted to play for Fiji, he was born in Australia, went back to Fiji for a few years and has been back living in Sydney with his family since about 12.

Was he really completely unwanted by the Australian Super Rugby sides though? Does anyone actually know for sure?

Or is it just a much better opportunity that came his way?

I didn't say that he's always wanted to play for Fiji. I agree that wouldn't have been the case.

 

[Train Without a Station]

Still, where's the demand going to come from?

The Reds have the NRC Reigning Champions flyhalf on their books, The Tahs have banked on Foley and Horwits for the future it seems. The Brumbies have both Leali'ifano and To'omua, whilst the Rebels have both Debreczeni and Hegarty.

Perhaps the Force now Holmes is departing. But he signed after Volavola.

When he signed it looked like the only opportunity would possibly be the Reds. But only if QC (Quade Cooper) left and they decided that in addition to McIntyre, they wanted another player with minimal experience rather than search for an experienced option.

 

[Braveheart81]

Still, where's the demand going to come from?

He'd be competing with the guys that don't get to play unless there are a huge run of injuries, much like at the Tahs.

He certainly wouldn't be out of place as the third choice 10/15 like he has been at the Tahs at another side.

The opportunity is certainly much greater at the Crusaders because he will be on a clean slate with the other candidates following the fairly unusual situation of the first three flyhalf options all leaving at once.

 

[Quick Hands]

Was he really completely unwanted by the Australian Super Rugby sides though? Does anyone actually know for sure?

Or is it just a much better opportunity that came his way?

I didn't say that he's always wanted to play for Fiji. I agree that wouldn't have been the case.

I'm not sure if playing for Fiji is a better opportunity though. By taking the Fiji option he rules himself out of professional rugby in Australia straight away. He's not going to earn much playing for Fiji.

 

[Braveheart81]

I'm not sure if playing for Fiji is a better opportunity though. By taking the Fiji option he rules himself out of professional rugby in Australia straight away. He's not going to earn much playing for Fiji.

The better opportunity I was referring to was the Crusaders contract. He has a realistic chance of being in their best matchday 23 next year whereas he probably didn't have that anywhere in Australia.

 

[Quick Hands]

Still, where's the demand going to come from?

There's obviously been no demand, otherwise he'd be playing super rugby in Australia.

I still find it odd that no Aussie super side could offer him a spot. There's a lot worse players running around in some of our teams.

 

[Braveheart81]

How do we know that though? Do we definitely know that the Waratahs didn't offer him the same contract he is currently on which would be for minimal dollars and little prospect of much or any game time.

It seems that a far greater opportunity has presented itself at the Crusaders than any of the Aussie sides could have or should have offered him.

 

[Quick Hands]

The better opportunity I was referring to was the Crusaders contract. He has a realistic chance of being in their best matchday 23 next year whereas he probably didn't have that anywhere in Australia.

I agree with that.

 

[Quick Hands]

How do we know that though? Do we definitely know that the Waratahs didn't offer him the same contract he is currently on which would be for minimal dollars and little prospect of much or any game time.

It seems that a far greater opportunity has presented itself at the Crusaders than any of the Aussie sides could have or should have offered him.

We don't know what if anything the Waratahs offered him. We do know that had they wanted him, he would have received at the very least a reasonable offer.

My point is that we have a player who played a few run-on matches with the Waratahs in 2013 and 2014 and I accept that they have gone for other players rightly or wrongly for 2015 and beyond. What I find difficult to understand is that a player of his quality (which includes goal kicking) can't get a super contract in Australia, but can get one in NZ. Are we going that well?

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

I'd be a bit dismayed if the Force didn't at least contact Ben, though if he's intending to play for Fiji it changes things a bit.

 

[Braveheart81]

You're shifting the goalposts.

There is no evidence to suggest that he couldn't get a Super Rugby contract in Australia. There is clearly far greater opportunity at the Crusaders next year for someone who can play 10 and 15 than there is likely to be at any of the Australian franchises. That is where I think the difference lies.

It's not like he's abandoned Australia to play ITM Cup in the hopes of getting a fresh start in NZ and winning a Super Rugby contract next year. He's signed for the one Super Rugby team that is losing all their options in the positions he plays.

 

[Quick Hands]

You're shifting the goalposts.

There is no evidence to suggest that he couldn't get a Super Rugby contract in Australia. There is clearly far greater opportunity at the Crusaders next year for someone who can play 10 and 15 than there is likely to be at any of the Australian franchises. That is where I think the difference lies.

It's not like he's abandoned Australia to play ITM Cup in the hopes of getting a fresh start in NZ and winning a Super Rugby contract next year. He's signed for the one Super Rugby team that is losing all their options in the positions he plays.

What goal posts am I alleged to be shifting?

 

[Braveheart81]

What goal posts am I alleged to be shifting?

Saying he can't get a contract in Australia but then can in NZ.

I don't think we're comparing apples with apples here in any way.

I think he probably could get a contract here it's just the NZ offer brings far more opportunity and possibly more money than any offers he could expect in Australia next year.

I would have thought the current Waratahs contract would be the minimum Super Rugby contract and can't imagine there'd have been anything more on the table if he'd stayed.

 

[Jamie]

Maybe the guy wants to play for the Crusaders and was not keen on any other aus team. I mean when you look for a new role you look at your options and hopefully nail the one you most interested in. Volavola perhaps had no iterated in playing for the reds or the force.