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Aus vs NZ - 1st Test Sydney 17Aug2013

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Ash

Michael Lynagh (62)
Ash
I have been watching rugby for almost 40 years and I haven't heard the Highlanders called 'The Clan' before. Like I said, you must be in a special group.

Calling the Waratahs 'Tah's' is completely different. For starters NSW Rugby call themselves the Tahs. I can not recall having ever seen anyone call the Highlanders The Clan before.
Sorry if I singled you out, and to honest I couldn't even get through your original post. It may have been someone elses that referred to the others teams, but my point still stands.

Sorry, last post on this digression as we need to get back on topic.

Just from the front page of this very website:

http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/the-army-hosts-the-clan-rebels-v-highlanders-preview/

http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/brumbies-roll-the-clan-in-dunedin/

As I said, I agree with some of what you said, but if you actually look at my post (the one I am thinking of with the K/P/R stats at least) I only used "Canes", "Clan" and "Tahs".

I suggest you target your ire at the actual real questionable occurrences......you might find you are not the only one there!
 

Dan54

David Wilson (68)
Ash
I have been watching rugby for almost 40 years and I haven't heard the Highlanders called 'The Clan' before. Like I said, you must be in a special group.

.

No Bessa, they have been called the Clan quite often, especially in NZ where some of their advertising used to talk about which Clan you were from.
 

scaraby

Ron Walden (29)
The Blues = The Blues . . . damn. Can I still be in the special group??

;)
no ..The Blues used to equal the Blues whereas the Tahs equalled manic depression.......
Now the Blues and Tahs are much more bearable...a rosie hue maybe
 

lewisr

Bill McLean (32)
OK I have to say something about this. It is such a tired argument, this supposed 'double standard' regarding Quade.

Deans isn't coaching any more. Quade is playing OK. Despite what you think the majority (dare I say VAST majority) of Aussie rugby fans like Quade. So drop the 'they are all out to get us' rubbish, please.
.


I find it interesting that your entire post was concentrated solely on a 'rubbish' and 'tired' argument and yet you continue to reassert this concept that all Quade Cooper fans have a 'we're/ he's the victim' approach to arguing a case. Maybe take some advice from yourself and give it up?

If you honestly believe there isn't a double standard surrounding the Cooper Circus then I suggest you compare the amount of media attention he gets to any other rugby union player in recent times.

The double standard is there, and goes both ways. It's not just that he gets criticised for things that any other 10 would be forgiven for (ala Dan Carter with 2 charge downs in one match a few rounds ago?). But he also gets given credit for things that any professional flyhalf should be expected to achieve like making basic tackles, kicking well tactically (which he didnt do on the weekend) and throwing a half decent pass/ cut out every now and then .

There is so much controversy surrounding him that we all forget hes just another flyhalf, with a little more attacking flair and the tendency to make maybe one or two extra errors on other 10s.

I firmly believe he is our best option at 10 because there isn't anyone else who would do a better job at the moment.

The bloke is a bit of a simpleton, let's be fair, but he's also managed to become one of the most polarising figures in Aussie rugby for quite some time and everyone on here accepts that. So of course he'll be bloody analysed with double standards - from both sides!
 

FrankLind

Colin Windon (37)
Yeah, pretty rational there lewisr.

I think the best test 10 would be Lealiifano, but then you have a problem at 12.
 

Scotty

David Codey (61)
I think the criticism and analysis JOC (James O'Connor) was subjected to during the Lions series was on par with anything directed at Cooper in the past.

I agree with this but the context of the analysis was different. JOC (James O'Connor) criticism was more directed towards Deans for picking him out of position. QC (Quade Cooper) criticism is directed almost solely at him for being 'a flake'.

PS I disagree with Barbarians assertion that QC (Quade Cooper) is liked by the vast majority or even majority.
 

USARugger

John Thornett (49)
Yeah, pretty rational there lewisr.

I think the best test 10 would be Lealiifano, but then you have a problem at 12.

Still think we need to see more of him at test level first. He was incredibly quiet in terms of acting as a first-receiver during the Lions series but I've believed that this was by design for a while now.
 

Scotty

David Codey (61)
Yeah, pretty rational there lewisr.

I think the best test 10 would be Lealiifano, but then you have a problem at 12.

I agree. Would be nice to see him there for the Brums.

Plenty of 12 options - JOC (James O'Connor), Goodwin, Horne. Mainly talking end of year or next though.
 

Scoey

Tony Shaw (54)
The To'omua/Lilo 10/12 combo is pretty good though. Hard to see the Brumbies busting that one up.

Given the apparent support by many to give To'omua a shot at the Wallaby 10 jersey in the nearish future, I think allowing Lilo to work at making 12 his position would only yield good things for us nationally.
 

lewisr

Bill McLean (32)
The To'omua/Lilo 10/12 combo is pretty good though. Hard to see the Brumbies busting that one up.

Given the apparent support by many to give To'omua a shot at the Wallaby 10 jersey in the nearish future, I think allowing Lilo to work at making 12 his position would only yield good things for us nationally.


Agreed. I think To'omua will be our long term option at 10 to lead the Wobs to the next two, possibly 3 WCs. But I also want to see how Quade goes under Ewen in this years rugby championship. It's really going to be his last chance to show his merits as a test 10 before To'omua is given the nod. So if he doesn't grasp it with both hands, I think Matt will be in on the EOYT.

I still think Quade has ridiculous amounts of potential as a flyhalf to simply win games, especially alongside Genia. Unfortunately we haven't really seen him at that potential consistently since 2011 and/or a few games here and there this season. As the saying goes, high risk high return. At this stage I reckon link will be betting on the high returns and I hope it comes off. We need to beat these Kiwi bastards!
 

RedsHappy

Tony Shaw (54)
I like others would ideally like to see some considered alternative players and combos thereof played in the post-BIL 2013 Wallaby back line, not only at 10, but just as much in the centres and at 15.

However, nothing of any great substance will become clear until we appoint and gain value from the services of a top-class national backs/attack coach.

The absence of this crucial specialist competency and person (and, just as importantly, a specialist whose opinion is valued and listened to by his national coach boss) for an elite rugby team has damned the Wallabies to years of unstable and generally incoherent back line play. The crowning evidence of this truth was on display in each and every BIL Test.

A major consequence of this central problem has been the difficulty it presents in really ascertaining if visible individual player deficiencies are truly that player's own, or alternatively derive from the chaos and uncertainty for the players that results from, e.g., poor back line preparation, odd and unbalanced game plans, inadequate practice routines, low inter-player confidence in each other given changing roles and key players out of position, lack of thoroughly designed back line plays, etc.

Accordingly, I feel no confidence in my own assessment of individual Wallaby actual or potential backs until a far more competent specialist coaching capability is imposed upon the many talented backs players this country routinely creates.
 

Gurz

Allen Oxlade (6)
Agreed. I think To'omua will be our long term option at 10 to lead the Wobs to the next two, possibly 3 WCs. But I also want to see how Quade goes under Ewen in this years rugby championship. It's really going to be his last chance to show his merits as a test 10 before To'omua is given the nod. So if he doesn't grasp it with both hands, I think Matt will be in on the EOYT.

I still think Quade has ridiculous amounts of potential as a flyhalf to simply win games, especially alongside Genia. Unfortunately we haven't really seen him at that potential consistently since 2011 and/or a few games here and there this season. As the saying goes, high risk high return. At this stage I reckon link will be betting on the high returns and I hope it comes off. We need to beat these Kiwi bastards!

I tend to Agree To'omua has potential to be long term 5/8 option with solid defence and good kicking and passing game. I am a big fan of QC (Quade Cooper) and would also like to see him in the mix and used tactically against certain opponents in certain venues - something Link does very well with Reds - particularly in 2011. Bottom line is I don't think link would ever start QC (Quade Cooper) @ eden park v ABs - recipe for problems... but @ Suncorp why wouldn't you start him v ABs... considering his success v kiwis............ (only ARU has already put wallabies behind 8 ball by committing to 10 years of bledisloe in Sydney................!)

JOC (James O'Connor) has shown touches of ability @ 10 and given the opportunity to play a season there in s15 he well could get into the Wallaby mic - eg Look how far Foley has come in 12mths playing @ 10....

But JOC (James O'Connor)'s best position IMO is 15 which Aussies have plenty of depth at...

Interesting topic but really think 10 for Aussies will boil down to right player with right skills for right location.... hopefully injury/s don't prevent this from being the outcome...
 

The_Brown_Hornet

John Eales (66)
Agreed. I think To'omua will be our long term option at 10 to lead the Wobs to the next two, possibly 3 WCs. But I also want to see how Quade goes under Ewen in this years rugby championship. It's really going to be his last chance to show his merits as a test 10 before To'omua is given the nod. So if he doesn't grasp it with both hands, I think Matt will be in on the EOYT.



Totally agree with this. Link clearly wants QC (Quade Cooper) there at 10 and Quade himself almost certainly wants it too. I'd be happy to give him 2-3 games at least at 10 and see how he performs. If he ends up playing like he did in the RWC (for instance) then he's had his chance and probably done his dash. On the other hand he may play very well and reignite the backline, which is what we all want I think.

If he doesn't, there is a bloke waiting in the wings who deserves a shot at it.
 

Gurz

Allen Oxlade (6)
The bloke is a bit of a simpleton, let's be fair, but he's also managed to become one of the most polarising figures in Aussie rugby for quite some time and everyone on here accepts that. So of course he'll be bloody analysed with double standards - from both sides!


I think you'll find hes not really a simpleton - just a young bloke thats prone to stating honest, speak your mind, kind of statements not always aware of media's twists and turns... Additionally hes obviously a good competitor who else in recent history (since tuquiri) has taken it to Mc(cheat)caw in such the same way - I respect this and credit to him for being like this in a world of deceit and political correctness ...

Furthermore his 'game-brain' is easily one of the best in the world and his quick thinking on the field is what has created so much success for him and his team/s.

I personally think his long kicking game (moreso than defence even) is his biggest challenge... He doesn't seem to get the distance on his punts - more like a 7 iron than a driver to borrow the golf analogy....
 

FrankLind

Colin Windon (37)
Additionally hes obviously a good competitor who else in recent history (since tuquiri) has taken it to Mc(cheat)caw in such the same way - I respect this and credit to him for being like this in a world of deceit and political correctness .


Thanks for the laugh. One of the funnier things I have read in a while.
 

Pusser

Larry Dwyer (12)
I Additionally hes obviously a good competitor who else in recent history (since tuquiri) has taken it to Mc(cheat)caw in such the same way - I respect this and credit to him for being like this in a world of deceit and political correctness .
Not sure dropping a knee in or cheap shots from behind counts as good competition.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 

The_Brown_Hornet

John Eales (66)
Who the best 10 is genberally depends on the players around him - particularly to give him "time and space"


Half agree. A great 10 can't make an ordinary backline world beaters, but a terrible one can make a team of super stars pretty ordinary. JOC (James O'Connor) is a classic example in that he had a bunch of (for mine) very talented players around him and he didn't bring them into the game enough. QC (Quade Cooper) is considerably better in that regard. He may or may not be the long term answer but he's better than the incumbent in that position.
 

Scotty

David Codey (61)
I agree with the other poster about Coopers kicking being his biggest issue. I have said it before as well.

His defense has improved but his defensive kicking is still very weak. I would be using him as the second option for defensive kicks, with Mogg as the first from fullback, similar to what Latham and Burke used to do for Larkham a lot.

Coopers attacking kicking on the other hand is very good. Folau will be licking his lips at the prospect of a few pin point cross kicks.
 
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