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tranquility
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Good point, and even better word.
2012 Rugby Championship Round 3 Game 1 Australia vs South Africa - 8 Sep
- Thread starter Hugh Jarse
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Good point, and even better word.
Mank
Ted Thorn (20)
My meaning is that this sort of incident doesn't really faze most South Africans, if it was in the Currie Cup it probably would have been laughed off by players and fans. But Australia take a much dimmer view of incidents like this.
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
And what about the Boks after the Perth test match?
They had some promising players coming through in Super Rugby this year; guys like M. Coetzee of the Sharks, J. Goosen of the Cheetahs and J.Kruger of the Bulls, who did not impress me as being Bok material when he played for Northampton by the way, but he does now. However Boks fans knew that replacing Matfiled, Bakkies, du Preez and the injured Burger would be difficult, and that J. Fourie and J. Smith had gone with the wind.
The Boks played some good and bad rugby against England and were poor in Mendoza, not that we expect the Wobs to do much better over there.
In Perth they were ordinary against Oz, an ordinary team this year apart from hanging on a couple of times against Wales, and it's almost as surprising that they are 3rd ranked in the world as it is that Oz is 2nd.
There is nothing wrong in winning rugby games with traditional Bok laager rugby: after all, bash, barge and kick suits their nature, always has; but to do that you need your goal kicker to kick his goals.
M. Steyn had several lapses in goal kicking in Super Rugby this year, finishing just a click above the tournament average of 76%. Goosen finished on 86%. Steyn has missed some important goal kicks in test matches this year also, including droppies.
Apart from his kicking Steyn would be fortunate to be picked in a Sydney 1st Grade team. Therefore Goosen should start. He can play as flat as a shadow and whilst that may need some adjustment from the other backs, it will get rewards.
He won't be able to work miracles: the Bok backline had problems nothing to do with a 10. They had 2 or 3 opportunuities in the Oz 22 and JdV must have been appalled by the options his players took, especially running back inside where the tacklers were.
Nor could their big bopper ball runners bend the Oz tackle line too much; yet the Oz boppers could, vice versa: Higginbotham's try was too easy and Alexander should have been stopped before he scored.
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They had some promising players coming through in Super Rugby this year; guys like M. Coetzee of the Sharks, J. Goosen of the Cheetahs and J.Kruger of the Bulls, who did not impress me as being Bok material when he played for Northampton by the way, but he does now. However Boks fans knew that replacing Matfiled, Bakkies, du Preez and the injured Burger would be difficult, and that J. Fourie and J. Smith had gone with the wind.
The Boks played some good and bad rugby against England and were poor in Mendoza, not that we expect the Wobs to do much better over there.
In Perth they were ordinary against Oz, an ordinary team this year apart from hanging on a couple of times against Wales, and it's almost as surprising that they are 3rd ranked in the world as it is that Oz is 2nd.
There is nothing wrong in winning rugby games with traditional Bok laager rugby: after all, bash, barge and kick suits their nature, always has; but to do that you need your goal kicker to kick his goals.
M. Steyn had several lapses in goal kicking in Super Rugby this year, finishing just a click above the tournament average of 76%. Goosen finished on 86%. Steyn has missed some important goal kicks in test matches this year also, including droppies.
Apart from his kicking Steyn would be fortunate to be picked in a Sydney 1st Grade team. Therefore Goosen should start. He can play as flat as a shadow and whilst that may need some adjustment from the other backs, it will get rewards.
He won't be able to work miracles: the Bok backline had problems nothing to do with a 10. They had 2 or 3 opportunuities in the Oz 22 and JdV must have been appalled by the options his players took, especially running back inside where the tacklers were.
Nor could their big bopper ball runners bend the Oz tackle line too much; yet the Oz boppers could, vice versa: Higginbotham's try was too easy and Alexander should have been stopped before he scored.
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mark_s
Chilla Wilson (44)
I only watched the second half of the game, and the TV was on mute. I thought Aus played pretty well. Still need to work on decision making and execution , but there was plenty of determination and effort this week. Higgers looked good off the bench, I think the impact player role might be is best spot, especially since he can cover 6 or 8. Did anyone see if Aus threw to timani this week give comments on the first two bledisloes?
The thing thats odd to me is that the Wallabies seem to expect a physical tough game against the boks and, in recent years, have generally stood up to it pretty well. Yet the All Blacks seem to be able to dominate us physically with relative ease and we seem to want to take short cuts.
The thing thats odd to me is that the Wallabies seem to expect a physical tough game against the boks and, in recent years, have generally stood up to it pretty well. Yet the All Blacks seem to be able to dominate us physically with relative ease and we seem to want to take short cuts.
bryce
Darby Loudon (17)
you're right about that -I also find this perplexing. I also struggle to understand why we seem to have had the wood on South Africa recently - who are a big, physical team who like to win the game by dominating the collisions, rucks and set pieces and by having a good kicking game. Yet we have lost our last two games against England and we lost to Ireland at the world cup - both teams who seem to take a similar approach, and yet who seem to be outmuscled by South Africa when they play them.
Penguin
John Solomon (38)
agreed, you can understand why some of our Bok supporters are up in arms.
if it was an Aus player there would have been 50 pages of vitriol by now
Ignoto
Peter Sullivan (51)
I've got no sympathy for Etzebeth or the Boks Supporters. It's pretty simple, don't do that shit. Why tempt fate? There's a history of bok players doing this stupid niggly crap, simply cut it out and you wont be sitting with the spectators.
A two week ban means he only misses one TRC game.
From memory, Cooper was cited for the knee to the head and it was considered accidental or incidental to him getting up off the ground.
aeneas
Tom Lawton (22)
I have long thought that sadly for the Boks their past transgressions since their re-introduction to rugby have weighed heavily on any player that gets cited. Going all the way back to Johan Le Roux infamous bite of Sean Fitzpatrick, and Bakkes Botha to pick two, their players have gone far past the bounds of acceptable behaviour. Other players get tarred by that brush.
Athilnaur
Arch Winning (36)
I expect the issue is it was an overt act that brings the game into disrepute. Rugby wants to be seen as family friendly in order to have a future. Head butts, even faux ones, are not meeting that standard.
For me a penalty would have been sufficient, or a censure post match, assuming no prior form but I understand the pressures at play to keep (make?) the game clean.
For me a penalty would have been sufficient, or a censure post match, assuming no prior form but I understand the pressures at play to keep (make?) the game clean.
Maybe Etsebeth should have claimed he was leaning in for the kiss and Sharpie's massive forehead and headgear got in his way so it looked like a headbutt.
BPC
Phil Hardcastle (33)
Maybe Etsebeth did claim that and was given two weeks because the judiciary assumed it was the Godfather-style kiss of death.
W
What2040
Guest
agree and love the Bokkie contribution to the site
BPC
Phil Hardcastle (33)
I am a bit torn personally. On one hand, it was ineffectual and Sharpe did mug for the penalty a fair bit (not as bad as some players). To paraphrase Tana, they weren't there to play tiddlywinks.
On the other hand, it was a headbutt however weak and that shit has no place in the game.
I can understand a short suspension to say to Etsebeth: it wasn't that bad but you were this close (holds fingers up) to something stupid so think a bit next time. That said, I think a penalty or at most a yellow card would have been appropriate with a strong caution by the judiciary and a statement that it would go on his record if he fronted the judiciary again.
On the other hand, it was a headbutt however weak and that shit has no place in the game.
I can understand a short suspension to say to Etsebeth: it wasn't that bad but you were this close (holds fingers up) to something stupid so think a bit next time. That said, I think a penalty or at most a yellow card would have been appropriate with a strong caution by the judiciary and a statement that it would go on his record if he fronted the judiciary again.
Hawko
Tony Shaw (54)
Sharpie saw his role last saturday as the old, cranky, smart arse bull who was looking to rile up the younger SA bulls on the paddock. It only half worked because Sharpie is not the subtlest of individuals. There are a few retired NZ forwards who could teach him a thing or two about doing it successfully without becoming a penalty magnet, which he was all day. But in the cauldron that is test rugby, Etsebeth got agitated and now has a match off. Its a not-too-expensive lesson that he will learn a lot from. If he had connected he would have got six matches.
If playing for NZ, Sharpe would have been widely applauded for his effective niggle. In Australia we are probably a bit more ambivalent, we like to think we don't indulge in skullduggery (despite our cricketers being masterclass sledgers). In SA subtlety is not highly rated, hence their nothing-in-it reaction. Interesting to watch the collison of cultures as well as the collison of bodies.
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