2012 Rugby Championship Game 1 Australia vs New Zealand - 18 August

[gel]

Whats to learn?
Israel Dagg has more toe than a roman sandal and if you dont watch the ball there's a good chance you'll drop it?

Thank you for not reading the first paragraph in my post, but I really appreciate your efforts to just be blatantly argumentative...

 

[tooms]

Yeah, Rolland is the classic NH pedant. Just blows too much and ruins the flow of the game.

Classic example was the penalty against Genia for advancing too early from the 10m at the lineout. An action that had absolutely no effect on the game at all. You can argue that it's illegal and a penalty is a penalty. But the role of a rugby referee isn't to blow a penalty every time he sees an offence, it is to facilitate a free-flowing game that is good to watch. Rolland fails at that more often than not.
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That's a pretty fair assesment, but I think his biggest fault was thew breakdown.

He knocked off the attacking team on a number of occasions when there was opportunity to penalise the actions of the defending side. These kinds of 50/50 calls were supposed to go the way of the attacking team under the changes to the interpretations of the law made last year. Those attacking penalties probably disrupted the game more than anything.

Having said that, he blew something like 16 penalties before the 20 minute mark of the game... Someone should have been in the bin .. .Heck 6 penalties in 5 minutes should trigger a chat to the capatains at the least.

 

[Braveheart81]

A couple of questions

Why are we bothering to talk about width and the backs when we aren't getting forward momentum?

The Wobs for the last three years have struggled to get forward momentum against the better sides. We go one out and do little.

I don't get it either.

We got smashed in the forwards and that is why we lost the game. I don't think any combination of backs would have made a substantial difference.

 

[Richo]

At least he was pedantic for both sides. Certainly didn't add to the spectacle... And that needed all the help it could get.

 

[Richo]

I don't get it either.

We got smashed in the forwards and that is why we lost the game. I don't think any combination of backs would have made a substantial difference.

Definitely the most frustrating part of the game was watching the forwards realign so fucking slowly. We never strung together quick, tight phases that set the ABs on the back foot.

 

[Braveheart81]

I just don't understand why we take so long for our forwards to realign and then they get the ball completely stationary at which time the defence is already ahead of the gain line and we are going backwards. It then takes forever for us to get aligned again ready for another ruck.

Why don't we have players running onto the ball and more pick-and-go? The only way the slow realignment can possibly work is if you have a couple of pods, you get quick ball from each to suck in the majority of their forwards and then you spread the ball wide.

If there is no plan to clear the ball quickly then there is zero point of spending so much time realigning the forwards to take a hit up.

 

[Karl]

We need to deal with some important issues that have been raised and ignored in this thread.

Making noise and booing when a goal is being attempted is juvenile and bad sportsmanship. Ground announcers should be saying something like "Righto people, calm it down and act like grown ups. Have a lite respect and Quiet for the kick. Any boofhead who pipes up is a twit."

Someone needs to install a device into the shorts of the forwards that enables a small but strategically placed charge of about 9volts to be triggered when they are caught walking to breakdowns or failing to realign in a timely fashion. Maybe they're just forgetful, not fat, unfit and lazy.

Lastly, they DELIBERATELY use the shit train carriages on game day when they know they are going to get hammered by a bunch of dirty Kiwis.

 

[Paradox]

He stands as deep as it takes to get space relative to the speed of delivery of the ball. Problem is the ball comes slow he gets caught behind the advantage line. Cooper gets slow ball at test level, plays flat and force his hand creating errors. It's just more proof that we need to do better up front before we worry about the backs at all.

Totally agree with the problems up front (see earlier post on issues at breakdown) but Barnes is still inclined to stand deep and has an inconsistent long passing game.

 

[Paradox]

The Wobs for the last three years have struggled to get forward momentum against the better sides.

Try 10-11 years. We were just lucky the likes of Gregan and Larkham could still utilise crap ball.

 

[Bowside]

I've said it many times before, the forwards feed off momentum created by the backs. It's how the reds can win games with an 'inferior' pack.

We need blokes who can capitalise on opportunity and direct the play in the backline, not guys who sit back in the pocket and play the game 10 metres behind the gameline.

 

[Braveheart81]

I've said it many times before, the forwards feed off momentum created by the backs. It's how the reds can win games with an 'inferior' pack.

We need blokes who can capitalise on opportunity and direct the play in the backline, not guys who sit back in the pocket and play the game 10 metres behind the gameline.

This argument is brought up alot.

I think the reality is that test rugby is a lot tougher and tighter than Super Rugby.

I don't think the same tactics necessarily work. I think it is far more difficult for the backs to make metres in test rugby against the World's best team and harder for our forwards to make the advantage line.

 

[fatprop]

I've said it many times before, the forwards feed off momentum created by the backs. It's how the reds can win games with an 'inferior' pack.

We need blokes who can capitalise on opportunity and direct the play in the backline, not guys who sit back in the pocket and play the game 10 metres behind the gameline.

Really?

The Reds don't send it to Cooper until the forwards get some quick ball

We got stuff all quick ball for 80 minutes on Saturday

 

[Scotty]

A couple of questions

Why are we bothering to talk about width and the backs when we aren't getting forward momentum?

The Wobs for the last three years have struggled to get forward momentum against the better sides. We go one out and do little.

So why not emulate the Boks, England and now the Brumbies and revert to the pod system?

I'd rather use the Reds method of multiple tight runners and Genia keeping them honest. Maybe the odd pod on slow ball.

 

[chequebalance]

What said it all for me was Beale laughing with SBW and a few other kiwis after the game. Not saying he can't have a bad game and move on but if it was me I would be inconsolable directly afterwards. Our complete lack of emotion when we lose says to me they don't care. Maybe this is just how it is in the age of professional rugby..

 

[chasmac]

Agree with most posters that the problem started in the forwards with their lack of mongrel.
What happened to the AB prop that got the rib injury?
If it was due to Ben Robinson's work in the scrum then that is a huge scalp for a front rower.
I thought our set play was good, the referee took the contest out of the scrums though.
The AB gameplan to use their centres as decoys was coaching at its best. Good plan, well executed resulted in 14 points.
The Wallaby gameplan and execution does not ask any questions of the opposition. Not once did the AB's look as if the game wasn't in hand, they were not taken out of their comfort zone.
The Wallabies play like the NSW state of origin team. Plenty of individually talented players who try hard. The Wallabies lack the coaching to perform as a team, its painful to watch.

 

[Bowside]

This argument is brought up alot.

I think the reality is that test rugby is a lot tougher and tighter than Super Rugby.

I don't think the same tactics necessarily work. I think it is far more difficult for the backs to make metres in test rugby against the World's best team and harder for our forwards to make the advantage line.

While it is no doubt tougher, I think it can and does still work but australia just are not a good enough team to make it work at the moment.

Fatprop: the reds dont send it to cooper to run until the forwards get quick ball. But when the forwards are struggling cooper starts to kick more as the reds have a superior lineout to most teams and this gives the pack an opportunity to regain parity.

They do a lot of their attacking off line outs for this reason.

 

[Braveheart81]

Our lineout went well on Saturday night.

New Zealand's is awesome though. They still haven't lost a lineout on their own through this year. Hard to put pressure on them in that phase of the game when their lineout is performing so well.

 

[Schadenfreude]

Our lineout went well on Saturday night.

New Zealand's is awesome though. They still haven't lost a lineout on their own through this year. Hard to put pressure on them in that phase of the game when their lineout is performing so well.

It's even harder to pressure them if we don't contest.

 

[Bowside]

Yeah I thought our line out didn't go too badly, but I would have liked to see it going to the back a bit more (wind permitting) and also maybe the odd trick play throwing it to one of the front lifters or back to the hooker coming round the corner.

We defended their lineout pretty badly. A couple of times it was just absolute laziness from our pack, train-wreck-in-slow-motion stuff.

 

[Braveheart81]

We defended their lineout pretty badly. A couple of times it was just absolute laziness from our pack, train-wreck-in-slow-motion stuff.

Our forwards did lots of things in slow motion on Saturday night.