2012 Rugby Championship Game 1 Australia vs New Zealand - 18 August

[Slim 293]

I'm not blaming him for the loss, but he certainly contributed......

How many times did he blow an attacking opportunity by kicking the ball back to the AB back 3?

And then there were times when he should've kicked it inside the 22m but instead decided to put his outside backs under pressure with a lousy pass.........

He just didn't cut it.........

 

[waratahjesus]

Barnes played as well as he could (place kicking was great under pressure) but he's not a 10. He has never had a great passing game and he stands super deep. However, I would like to see him at 12 with Cooper at 10.

He stands as deep as it takes to get space relative to the speed of delivery of the ball. Problem is the ball comes slow he gets caught behind the advantage line. Cooper gets slow ball at test level, plays flat and force his hand creating errors. It's just more proof that we need to do better up front before we worry about the backs at all.

Agree we need to play Barnes and cooper as we need a combo of there skills that neither one possesses on his own.

 

[Ash]

Like I wrote earlier, look at the work of the tight forwards and the lack of real impact and consistency and that is the reason Higgers is not able to play loose. I don't doubt that if the likes of Kepu, TPN, Timani were getting stuck in to secure ball that Higgers would have more opportunities to run the ball.

McCaw and Read and even last night Messam get those opportunities because guys like Owen Franks, Woodcock, Mealamu and Sam Whitelock are rarely shirking from the collisions.

Whitelock from a tight forwards perspective was immense again last night as he was vs Ireland earlier this year. He has a huge motor and his fitness excellent.

Agree. I'd take the entire front row from the ABs twice over before ours last night.

One of the hallmarks of the Wallabies in recent history was struggling in the scrum but the front row would really get around the field. Last night we did neither.

The other difference was the speed of the ABs pack. On defence off the line, getting to rucks, and supporting the ball carrier. You can't fault Genia for waiting when he has no options as no forwards are ready for the ball, yet somehow only a few are at the ruck.

Combination of lazy forwards and seemingly lack of tactics (highlighted in Scott's video vs Wales) for alignment in multiple phases.

 

[Richo]

Combination of lazy forwards and seemingly lack of tactics (highlighted in Scott's video vs Wales) for alignment in multiple phases.

Watched for this after Scott's video. Exactly the same bunching evident, I thought.

 

[Ghibli]

Ben Alexander should be nowhere near the test team until he learns to scrummage. I don't care how good he is around the paddock.

Bit hard after 40 wallaby caps on the wing.......

 

[badabing59]

Bit hard after 40 wallaby caps on the wing...

Comment of the thread!

 

[Inside Shoulder]

So all the lead up work and decoy running and scrum work was pinning our hopes on the brilliance of Dagg. Not sure I agree...

no I think it's a reflection of your midfield not really doing much.
The absence of Conrad smith, IMO, is the real explanation.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Inside Shoulder]

He stands as deep as it takes to get space relative to the speed of delivery of the ball. Problem is the ball comes slow he gets caught behind the advantage line. Cooper gets slow ball at test level, plays flat and force his hand creating errors. It's just more proof that we need to do better up front before we worry about the backs at all.

Agree we need to play Barnes and cooper as we need a combo of there skills that neither one possesses on his own.

it must be true that if we picked, assuming we can, 5 tight forwards who could do the hardwork we could live with any backrow and 5/8 Deans cared to pick

 

[waratahjesus]

it must be true that if we picked, assuming we can, 5 tight forwards who could do the hardwork we could live with any backrow and 5/8 Deans cared to pick

Nice work.
We could probably run a fan contest for no8. Have a run on with the wallabies. You enter by buying beef medallions at Coles and texting the barcode.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Nice work.
We could probably run a fan contest for no8. Have a run on with the wallabies. You enter by buying beef medallions at Coles and texting the barcode.

fine - but who is the tight 5 that does the hardwork.......oh yeah - we dont have anyone

 

[Scotty]

I love that Barnes is the scapegoat du jour. What rubbish. The game was lost up front and, at any rate, he was far from the worst back. Beale, Fainga'a and AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) were all poor. Genia was bad early, then improved but was way too slow at the base of the ruck. Part of that was realignment but part of it was also simple indecisiveness.

I think the unfortunate reality is that we were simply beaten across the park. Aside from Sharpe and Digby, I don't think a single Wallaby outplayed their opposite number.

I'm not sure what - if any - changes will really turn things around. Quade to 10 and BB to 12, sure, but that doesn't address 1-8. With the injuries to key cattle, and players like Robbo out of form, we just don't have the depth necessary to put any real pressure on the All Blacks.

No one said we lost because of Barnes, we are just saying 'I told you so' when it came to the lack of width and lack of spark that exists when Barnes is at 10.

 

[Scotty]

fine - but who is the tight 5 that does the hardwork...oh yeah - we dont have anyone

I'd take a shit scrum before a shit breakdown performance. Robinson and timani appear to be there for the scrum. Swap for slipper and simmons/Douglas.

 

[fatprop]

My thoughts on Rolland is that if everyone reffed like that rugby would be much better for it.

Roland ensured there was no flow for either side. Both sides were off side for most of the game.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I'd take a shit scrum before a shit breakdown performance. Robinson and timani appear to be there for the scrum. Swap for slipper and simmons/Douglas.

That may be right but i havent noticed that we get to choose lately which it will be or whether we get the quinella

 

[fatprop]

No one said we lost because of Barnes, we are just saying 'I told you so' when it came to the lack of width and lack of spark that exists when Barnes is at 10.

There was plenty of width, just no go forward before we went wide. When Barnes got front foot ball we looked OK. The two or three times that our forwards got some momentum

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2

 

[gel]

I really hope Beale takes note of how he played last night. The last two years he has been very critical of his team mates on field after they have stuffed something up - it has been really shit to watch actually. Not good team mate behaviour at all from him.

Well, he now has a pretty good personal reference point he can draw on in future when someone else stuffs up.

I am betting he won't learn at all though.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I really hope Beale takes note of how he played last night. The last two years he has been very critical of his team mates on field after they have stuffed something up - it has been really shit to watch actually. Not good team mate behaviour at all from him.

Well, he now has a pretty good personal reference point he can draw on in future when someone else stuffs up.

I am betting he won't learn at all though.

Whats to learn?
Israel Dagg has more toe than a roman sandal and if you dont watch the ball there's a good chance you'll drop it?

 

[FrankLind]

But why should he have to "stay tight". He is a loose forward after all..

As an 8, at least in NZ, there is the thinking you have to be prepared to do up-the-guts grunt work. Kieran Read is also very good in the loose, but it doesn't mean he is not expected to get into the tight work as well.

 

[barbarian]

Roland ensured there was no flow for either side. Both sides were off side for most of the game.

Yeah, Rolland is the classic NH pedant. Just blows too much and ruins the flow of the game.

Classic example was the penalty against Genia for advancing too early from the 10m at the lineout. An action that had absolutely no effect on the game at all. You can argue that it's illegal and a penalty is a penalty. But the role of a rugby referee isn't to blow a penalty every time he sees an offence, it is to facilitate a free-flowing game that is good to watch. Rolland fails at that more often than not.
.

 

[fatprop]

A couple of questions

Why are we bothering to talk about width and the backs when we aren't getting forward momentum?

The Wobs for the last three years have struggled to get forward momentum against the better sides. We go one out and do little.

So why not emulate the Boks, England and now the Brumbies and revert to the pod system?