Where to for Twiggy Rugby?

[Rugbynutter39]

But we will just end up creating our own game which no one else plays. If I want to do that I'll watch AFL thanks. That said, I am ok with time limits on scrums, lineouts, penalties and stuff like that, but 10 point tries and drop goals being worth different points based on where they are kicked from?

Variations I guess within reason but look at all the different formats of cricket played that seems to have supported the growth of rather than harm cricket in Australia. Big bash as case in point designed as entertainment product for the fans.


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[James Pettifer]

They are simply building the infrastructure for a competition.
The exact makeup and look will be achieved through trial and analysis.
They don't have a crystal ball it could end up being very different to what any of us think.
But I'm very confident that is will be successful regardless of what the final shape is.

Really depends on your definition of success (and also how much money Twiggy is going to invest). What is proposed for this year will keep rugby in a better position in WA over 2018 and thus is at least a partial success already.

 

[Killer]

Really depends on your definition of success (and also how much money Twiggy is going to invest). What is proposed for this year will keep rugby in a better position in WA over 2018 and thus is at least a partial success already.

He has put his reputation on the line here, thus I think his upper limit will be far more than we think.
So far he has mentioned an allocation of 200m for the IPRC.
My definition of success is that longer term his comp will be the pre eminent or equal comp in the Asia/Oceania regions.

 

[wamberal]

Very difficult to make this happen just with a big chequebook.


For starters, his comp has to demonstrate a high degree of stability from year to year. That implies that the teams that take part in it will not change from one year to the next. Ditto for venues.


Will the Crusaders, for example, be a permanent fixture?



Not every match in any competition will be competitive, but most matches have to be competitive. I wonder how competitive Hong Kong, for example, will be. To have the name, there have to be some locally based players, I doubt that there are any residents who can can play elite rugby.


I could go on. World Series Cricket was a success because Packer's money bought a ready made Test level competition. Oh, and Packer owned the top rating television network at the time.

 

[Killer]

Very difficult to make this happen just with a big chequebook.


For starters, his comp has to demonstrate a high degree of stability from year to year. That implies that the teams that take part in it will not change from one year to the next. Ditto for venues.


Will the Crusaders, for example, be a permanent fixture?



Not every match in any competition will be competitive, but most matches have to be competitive. I wonder how competitive Hong Kong, for example, will be. To have the name, there have to be some locally based players, I doubt that there are any residents who can can play elite rugby.


I could go on. World Series Cricket was a success because Packer's money bought a ready made Test level competition. Oh, and Packer owned the top rating television network at the time.

You have no idea, as I don't, what the final shape of the comp will be. Super rugby could be included, who know's.
Ref the Crusaders, their group has a progressive mindset, they seem to be early adopters of any innovations or new comps eg Seattle Seawolves.
Teams and perhaps countries like NZ with a progressive mindset will jump at any opportunities as they arise.
Sadly RA is currently not capable of progressive thinking, they live in fear of change.

 

[Dan54]

You have no idea, as I don't, what the final shape of the comp will be. Super rugby could be included, who know's.
Ref the Crusaders, their group has a progressive mindset, they seem to be early adopters of any innovations or new comps eg Seattle Seawolves.
Teams and perhaps countries like NZ with a progressive mindset will jump at any opportunities as they arise.
Sadly RA is currently not capable of progressive thinking, they live in fear of change.

Well as I said earlier I hope it works and will only work if they play Rugby under the same Laws as present, not some hodge podge set made up to what they think a few people may want......this month.
But if it did work, would be interested to see if they could talk someone like Crusaders putting their second team in, which I think would still be quite close to top of the pile that they have got. Just kind of thinking out loud or on net..

 

[Brumby Runner]

Variations I guess within reason but look at all the different formats of cricket played that seems to have supported the growth of rather than harm cricket in Australia. Big bash as case in point designed as entertainment product for the fans.


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No matter the format of cricket being played, the scoring shots are still worth the same across the formats. The RWC and IPRC will simply have to retain the same scoring system to have any relevance. Certainly, they should look at options to speed up play, reduce stoppages and keep the ball in play for longer periods, but the scoring must be sacrosanct.

One option to keep the ball in play longer could be to eliminate the kick out on the full from inside the 22m law. If all kicks in general play that find touch on the full resulted in a lineout where the ball was kicked and throw to the opposition, then there will be a shift in the momentum of the game, similar to when those out side the 22m were changed many years ago.

 

[brokendown]

the scoring system in rugby has changed over the years--used to be 3 points for a try,now 5-this is just an extension on that,but in this instance I think that play must originate within your own 22 to get the 10 points

 

[Brumby Runner]

My point is that neither the WRC nor the IPRC should introduce a different point scoring system to the one used internationally. It would only serve to build a gap between them and rugby proper and would compromise the chances of any of the participants being selected for higher honours.

I have no issue with a change to the system per se, but it must be in concert with World Rugby and Rugby Australia. One change I could easily live with would be to reduce all goals, penalties and drop goals, in value to 2 to align with conversions.

 

[Slim 293]

As this "World Series" is just an exhibition series for the Force to get some games in against some fringe squads I don't think the experimental points system is such a big deal.........

Certainly for the IPRC it would be preferable to stick with normal scoring.

 

[Wilson]

Also worth noting that law variations have to be approved by world rugby. Not sure if there's anymore appetite for the try value changes at the moment, though there are still some in place in the varsity cup. I believe world rugby will be a bit tighter on what they'll allow a professional competition to change.

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[ForceFan]

Very difficult to make this happen just with a big chequebook.


For starters, his comp has to demonstrate a high degree of stability from year to year. That implies that the teams that take part in it will not change from one year to the next. Ditto for venues.

My personal view is that there will be no rule changes as the intention is to play rugby and one-off games is not the place to test new rules. Leave that for the WSR/IPRC.

It's been said many times but let's try it just once more.....(and I've typed this very slowly for you Wamberal).

What's happening in 2018 IS NOT what Andrew Forrest is referring to as WSR/IPRC which begins in 2019.

2018 is an interim year for the new Western Force.

The Western Force IS NOT playing in a comp/competition - it's just playing against a number of teams which have been invited to come to Perth to play rugby. With that invite comes some $$ payments to each team.
This will enable the WF to get ready for the NRC and prepare the team for 2019.

There is nothing to say that these teams will even be part of WSR/IPRC - just the teams that the WF is playing THIS year.

Details re WSR/IPRC will be available later this year as the first game is still 12 months away.

There'll be plenty of time for you to continue to heap scorn on WSR/IPRC after the details are known.

Andrew Forrest has done a lot to maintain a pathway to professional rugby in WA.
Rugby Australia has done nothing to do the same.
So far the best RA has to offer WA is a "super-charged" NRC (which is mostly for amateur players) - but have yet to provide any details of how this is being achieved (especially from where the $$s are coming).

 

[Inside Shoulder]

As this "World Series" is just an exhibition series for the Force to get some games in against some fringe squads I don't think the experimental points system is such a big deal...

Certainly for the IPRC it would be preferable to stick with normal scoring.

So ....i lost track of this.
I read deegan wascplayng for he force: is the proposal for a comp or merely exhibition games?

 

[kiap]

So ..i lost track of this.
I read deegan wascplayng for he force: is the proposal for a comp or merely exhibition games?

Yeah, Deegan signed. At this stage the proposal is for a schedule of 2018 exhibition games followed by the NRC. Then the new comp in 2019.

According to Wayne Smith in the Australian a few days back, the "awkwardly named" Indo-Pacific Rugby Championship (IPRC) for 2019 will now be named World Series Rugby (WSR).

But it seems the 2018 exhibition games will also be branded WSR - as a dry run for proposed the 6-team comp in 2019.

The rules variation thing is being considered; it's not yet decided/announced. So they're looking at things like (a) immediate penalties rather than order a scrum reset, (b) lineout form ups be put on the clock, and (c) point incentives for long-range tries ...

 

[fatprop]

OK, now this "Asian rugby market" stuff

Does anyone actually believe there is a viable market and any public interest?

To me, it is a couple of expats and fringe dwellers outside of Japan

Now I would love it to be different, but can we have some reality here?

Where is this "market" Hong Kong? Singapore? Malaysia? Thailand? Korea?

 

[Boof1050]

Fatty I was reading a while back that in China rugby has been made the official game for the defence forces. So potentially there's a fairly big audience there and with one of the richest men in the world (Jack Ma) on board as well. Malaysia has massive rugby following as well. Potentially a shit load more in those 2 than Melbourne or Sydney will produce in a sitting.

 

[wamberal]

Fatty I was reading a while back that in China rugby has been made the official game for the defence forces. So potentially there's a fairly big audience there and with one of the richest men in the world (Jack Ma) on board as well. Malaysia has massive rugby following as well. Potentially a shit load more in those 2 than Melbourne or Sydney will produce in a sitting.

I wish I had a dollar for every time I heard somebody talking about how much potential there is in China for just about anything.


This stuff about the PLA taking up rugby has been trotted out so many times that it could get a run at Harold Park. Or could have when the red hots were a thing.


Malaysia has a massive rugby following? Could we have some links, or actual facts, puhlease?

 

[Rebels3]

Can we all at least agree, Force fans and us East Coast elitists that the name World Series Rugby is corny and horrendous. IPRC i thought was fine and would resonate with the potential audience much better. Asian-Pacific Championship would be considerably better. Sound like an option on a video game that failed to get licensing for competitions and teams

 

[Braveheart81]

The problem with calling something World Series Rugby is that unless it is of a very high standard it looks kind of ridiculous.

World Series Cricket worked because it involved all the best cricketers in the world.

 

[fatprop]

Fatty I was reading a while back that in China rugby has been made the official game for the defence forces. So potentially there's a fairly big audience there and with one of the richest men in the world (Jack Ma) on board as well. Malaysia has massive rugby following as well. Potentially a shit load more in those 2 than Melbourne or Sydney will produce in a sitting.

Really? in my 5 or so visits to Malaysia I have never seen any evidence of that at all