Where to for Super Rugby?

[Strewthcobber]

Those viewing figures posted above really do show why RA is so reluctant to leave Super Rugby though, for all the flaws in that stance.

50m viewers for the year, of which we contributed around 5m
10% of the viewers and we get 1/3 of the money (approx obviously). It's a great deal for us - while that TV money is there.

 

[Braveheart81]

OK so lets for a second assume we are running back Super Rugby in 2020 and beyond, in the current format.

What can SANZAAR do to bring back fans?

I think the best option could be a leaf out of the Twiggy playbook, and going with rule variations.

Super Rugby's initial appeal was the style. It was rugby unleashed, emphasising open, running play with tries and action aplenty. Now we can debate how much the 2018 version is different to that, but in the minds of the fans it's stale.

So I'd be looking at scrum clocks, less stoppages, a directive to refs to play on and cut down TMO interjections, maybe reinstating a 4/5/6 try BP on top of the existing 3+ tries BP.

We can then rebrand Super as better, faster, stronger etc.

It's not ideal, but it might be the best option available.
.

I agree that some changes to fix up some perceived issues is a good idea.

The reality is that Super Rugby offers generally high quality rugby with lots of tries and attacking play.

Stop the clock for scrum resets and shots at goal. These are two of the things people complain about the most and can be fixed without actually changing the game in any way. A scrum shot clock is also fine. Even if it doesn't really speed up scrums, it helps give the perception it is.

Come up with a solid plan regarding TMO, yellow and red cards (needs World Rugby's involvement too) and judiciary. Communicate it clearly to both referees and fans so that practice guidelines are well understood.

I don't think any experimental laws are really needed. Keep the game itself as it is. Teams are playing attacking rugby and high skilled teams that score lots of tries are dominating the comp.

 

[Strewthcobber]

maybe reinstating a 4/5/6 try BP on top of the existing 3+ tries BP.

The 3+ try bonus point system has coincided with the cratering in support across the competition.

Now correlation doesn't equal causation but it's worth a think

 

[Rebels3]

Something clearly needs to be done, Super Rugby isn't what it should be but i believe its got to the stage where the biggest issue in the game is quickly becoming the fans itself. We bemoan everything and anything, sometimes i don't even think we understand what we are whinging about, it has just come to a point where it's the thing to do. Rhetoric has been written that everything is bad/terrible/shocking that even when it isn't at times, people are too stubborn or blinded to want to think anything different.

The ground swell of negativity has become a habit.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

OK so lets for a second assume we are running back Super Rugby in 2020 and beyond, in the current format.

What can SANZAAR do to bring back fans?

I think the best option could be a leaf out of the Twiggy playbook, and going with rule variations.

Super Rugby's initial appeal was the style. It was rugby unleashed, emphasising open, running play with tries and action aplenty. Now we can debate how much the 2018 version is different to that, but in the minds of the fans it's stale.

So I'd be looking at scrum clocks, less stoppages, a directive to refs to play on and cut down TMO interjections, maybe reinstating a 4/5/6 try BP on top of the existing 3+ tries BP.

We can then rebrand Super as better, faster, stronger etc.

It's not ideal, but it might be the best option available.
.

Oh, and market the f@#ing thing properly. Not just a few ads on Foxtel but out in the wider community. In regards to digital rights partner with Fox Sports to provide people with easier access to games via something akin to a season pass or tap into the growing demand of social media platforms in regards to sports broadcasting.

WR (World Rugby) has actually been pretty forward thinking in its development of social media in regards to its major tournaments. Look at that and build on it. Accessibility is key here.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Something clearly needs to be done, Super Rugby isn't what it should be but i believe its got to the stage where the biggest issue in the game is quickly becoming the fans itself. We bemoan everything and anything, sometimes i don't even think we understand what we are whinging about, it has just come to a point where it's the thing to do. Rhetoric has been written that everything is bad/terrible/shocking that even when it isn't at times, people are too stubborn or blinded to want to think anything different.

The ground swell of negativity has become a habit.

Then there is that. You're absolutely correct on that matter. And it starts with our punditry who are largely negative in most everything they contribute. That needs to end. We need to talk the game up and that starts with what people see and read in the media.

 

[Strewthcobber]

It does beg the question - how much of the Foxsports decline is due to Foxsports?

 

[Braveheart81]

Then there is that. You're absolutely correct on that matter. And it starts with our punditry who are largely negative in most everything they contribute. That needs to end. We need to talk the game up and that starts with what people see and read in the media.

On the flipside of this, rugby seems to have the unique situation where fans criticise the commentators and broadcasters for not being critical enough when I would say they are probably more critical than their equivalents in most sports.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

On the flipside of this, rugby seems to have the unique situation where fans criticise the commentators and broadcasters for not being critical enough when I would say they are probably more critical than their equivalents in most sports.

Then your average Rugby fan is clearly a masochist. Because from what I've seen our punditry is generally speaking very critical of practically every aspect of the game while in other sporting codes such as RL and AFL for every one critical piece or opinion there appears to be at least one (often many more) expounding just how wonderful it is.

I hate to suggest this as it's essentially propagandist in nature but RA needs to invest more in its journalist core and get them singing from the one song book. They don't need every piece to be all rainbows and lollipops but look to find a balance between the two perspectives at least.

 

[barbarian]

The 3+ try bonus point system has coincided with the cratering in support across the competition.

Now correlation doesn't equal causation but it's worth a think

I think it feeds into the broader critique that Super Rugby is now too hard for the casual fan to follow. The conference system, the finals system, the scoring system.

Whilst logical, you need to be a hardcore fan to understand what is going on.
.

 

[barbarian]

I hate to suggest this as it's essentially propagandist in nature but RA needs to invest more in its journalist core and get them singing from the one song book. They don't need every piece to be all rainbows and lollipops but look to find a balance between the two perspectives at least.

I think it's a lot better than what it used to be. Remember the days of Greg Growden potting every single thing the ARU or Wallabies did? The 'fort fumble' shit and the mindless gossip from 'around the traps'? Old Spiro writing those bitter rants every week or two?

Thank Christ that is now a long way in the rear-view mirror.

The tone to me is a lot more reasonable now with Georgina Robinson, Tom Decent, Jamie Pandaram, Wayne Smith and the growing cohort of rugby.com.au journos - general optimism without pulling any punches if they are needed.
.

 

[Braveheart81]

I think it's a lot better than what it used to be. Remember the days of Greg Growden potting every single thing the ARU or Wallabies did? The 'fort fumble' shit and the mindless gossip from 'around the traps'? Old Spiro writing those bitter rants every week or two?

Those two are still taking regular potshots, thankfully just with a smaller gun to a smaller audience.

 

[Brumby Runner]

OK so lets for a second assume we are running back Super Rugby in 2020 and beyond, in the current format.

What can SANZAAR do to bring back fans?

I think the best option could be a leaf out of the Twiggy playbook, and going with rule variations.

Super Rugby's initial appeal was the style. It was rugby unleashed, emphasising open, running play with tries and action aplenty. Now we can debate how much the 2018 version is different to that, but in the minds of the fans it's stale.

So I'd be looking at scrum clocks, less stoppages, a directive to refs to play on and cut down TMO interjections, maybe reinstating a 4/5/6 try BP on top of the existing 3+ tries BP.

We can then rebrand Super as better, faster, stronger etc.

It's not ideal, but it might be the best option available.
.

I much prefer the four try bonus point to the current 3 try margin. I've never been a fan of the losing bonus point though.

Some of your other suggestions have merit too. I would like to see the scrum limited in time as well and for the ball to be used as soon as it's available. As a supporter of a team with one of the stronger scrums, I would rather see quick ball used than the efforts of the scrum continued in order to win a penalty.

 

[Quick Hands]

Super Rugby's initial appeal was the style. It was rugby unleashed, emphasising open, running play with tries and action aplenty. Now we can debate how much the 2018 version is different to that, but in the minds of the fans it's stale.


.

I'd also suggest add the novelty factor. When it began, super rugby was a novelty - particularly in Australia. SA and NZ had always had Currie Cup and NPC, but in Australia there was club rugby and a couple of interstate games between NSW and Qld and a City v Country clash.

Professional rugby was also in its infancy, so there was that cross over from the relatively unstructured amateur game still evident.

Sadly, I think that super rugby as an intercontinental, multi-timezone competition is a dead horse which doesn't need to be flogged any further. (As the Waratahs disappear from the view of all but the most rusted on of fanatics to play a semi-final in the wee small hours of Sunday morning - invisible at the time when they could be appealing to casual fans)

SANZAAR and its member unions essentially have 12 months to find an alternative, then 12 months planning to be ready to kick off in 2021.

IMO domestic professional rugby, followed by a 6 week champions league is the way to go.

 

[Brumby Runner]

The laws surrounding mauls need to be looked at too. Just too many of them, and almost impossible to defend legally.

 

[wamberal]

Rule variations are a last resort, I reckon; unless, of course, they are global - in which case I am all for them.

 

[Rebels3]

The product on the field is by and large fine, although i do agree the Maul needs to be looked at (i'd have the rule that once the maul stalls once it needs to be used). It's the things like time zones, fan engagement etc. that are the issue. Plus we are pushing up hill within the media creating a Rugby League superiority complex within the population. For example i have introduced my housemate to Union this year after 30 years of been a league fanatic, he's surprised at how much he enjoys the game and always thought it was a slow kickfest that was decided on penalty goals and the skill level was below Rugby League. He would of been adamant that the Kangaroos would smash the All Blacks if given a years training on the rules. I have got him now to the point where the All Blacks and Kangaroos are basically neck and neck on 'rugby' ability, which i think is probably the case.

As fans we need to sell the game better to the masses

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

The product on the field is by and large fine, although i do agree the Maul needs to be looked at (i'd have the rule that once the maul stalls once it needs to be used). It's the things like time zones, fan engagement etc. that are the issue. Plus we are pushing up hill within the media creating a Rugby League superiority complex within the population. For example i have introduced my housemate to Union this year after 30 years of been a league fanatic, he's surprised at how much he enjoys the game and always thought it was a slow kickfest that was decided on penalty goals and the skill level was below Rugby League. He would of been adamant that the Kangaroos would smash the All Blacks if given a years training on the rules. I have got him now to the point where the All Blacks and Kangaroos are basically neck and neck on 'rugby' ability, which i think is probably the case.

As fans we need to sell the game better to the masses

I've had similar experiences in both playing and in coaching. Many come from League with this assumption that Rugby is going to be easy by comparison. Only for them to find out (at least in the teams I have been involved in which emphasis working off the ball as much as on it) that the game is a lot more difficult and physical than they thought or were used to. And the remarkable thing is, while you'll get some that will slink away plenty more tend to stay on.

So, yeah. We do need to sell the game better but we also need the game to be more visible in order to make that sell easier. It's something that's being discussed right now by several of my US based friends. Advocacy of the game in the aftermath of what has been a hugely successful 7s WC both in terms of attendance and reach.

 

[half]

From kiap post 12288
Ratings

Aust ==== 4.236 million
NZ ===== 10.352 million
SA ===== 26.625 million
Arg ===== 0.608 million
Jap ===== 0.739 million
Eup ===== 7.500 million

Totalling ====== 50.06 million
Less SA & Eup == 34.125 million

Leaving 15.935 million with Jap & Arg rating lucky to pay for the air fares.

Meaning Australian rugby is entirely dependent on SA remaining in Super Rugby.

Hoggy’s post 12296 highlighted the thoughts of many in SA.
Hoggy’s link repeated http://www.sarugbymag.co.za/super-rugby-has-lost-its-magic

So all those arguing for Super Rugby, and defending it, and insisting on almost having a gilt edge guarantee before even considering changing. What will happen if SA pull the pin, nay what will happen when SA pull the pin and move to Europe.

It will be more money, same time zones, and get more soft influence for the SA gov in Europe. They will then buy Australia, NZ & PI players at will as will European clubs.

The above rating to me scream and yell get working on plan "B" tonight and keep working on it. By light years the most important thing IMO on RA's many issues to solve.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

From kiap post 12288
Ratings

Aust ==== 4.236 million
NZ ===== 10.352 million
SA ===== 26.625 million
Arg ===== 0.608 million
Jap ===== 0.739 million
Eup ===== 7.500 million

Totalling ====== 50.06 million
Less SA & Eup == 34.125 million

Leaving 15.935 million with Jap & Arg rating lucky to pay for the air fares.

Meaning Australian rugby is entirely dependent on SA remaining in Super Rugby.

Hoggy’s post 12296 highlighted the thoughts of many in SA.
Hoggy’s link repeated http://www.sarugbymag.co.za/super-rugby-has-lost-its-magic

So all those arguing for Super Rugby, and defending it, and insisting on almost having a gilt edge guarantee before even considering changing. What will happen if SA pull the pin, nay what will happen when SA pull the pin and move to Europe.

It will be more money, same time zones, and get more soft influence for the SA gov in Europe. They will then buy Australia, NZ & PI players at will as will European clubs.

The above rating to me scream and yell get working on plan "B" tonight and keep working on it. By light years the most important thing IMO on RA's many issues to solve.

Here's your plan B. SA seem to have a bunch of voices calling for the move north. While some seem to think joining the 6N's is possible it's not. So them competing against us on the international stage isn't likely to change any time soon. So the RC should remain at it's current four. But professionally in the tier below let them go north.

A bit of a hard luck story. But the Jaguares can either look to find a place in Europe for themselves (possibly based out of Spain) or disband it and focus on the emerging Sth American league and select players from Europe. Sanction the IPRC and encourage Japan to link up with it in whatever form they prefer. This would leave our current 4 and NZ's 5. Add in a combined PI squad based either here or in Fiji for 10 total. Play each other twice for 18 rounds home and away. NZ will just have to suck it up on the derbies.

Put into play plans to kink up with the IPRC to run a Champions Cup structure or some such in the future and look to involve teams from the MLR and Sth Am league in time.