Where to for Super Rugby?

[Set piece magic]

Realistically, the Japan & Arg move is all about getting leverage at the neg table and having a plausible alternate competition. Good, leverage up and smash 'em. Recruit the pacific island team as well. NZRU will be back at the table

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Realistically, the Japan & Arg move is all about getting leverage at the neg table and having a plausible alternate competition. Good, leverage up and smash 'em. Recruit the pacific island team as well. NZRU will be back at the table

Look who's behind the PI team. Unless there a big pot of cash in play in order to make their dream's come true and it would have to be big. Then they'll side with NZ. What I'd like to see happen though is us via RA and GRR leverage the existing relationships with Fiji and Samoa at a minimum to get both the Drua and the Manuma squad involved.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I've been thinking about our options a bit in regards to where we could take this. If we go it alone. The biggest parto f me would like to see us use the NRC format but with our 5 pro franchises replacing Sydney, Brisbane, Canberra, Rising and Spirit while maintaining both the country teams and the Drua. I think that would be a fairly simple structure for us to get up and running in a fairly short time frame.

But one that's probably more silly than anything else harps back to the World Series Rugby Andrew Forrest was pushing before WR (World Rugby) asked him to not use it as they wanted as an option for the Nations Championship. And I also thought about what I know of World Series Cricket when it first launched.

How teams were brought in from around the world but all based here. And I find myself asking. Could something similar be an option here? Probably not. In fact, almost definitely not. But considering RA have mentioned contacting the Japanese and Argentine Unions in regards to having the Sunwolves and Jaguares compete here would it be that much of a stretch for instead of those two teams we have Team Asia and Team Sth America alongside say Team Africa, Team Europe and perhaps even Team North America. All based here of course. Would people be interested in such a competition?

 

[Quick Hands]

Man, the parallels between the SANZAAR board and it's constituencies with a domestic violence case is uncanny. "I alone will decide what's best for this relationship"

But hypothetically, if Aus and NZ walk away, what do these boardroom guys do? Ok, they take RA and NZRU to court. Lets say they're either awarded something for a breach of contract and lets say both countries are able to pay such a fee.

Then what? SANZAAR just becomes SAAR? The Argentinean component is all but dusted with their players heading to Europe.

SANZAAR has lost all relevancy is the future. Similar to companies in the past who have failed to adopt what the future looks like, they're grasping to hold onto the past. The sooner they realise this and work with the respective national bodies the better off they'll be.

SANZAAR should be wound up ASAP.

 

[Braveheart81]

SANZAAR should be wound up ASAP.

Regardless of what happens with Super Rugby it will likely still serve a purpose for The Rugby Championship.

 

[half]

HHHMMMMM difficult to know whether to put this in the broadcast thread or this one. Decided on the Super Rugby thread as it has implications beyond broadcasting.

Two very recent, things I watched and read, both FFA related.

THE ESSENTIAL POINT IS WHATEVER THEY DISCUSS ON THE SBS VID IS IN SPADES MORE IN RUGBY.

The head of the A-League discusses rating with the head sports journalist on SBS, every rugby person should watch this vid as how the A-League head breaks down the ratings is obviously correct. Further given rugby's place in NZ this not only applies to Australian rugby but is light years more.

The second is an article in the Roar today on some advice coming to FFA from one of its think tanks and they are essentially discussing taking over your own broadcasting and on sell to whoever will buy.

Consider we could sell to Europe, SA

FFA have previously reported they can broadcast their 200 odd game competition and the FFA Cup for around 12 million. If they added W-League and some state league matches that figure is said to be 15 million.

We have less games meaning our cost should be lower. This makes sense, especially if you consider the SBS interview. Remember rugby is in a far stronger position to use these methods.

SBS
https://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/vid...ague-ratings-myths?playlist=latest-videos-twg

Roar article.
https://www.theroar.com.au/2020/07/24/the-case-for-ffa-tv/

 

[Quick Hands]

Regardless of what happens with Super Rugby it will likely still serve a purpose for The Rugby Championship.

Do we we need a separate bureaucracy to run an annual 4 team tournament?

 

[kiap]

^ Probably not.

There is only two options I see will eventuate;

1) 10 team trans-tasman with an 11th team added for 2022. The 5 Aus teams will only be allowed on the provision that 2-3 imports of Super Rugby standards are to be proactively added to the squads to improve the standard (eg. Argentinian or South African super rugby standard players)

2) Both SRAU and SRNZ will continue to exist, but a Champions League type comp with Japanese teams from the Top League will be made to offer extra content.

Personally I think option 2 is the best as it still has a National champion to celebrate but believe option 1 would be the lowest odds available at the TAB. It makes the most sense and is the right compromise without anyone having to sacrifice anything overly significant

Yeah. Option 2 could also be forced by circumstance (i.e. travel restrictions still in place 6-7 months from now).

I wouldn't bet against it, for 2021 anyway.

 

[Braveheart81]

Do we we need a separate bureaucracy to run an annual 4 team tournament?

Yes because it makes it much simpler by delegating authority.

It's the same as the Six Nations having an entity that runs their tournament.

You are setting the groundrules through an agreement and then empowering firstly a couple of your boardmembers to act on behalf of your member union (they have 2 reps each) and then an employee of SANZAAR to act on those instructions and enter into contracts etc. Otherwise every agreement relating to The Rugby Championship would need to be a contract involving all parties with each external supplier etc.

It is no different to the Shute Shield setting up the Sydney Rugby Union to run the competition so that every time a decision needs to be made they don't need the input of every club.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

HHHMMMMM difficult to know whether to put this in the broadcast thread or this one. Decided on the Super Rugby thread as it has implications beyond broadcasting.

Two very recent, things I watched and read, both FFA related.

THE ESSENTIAL POINT IS WHATEVER THEY DISCUSS ON THE SBS VID IS IN SPADES MORE IN RUGBY.

The head of the A-League discusses rating with the head sports journalist on SBS, every rugby person should watch this vid as how the A-League head breaks down the ratings is obviously correct. Further given rugby's place in NZ this not only applies to Australian rugby but is light years more.

The second is an article in the Roar today on some advice coming to FFA from one of its think tanks and they are essentially discussing taking over your own broadcasting and on sell to whoever will buy.

Consider we could sell to Europe, SA

FFA have previously reported they can broadcast their 200 odd game competition and the FFA Cup for around 12 million. If they added W-League and some state league matches that figure is said to be 15 million.

We have less games meaning our cost should be lower. This makes sense, especially if you consider the SBS interview. Remember rugby is in a far stronger position to use these methods.

SBS
https://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/vid...ague-ratings-myths?playlist=latest-videos-twg

Roar article.
https://www.theroar.com.au/2020/07/24/the-case-for-ffa-tv/

Mate, the guy is really stretching in order to make what are appalling ratings figures sound remotely reasonable. What matters is the ratings on their primary broadcast partners platforms and they have been poor. A game on the last Saturday got 9k. Come on. Even if you apply the same logic as Rugby where roughly half of the the total viewers are watching on Kayo that's still pretty bloody poor.

 

[Rebel man]

Would like 10 teams 5 Aus 5 NZ. In time would look to add anywhere from 2-4 sides from the pacific.

I would also look at a Southern Hemisphere club’s championship. I know Japan and the technically is in the North so are the pacific islands. I also accept South Africa’s involvement would be difficult is they move their sides to the Pro 14

 

[half]

Mate, the guy is really stretching in order to make what are appalling ratings figures sound remotely reasonable. What matters is the ratings on their primary broadcast partners platforms and they have been poor. A game on the last Saturday got 9k. Come on. Even if you apply the same logic as Rugby where roughly half of the the total viewers are watching on Kayo that's still pretty bloody poor.

I give up .

Mate I was not talking about A-League ratings nor his spin.

Can you maybe for once get away from this code war thing, this constant dick measuring i.e my dick is bigger than he's but smaller thank their's.

This was about a few things, the way he broke down the various platforms, the way he described how those in say AFL & League would dominate sports writing comment on other code figures, FFS the death riding on rugby is equally massive.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I give up .

Mate I was not talking about A-League ratings nor his spin.

Can you maybe for once get away from this code war thing, this constant dick measuring i.e my dick is bigger than he's but smaller thank their's.

This was about a few things, the way he broke down the various platforms, the way he described how those in say AFL & League would dominate sports writing comment on other code figures, FFS the death riding on rugby is equally massive.

We've had this multi platform discussion several pages back this very thread. About what the rough split of viewers were between Fox and Kayo. That's all that matters from a domestic deal perspective in the immediate future.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

FACT - we have zero chance of having a good competition structure if left to NZRU - we really need an independent and forward thinking organisation who has regional interests at heart. Twiggy rapid rugby mark 2 please then let inept national rugby organisations tied to self interest and amateur era thinking

 

[Wilson]

FACT - we have zero chance of having a good competition structure if left to NZRU - we really need an independent and forward thinking organisation who has regional interests at heart. Twiggy rapid rugby mark 2 please then let inept national rugby organisations tied to self interest and amateur era thinking

That's not a fact, that's an opinion. I don't necessarily disagree with it but it's definitely not a fact.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

That's not a fact, that's an opinion. I don't necessarily disagree with it but it's definitely not a fact.

Provacative post for a reason as you agree chances of successful NZRU led regional competition that serves regional interests is Buckley’s and none. I could say high probability but odds so stretched happy to sit with calling a fact.

 

[Wilson]

Provacative post for a reason as you agree chances of successful NZRU led regional competition that serves regional interests is Buckley’s and none. I could say high probability but odds so stretched happy to sit with calling a fact.

I'd contend that a competition structure dominated by one partner (NZ or Australia) will only work for that partner. I don't agree that something that involves New Zealand necessarily won't work though, and I don't believe Global Rapid Rugby is the answer, our provincial competition needs to be played under the rules (or pretty bloody close to them) that we'll be playing under at test level.

But at the end of the day that's still just my opinion, and categorically not a fact. Hyperbolic statements claiming it as one helps no one.

 

[Dan54]

Provacative post for a reason as you agree chances of successful NZRU led regional competition that serves regional interests is Buckley’s and none. I could say high probability but odds so stretched happy to sit with calling a fact.

You want any comp not led by anyone , one led by Aus would have as little chance of being good for anyone else.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

You want any comp not led by anyone , one led by Aus would have as little chance of being good for anyone else.

You nailed it Dan - hence why would rather twiggy and co or private equity interests involved in competition design. I am hammering NZRU as they are trying to lead a unilaterally designed competition when would rather collaborative effort given 1+1 = 3 - particularly when the 1’s on both side are weak. I hope private equity comes in as NZRU and RA are neither competent or appropriate from arms length thinking to design a suitable regional or Trans Tasman competition.

 

[half]

We've had this multi platform discussion several pages back this very thread. About what the rough split of viewers were between Fox and Kayo. That's all that matters from a domestic deal perspective in the immediate future.

His point was that the Fox rating are less than 20% of the ratings.

He nominated

NZ had 3, Sky, Sky Go, & a Sky Kayo . 3

In Australia, he identified, Fox, Fox Kayo, FFA my Football app, Telstra. 5

Internationally a Youtube channel . 1

Thats 9 platforms, with Fox rating less than 20%, when on FTA well under 10% was the Fox ratings.

To my earlier post, he received advice that FFA should broadcast themselves and FFA themselves have identified a broadcast of between 12 & 15 million.

Added to this was what the A-League head said was almost attack reporting by sports writers who essentially are AFL & NRL fan folk.

TO MY POINT

Rugby would have similar platforms and moreover receive poor reporting from the same sports writers.

But rugby in NZ is light years ahead of soccer, and certainty an Australia / NZ competition would get light years more international youtube watchers than Australian soccer.

Further our costs would be less as FFA would have more games.

I understand the Fox v Streaming debate this site had.

HOWEVER

The way this guy broke down the platforms opened my eyes he identified 9 platforms thats huge. We would have more i.e. PI nations, maybe PNG as well.

Also I don't know the answer but the media bias towards, cricket, AFL & NRL is true and the manner in which they downplay other codes and under report their achievements.

Its worth discussing, that it was said by a soccer person is not the issue, it applies more to us.