kiap
Steve Williams (59)
It's when the next level up, in this case the board, don't want too many questions asked.
I don't mean particular negotiations on this issue, more running of the corner shop in general.
Where to for Super Rugby?
- Thread starter Quick Hands
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I don't mean particular negotiations on this issue, more running of the corner shop in general.
half
Dick Tooth (41)
This posts saddens me to write as I think for the first time I have lost faith that we can recover to anywhere near say 2000 levels.
My instinct,maybe not instinct more my nature is to read widely, research, analysis and from this develop plans.
Any analysis of the past 20 or so years pertaining to the Australian sporting landscape shows action and reaction by many traditional codes, AFL, league, soccer, basketball, cricket. Further minor codes like netball, V8’s , have been in a state of change and mostly growing.
You can add to this the growth in X sports like BMX & surfing, and how they are reacting and growing.
Finally, the sports market growing the fastest and largely at this stage unchallenged by traditional codes is the massive growth in E-Games and E-Game tournaments. Not quite right as soccer, basketball & gridiron have massive E-games in their own right. The AFL in particular have identified E-games as a massive threat but even they don’t have deep enough pockets to develop an acceptable E-game. The AFL's solution is to attempt to attach themselves to some key E-games with their own teams playing them.
But what’s happening now in other sports. Most are in the process of developing & expansion. All are looking to add Australian content to sell to media buyers. Cricket’s expansion of the Big Bash is the perfect example of this.
A report recently released by the AFL relating to their Sydney based teams is somewhat eye opening.
Some details http://aflnswact.com.au/nswact-players-in-afl-2019/
The above link says “”AFL NSW/ACT will have 62 players representing the region during the 2019 Toyota AFL Season.”….
GWS alone has 13 players from NSW/ACT.
This bit is taken from an AFL report I read about Sydney.
“”””””Sydney Western Suburbs (GWS Zone) Number Of Junior Club Competition Teams
2012- 67 == 2017- 155 == 2018- 180
Swans Sydney Zone Number Of Junior Club Competition Teams
2012- 210 == 2017- 366 == 2018- 438”””””
Netball is on 9, and talking expansion. Soccer has had a mini revolution and is about to go through considerable operational changes.
AFL women’s game & small field game, basketball is about to launch a major push for 3 a side games, league women’s game and rule changes at junior levels.
To me its beyond obvious and has been for almost 20 years we need a national domestic competition. As each year passes, our base support has eroded as well as our finances. We have allowed by our non-reaction other codes to gain traction and expand.
As a code we can’t even get close to what to do. There is no generally accepted solution or even agreement on how to go about trying to identify key issues.
We have a limited number of stakeholder groups, unlike most other codes. We have a board, some state unions. The appointees to the key decision making roles in SANZAAR from Australia come from RA .
We don’t have powerful clubs like league, AFL, A-League, we don’t have key supporters groups tearing at the board. We are very much an inhouse bunch.
We are not reacting; we don’t have neither the financial nor intellectual capacity nor the will to drive needed change
Time is against us as our market share is falling. Parties that would have been interested a number of year ago no longer are. Lang Walker is the perfect example of this.
For the first time I think we have passed the no return point. Only drastic action and a complete change to operational systems will save us and I can’t see that happening.
My instinct,maybe not instinct more my nature is to read widely, research, analysis and from this develop plans.
Any analysis of the past 20 or so years pertaining to the Australian sporting landscape shows action and reaction by many traditional codes, AFL, league, soccer, basketball, cricket. Further minor codes like netball, V8’s , have been in a state of change and mostly growing.
You can add to this the growth in X sports like BMX & surfing, and how they are reacting and growing.
Finally, the sports market growing the fastest and largely at this stage unchallenged by traditional codes is the massive growth in E-Games and E-Game tournaments. Not quite right as soccer, basketball & gridiron have massive E-games in their own right. The AFL in particular have identified E-games as a massive threat but even they don’t have deep enough pockets to develop an acceptable E-game. The AFL's solution is to attempt to attach themselves to some key E-games with their own teams playing them.
But what’s happening now in other sports. Most are in the process of developing & expansion. All are looking to add Australian content to sell to media buyers. Cricket’s expansion of the Big Bash is the perfect example of this.
A report recently released by the AFL relating to their Sydney based teams is somewhat eye opening.
Some details http://aflnswact.com.au/nswact-players-in-afl-2019/
The above link says “”AFL NSW/ACT will have 62 players representing the region during the 2019 Toyota AFL Season.”….
GWS alone has 13 players from NSW/ACT.
This bit is taken from an AFL report I read about Sydney.
“”””””Sydney Western Suburbs (GWS Zone) Number Of Junior Club Competition Teams
2012- 67 == 2017- 155 == 2018- 180
Swans Sydney Zone Number Of Junior Club Competition Teams
2012- 210 == 2017- 366 == 2018- 438”””””
Netball is on 9, and talking expansion. Soccer has had a mini revolution and is about to go through considerable operational changes.
AFL women’s game & small field game, basketball is about to launch a major push for 3 a side games, league women’s game and rule changes at junior levels.
To me its beyond obvious and has been for almost 20 years we need a national domestic competition. As each year passes, our base support has eroded as well as our finances. We have allowed by our non-reaction other codes to gain traction and expand.
As a code we can’t even get close to what to do. There is no generally accepted solution or even agreement on how to go about trying to identify key issues.
We have a limited number of stakeholder groups, unlike most other codes. We have a board, some state unions. The appointees to the key decision making roles in SANZAAR from Australia come from RA .
We don’t have powerful clubs like league, AFL, A-League, we don’t have key supporters groups tearing at the board. We are very much an inhouse bunch.
We are not reacting; we don’t have neither the financial nor intellectual capacity nor the will to drive needed change
Time is against us as our market share is falling. Parties that would have been interested a number of year ago no longer are. Lang Walker is the perfect example of this.
For the first time I think we have passed the no return point. Only drastic action and a complete change to operational systems will save us and I can’t see that happening.
John S
Chilla Wilson (44)
As they say on the farm s**t like cream, often rises to the top"
hoggy
Nev Cottrell (35)
[Chairman Roger Davis] and I are of the opinion that we are not being heard, communication is not transparent and our interests are not being served by the current organization. The meeting last Monday between the RA senior management and the CEOs of the respective Super States shed no light on the process of how the announced structure come to pass nor any tangible solutions for the future to assist us in ensuring we can develop rugby in the State and remain competitive at Super level."
So they were happy to sign off on a 12 year broadcast agreement without any consultation with its Super rugby teams. And what appears to be no strategy regards domestic growth, all this for about an extra lousy $10 million a year.
Sadly i'm with you Half, I do not see how the game is going to survive in this country.
So they were happy to sign off on a 12 year broadcast agreement without any consultation with its Super rugby teams. And what appears to be no strategy regards domestic growth, all this for about an extra lousy $10 million a year.
Sadly i'm with you Half, I do not see how the game is going to survive in this country.
WorkingClassRugger
Michael Lynagh (62)
It's £10m/year. Which is around $18m/year. And I suspect part of the holding out from England is to secure a higher take so that could be more yet. I think they are more or less referring to the RA capitulation on the Super Rugby structure and the axing of the Sunwolves.
kiap
Steve Williams (59)
That's the one.
And, from what NSW seem to be saying, without info being passed on before that was agreed.
Nor an explanation provided after it happened.
WorkingClassRugger
Michael Lynagh (62)
Pity they won't have the gumption to do something about it. Super Rugby has needed to be run as an proper business for a very long time. Something RA is not set up nor capable of doing.
Rebels3
Jim Lenehan (48)
Agreed.
I don’t think the clubs have any issue with the proposed world league, it’s the shrinking super season that’s causing the anxiety at the franchises.
hoggy
Nev Cottrell (35)
Well the clubs should have an issue with the World league and Super rugby, if not there f_____g stupid.
The RA have without consultation happily signed up-to a 12 year agreement with lots of promises of cash (anyone remember hearing that before) effectively handing control of the game over to a broadcaster, without any genuine plan to grow the game here domestically.
Where the f___k do they think those Wallabies eye balls are going to come from in 10 years time.
That has nothing to do with Super Rugby though. It's test rugby of which we're part of an international schedule.
I guess we could opt out of test rugby if we wanted but we might as well shut up shop now if we were going to do that.
WorkingClassRugger
Michael Lynagh (62)
The international game. What comes of it will come down to what the money is used for. I agree. But it shouldn't impact Super Rugby. In fact, I would hope it would be a catalyst for the likes of Super Rugby or at least the Aus contingent to start to look at running the competition as a proper going concern and not some extended Wallabies trial.
hoggy
Nev Cottrell (35)
That's the catch 22 though, Super rugby hasn't worked for a long time, yet the RA are happily signing up to a format that will give them very little room to effectively make change. You get nothing for free, you think there just going to give us an extra $10/15 million a year for a couple minor scheduling changes. there gonna own Test rugby like Fox owned Super rugby, and hows that worked out.
Maybe I'm wrong and the RA can throw around a wad of cash in a couple of years, but i reckon this is a big f____g bridge to nowhere.
The alternative is literally to stop playing test rugby against any team that will generate dollars.
hoggy
Nev Cottrell (35)
No it isn't
Care to explain how? The teams that make up 80%+ of our annual test schedule outside of RWC years are agreeing to this test calendar and format. How do you think we opt out of this and still play test rugby?
Aurelius
Ted Thorn (20)
I'd argue the first few years of the BBL.
Of course, the geniuses at Cricket Australia got greedy and lengthened the season unnecessarily, so when it comes to sheer mismanagement of a once-popular tournament you'd have to give them the silver.
No prizes for guessing who comes in first.
Quick Hands
David Wilson (68)
As many of us have been saying, they should have had a Plan B 2 years ago.
Rebels3
Jim Lenehan (48)
The world league has nothing to do with our franchises, if anything it’d free up extra weeks for domestic content because of the reduced international games the wallabies would play. Under the league teams play 11 matches a season, Australia usually play 13/14 matches.
Quick Hands
David Wilson (68)
This is gold, pure gold. I hope he didn't have a straight face when he was saying it.
"[Chairman Roger Davis] and I are of the opinion that we are not being heard, communication is not transparent and our interests are not being served by the current organisation.
I'll give you a tip Rodge, this is how all of us mere mortals at the grass roots have been saying about you and your organisation for years. Welcome to the disenfranchissed mate.
waiopehu oldboy
George Smith (75)
The broadcasters (Fox, Super Sport, SkyNZ & Sky UK) have presented SANZAAR with their post-2021 wish list:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby...cal-shakeup-of-super-rugby-rugby-championship
Some interesting ideas e.g. a return to actual tours but also some pie in the sky stuff e.g. the marquee player pool: I just don't see anyone wanting their best players based overseas where they can't be monitored, rested etc as is now becoming the norm.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby...cal-shakeup-of-super-rugby-rugby-championship
Some interesting ideas e.g. a return to actual tours but also some pie in the sky stuff e.g. the marquee player pool: I just don't see anyone wanting their best players based overseas where they can't be monitored, rested etc as is now becoming the norm.
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