Western Sydney Rams . NRC Official Team Thread

[RugbyFuture]

I don't agree with pfitzy on their admin.

 

[Pfitzy]

It would be nice if you outlined the reasons with in an objective fashion - with the full awareness that your dealings with them has massive potential to cloud your judgement.

But thinking back, you have a point e.g. that chick they had dealing with player profiles etc was a bit out of touch in the initial stages.

So let me rephrase that to say: their exec structure. I've talked to a few of them and while its their job to present a positive image, they're genuinely interested in feedback and keenly aware of the vulnerabilities the other JVs face in terms of politics brought along with other clubs.

Not to mention the issues they had throwing things together in a very short space of time that affected the look and feel of things like their website etc.

 

[TOCC]

Thanks Pfitzy and i think that somewhat reinforces my point that the NSWRU and Waratahs management staff could have been assisting through that phase, the fact that it was all thrown together very quickly highlights anarea that the Waratahs could have assisted in, they have a ready made business model, they have accountants, S&C staff, marketing staff, etc etc... They could have provided each club with a blank canvas business model and template from which each club could have then moulded to suit their individual requirements.

I don't doubt the positive intent of many of these teams, but i think they are currently been let down by the governing bodies sitting above them. At the end of the day the NRC was a great product and i enjoyed every minute of it, but if there is an easy solution to improve the product for 2015 then why not capitalise on it?

 

[Blackers13]

An agent meant to help fight the war, but is actually undermining the health of everyone?

Most of the Shute Shield clubs would love the NRC to be scrapped, and maybe the NSWRU too going by what McKay wrote today.

On the contrary, if it wasn't for the Shute Shield clubs there would be no NSW based NRC teams. Neither the ARU or NSWRU put any cash or support into the Rams/Rays/Stars/Eagles. In every other state the teams are supported by the ARU via their Super franchise/state Union. There is however rising resentment from the Shute Shield clubs at the ARU's withdrawal of funding and the lack of development at grass roots level.

 

[2bluesfan]

It would be nice if you outlined the reasons with in an objective fashion - with the full awareness that your dealings with them has massive potential to cloud your judgement.

But thinking back, you have a point e.g. that chick they had dealing with player profiles etc was a bit out of touch in the initial stages.

So let me rephrase that to say: their exec structure. I've talked to a few of them and while its their job to present a positive image, they're genuinely interested in feedback and keenly aware of the vulnerabilities the other JVs face in terms of politics brought along with other clubs.

Not to mention the issues they had throwing things together in a very short space of time that affected the look and feel of things like their website etc.

I think that the Rams "thing" was moderately successful this year. If the JV partners (financial backers and the clubs) are able to improve on what they delivered this year they will be even more successful next year, assuming the NRC continues in its current format.

I also think that RF has some right to be disappointed in the JV and he probably has more insight into the back office functions than most, if not all, here. I am not sure that the Rams had a coherent view as to how they would handle the totality of their comms but overall I think they made a reasonable to pretty good stab at it (all things considered for a startup) but I'd agree with your comments that "dealing with player profiles etc was a bit out of touch in the initial stages" and "issues they had throwing things together in a very short space of time that affected the look and feel of things like their website etc". These need to be addressed.

Personally, I'm not a big social media devotee (indeed I closed my facebook account a few months ago) but I can understand when others tell me that that "you have to be there" - whether you need to have some of the dross that appeared on the Ramsrugby facebook and Twitter pages appear on the Ramsrugby website is a question to which I have already formed an answer. I hope they pay more attention to the details on the website next year. I also hope the Rams are successful next year.

 

[Pfitzy]

Thanks Pfitzy and i think that somewhat reinforces my point that the NSWRU and Waratahs management staff could have been assisting through that phase, the fact that it was all thrown together very quickly highlights anarea that the Waratahs could have assisted in, they have a ready made business model, they have accountants, S&C staff, marketing staff, etc etc. They could have provided each club with a blank canvas business model and template from which each club could have then moulded to suit their individual requirements.

That is a nice thought, but ignores the fact that NSWRU have had a business model - which is separate from the Tahs remember - that for 100 years has done not very much to grow the code outside the eastern suburbs heartland.

NSWRU are desperate to keep Penrith and Parra in Premier Rugby, but largely leave them to their own devices determining HOW that is going to work. There would inevitably be accusations of bias and political agendas, particularly when you consider that some people close to e.g. Sydney Uni are taking no active role in making the Stars a success.

People are out there passively or actively wishing the NRC to fail. This should surprise no-one.

I don't think there would be any value - or capacity - for NSWRU to give help to the NSW JVs, and certainly the Rams wouldn't expect any, which is why they've tried hard to make themselves independent from the get-go.

 

[TOCC]

That is a nice thought, but ignores the fact that NSWRU have had a business model - which is separate from the Tahs remember - that for 100 years has done not very much to grow the code outside the eastern suburbs heartland.

NSWRU are desperate to keep Penrith and Parra in Premier Rugby, but largely leave them to their own devices determining HOW that is going to work. There would inevitably be accusations of bias and political agendas, particularly when you consider that some people close to e.g. Sydney Uni are taking no active role in making the Stars a success.

People are out there passively or actively wishing the NRC to fail. This should surprise no-one.

I don't think there would be any value - or capacity - for NSWRU to give help to the NSW JVs, and certainly the Rams wouldn't expect any, which is why they've tried hard to make themselves independent from the get-go.

Are you suggesting that the Waratahs/NSWRU have nothing they could offer the JV's or that the Waratahs/NSWRU are incapable of offering the JV's anything?

In either case i firmly believe thats wrong, every JV could take something from the Waratahs, if its not the business model then it could be some support from a video analyst, the S&C staff or the marketing department.. There are a multitude of areas that could be improved upon, NSWRU/Waratahs as a key stakeholder should take a leading position in NSW to assist the local NRC sides, the success of the NRC teams will have a direct impact on the future of the Waratahs.

 

[Pfitzy]

I'm suggesting first of all that the Waratahs and NSWRU are two distinct entities these days, and while there is cooperation, their mission is different.

Are you suggesting that NSWRU has the capacity to equitably help all four of the NSW JVs despite basically ignoring large sections of NSW Rugby for years?

Let's keep in mind that this is an organisation that has been running losses up until Cheika got the onfield stuff sorted, because the back office are a useless pack of shunts.

 

[Jagman]

I was under the impression that the Eagles and Rams both trained at Waratahs HQ and therefore must have had some exposure to all the hypothetical benefits that have been proposed here. Particularly coaching as these were without a doubt the most dangerous NSW teams.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Pfitzy]

Access to facilities is a different beast to help from an organisation.

The Rams and Eagles had more Super rugby players than the other two across the park, and the Rams also had a lot of Eastwoood premiership players in their club stocks, which enhanced their strength.

 

[RugbyReg]

I'm suggesting first of all that the Waratahs and NSWRU are two distinct entities these days, and while there is cooperation, their mission is different.

Are you suggesting that NSWRU has the capacity to equitably help all four of the NSW JVs despite basically ignoring large sections of NSW Rugby for years?

Let's keep in mind that this is an organisation that has been running losses up until Cheika got the onfield stuff sorted, because the back office are a useless pack of shunts.

It's a pity that NSW Coaches couldn't be involved as per in QLD.

Tim Rapp to coach NSW Country
Daryl Gibson Rams
Grey North Harbour
Dunno about Sydney City - is Tim Kelaher a coach at all or just scout?

Plus the odd tweet or retweet would be handy. Can't remember Waratahs doing any of that.

 

[I like to watch]

What do you have against NSW Country?

 

[RugbyReg]

Rapp not respected?

 

[I like to watch]

I wouldn't put him in the same league as Gibson & Grey.
I don't think he has ever coached a professional player.
His last gig before the jnr Tahs was with a School,where they recruited a whole squad against the rules,but that is for another thread.

 

[Pfitzy]

It's a pity that NSW Coaches couldn't be involved as per in QLD.

But QLD Rugby pretty much organised the two ventures up there, did they not? Used it as a development exercise for players and coaches.

The NSW JVs went independent from the get-go, mainly because political blah blah blah.

I was perfectly happy with the Rams coaching setup - Melrose and Manenti have strong connections to the clubs in our catchment and despite a disrupted preparation and fairly crap injury list, were one kick from making the finals.

 

[RugbyReg]

yep QRU did the whole thing because 1) the late notice of the tournament and relevant structures and 2) to somewhat protect the clubs from the commitments required to be a part.

Sure they used it as a development path for Stiles and Meehan but then it also benefited Premier Grade coaches.

For Brisbane City they had Pat Richards (Easts coach) and Rod Seib (Sunnybank coach) as assistant coaches with Shane Arnold (GPS coach) as part of the structure.

QLD Country had Garrick Morgan (QLD Country Heelers coach) as assistant coach with Pete Wilkins (Reds Wider training squad coach) and Tim Sampson (Easts assistant coach I think) was skills coach.


I known the City guys in particular said they got a great deal of value out of the experience of being in a more professional set up.

 

[TOCC]

I'm suggesting first of all that the Waratahs and NSWRU are two distinct entities these days, and while there is cooperation, their mission is different.

Are you suggesting that NSWRU has the capacity to equitably help all four of the NSW JVs despite basically ignoring large sections of NSW Rugby for years?

Let's keep in mind that this is an organisation that has been running losses up until Cheika got the onfield stuff sorted, because the back office are a useless pack of shunts.

Rugby is in trouble if the mission statement of both the NSWRU and Waratahs isn't aligned with promoting rugby within the state, regardless of whether the NRC ranks as a primary objective of those organisations, they are the two largest stakeholders of rugby union in the state thus have inherited the responsibility.

Pfitzy, i think you and i are arguing two seperate issues, my argument is that the Waratahs and NSWRU should be more involved in the NRC teams, you seem to be arguing that these organisation are incapable of assisting those teams.

Whether they are in a position to assist or not doesn't change the fact that as the major stockholders of rugby union in the state and the overarching governing body within NSW, that they should be assisting. We shouldn't lower the bar of whats acceptable purely because the organisations aren't meeting the standard.

Il give you one tiny example that I'm absolutely certain is within the current capacity of the Waratahs, and that is to promote the teams and competition better on social media networks. Waratahs have a social media presence of over 100'000 followers, yet their marketing of games and the overall competition was poor. This issue is actually reflected at the ARU/Wallabies level as well, i think the Wallabies have a presence of 400'00 on Facebook, but barely promoted the competition at all.

 

[TOCC]

Il preempt any chat of parochialism and explain my frustration and interest in the performance of the NSW teams, I am a firm believer that NSW(specifically Sydney) is the heart and lifeblood of rugby union within Australia. Without Sydney the rest of the country will fall, the corporate support and sponsorship revenue generated from Sydney critical to rugby union staying afloat in Australia. Regardless of any participation figures the QRU can roll out, Sydney is still the largest consumer market for rugby union and thus for the success of something like the NRC, its imperative that the Sydney market is captured.

 

[TOCC]

An article in the Australian from Gary Flowers, chairman of the Rays.

Pretty damming assessment in the lack of involvement from NSWRU/Waratahs and the ARU.

“The level of awareness was not great,” said Flowers, who created the short-lived Australian Rugby Championship in 2007.

“The product was great, but everything was put together fairly quickly. There needs to be a level of promotion around this competition.

While the ARU and the NRC franchises needed to promote the development competition, Flowers said the NSWRU also had to become involved. “To be stating the bleeding obvious, NSW and the Waratahs had no involvement with this competition,” Flowers said.

“It’s not as if they weren’t given the opportunity, but they had no involvement and they need to have an involvement because these clubs are providing their players. These clubs are providing the pathways of Waratahs of the future. Queensland was intimately involved in their teams. They ran their teams. Every other franchise the states were intimately involved because they owned the teams.

“NSW was the only one where the state body took little or no interest or role. They should, because arguably they are the major beneficiary.”

 

[qwerty51]

Looks like Eastwood still want nothing to do with the NRC.

The NRC schedule is not due to be released until late June but the Rams have declared they’ll play their first home game at Parramatta’s Merrylands RSL Rugby Park, their second game at Southern Districts’ Forshaw Rugby Park and their third clash at Concord Oval, home of West Harbour. The fourth NRC home game will still be at Pirtek Stadium, Parramatta.

No TG Milner