Waratahs vs Hurricanes - Super Rugby 2012 Rd 15
- Thread starter Braveheart81
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I like to watch
David Codey (61)
I suppose this was the Tahs version of "let's win this one for the Gipper" Talk about just going through the motions...
I hope they do not score another try this year.
I am hoping they get lapped by the Brumbies. Anything but a false dawn please.
I would prefer they sack too many than not enough.
Would all players demanding the retention of Foley please make their way to the exit immediately. have the rest of the season off, do not let the door hit your arse on the way out.
I hope they do not score another try this year.
I am hoping they get lapped by the Brumbies. Anything but a false dawn please.
I would prefer they sack too many than not enough.
Would all players demanding the retention of Foley please make their way to the exit immediately. have the rest of the season off, do not let the door hit your arse on the way out.
J
Jiggles
Guest
No urgency at the break down. No urgency in general play. No accuracy at the break down. No effort to be the support player. No urgency to realign in attack. No effort what so ever to realign in defense what so ever. Not enough of the pack are willing to get their shirts dirty and do the hard work in the mauls.
A Mate of mine asked 'Why I care so much about the Tahs, being a Reds fan.' I care because 11 of these lazy underachievers are picked in a Wallaby squad, and you can be sure that 7 or 8 will find their way to a 'full strength' Wallaby 22. They are rewarded for being mediocre week in, week out.
A Mate of mine asked 'Why I care so much about the Tahs, being a Reds fan.' I care because 11 of these lazy underachievers are picked in a Wallaby squad, and you can be sure that 7 or 8 will find their way to a 'full strength' Wallaby 22. They are rewarded for being mediocre week in, week out.
Tordah
Dave Cowper (27)
I think the only teams relevant to the Reds chances are the Sharks and the Brumbies. Highlanders & Hurricanes won't feature, Stormers, Chiefs, Bulls and Crusaders almost certain.
J
Jiggles
Guest
TPN should definitely hang his head. why?
The first Canes try was from Foley being under pressure at the back and fumbling. TPN was 5 metres away and was jogging back to Foley in support. TPN should've been busting his guts out to get back to support his fullback, on the deck, with no one else behind.
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
Some stats and analysis:-
First Half:-
9 kicks - 6 poor including two kicks on turnover ball on attack in the Hurricanes half. 3 well executed territorial kicks. 33% of kicks well executed. Much improved on the 13% from a couple of weeks ago when I first did this. Of note was the mindset to run the ball, in wet heavy condition, even from their own half. I am not one of those fools who decry the kicking game indeed in such conditions with the Tahs lack of passing skills why do they try to run the ball from their own half?
Other points of note:-
1) No players moving at pace onto a pass and no players moving in support of the ball carrier. The first part is probably because none of them can pass the ball to a moving target unless they are on the passer's shoulder. Very poor skill levels.
2) Pretorius and Barnes - cheif playmakers killed two try scoring chances with poor passes. How can Barnes pass a ball above S. Timani's head the bloke is 20' tall.
Second half:-
1)The Tahs kicked the ball 3 times. Every time it was very poor and directly led to Hurricanes scroing off two of these. (This takes their overall kick execution to 25%)
2)I counted 6 knock ons by the Tahs. No team can win if they cant hold the ball. Maybe that why they kick it. Some knock ons can be excused because of the weather but 6 in one half, and I probably missed some as my head was in my hands.
3)Again passes from Pretorius went along the ground and destroyed attacking chances.
4)Again no players running onto the ball in front of them to attack. All are static. It couldn't be better illustrated than by the Foley break up the middle, the reverse angle replay shows most of his team mates slow jogging towards the Cane's line and some are WALKING. FFS.
5)How does Vito get away with scooping the ball out of the Tahs ruck in the Canes 22 with his hand in front of Bryce @ the 75 minute mark.
6) 3rd Canes try very lucky as most would have called the ball knocked on by Smith.
7)Palu - I am sure that he will be lauded (I see Cyclo has already started it). Most of the metres he made tonight were done so by picking the ball up from an offside position at four (4) rucks where he stationed himself as the pillar. Smith rightly objected to this with Bryce to no avail. This was the first full game Palu has played this year, the plaudits are not deserved. Only one player deserves a pat on the back. Dave Denis.
General Views:-
1)The Tahs are clearly not fit (as Bruce as been saying all year). They were slowing the play down from the 30 minute mark.
2)S. Timani - the high praise he has received is premature IMO. People attack Higgers for playing loose. This is precisely where Timani is most of the time. I will add the scrum was under pressure and very lucky not to be penalised while he was on. When he went off the scrum became totally dominant.
One major question I have, after watching the Shute Shield played in the mud bath at Manly Oval this afternoon and seeing Alcock run in two fine tries, why was he dropped from the 22? Especially given that the Tahs obviously went out with a no kick strategy. My view is that Alcock is the fall guy for the poor defence as Carter is for the poor attack. Interesting that the mid field was still a sieve without Alcock. IMO AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is not a 12.
First Half:-
9 kicks - 6 poor including two kicks on turnover ball on attack in the Hurricanes half. 3 well executed territorial kicks. 33% of kicks well executed. Much improved on the 13% from a couple of weeks ago when I first did this. Of note was the mindset to run the ball, in wet heavy condition, even from their own half. I am not one of those fools who decry the kicking game indeed in such conditions with the Tahs lack of passing skills why do they try to run the ball from their own half?
Other points of note:-
1) No players moving at pace onto a pass and no players moving in support of the ball carrier. The first part is probably because none of them can pass the ball to a moving target unless they are on the passer's shoulder. Very poor skill levels.
2) Pretorius and Barnes - cheif playmakers killed two try scoring chances with poor passes. How can Barnes pass a ball above S. Timani's head the bloke is 20' tall.
Second half:-
1)The Tahs kicked the ball 3 times. Every time it was very poor and directly led to Hurricanes scroing off two of these. (This takes their overall kick execution to 25%)
2)I counted 6 knock ons by the Tahs. No team can win if they cant hold the ball. Maybe that why they kick it. Some knock ons can be excused because of the weather but 6 in one half, and I probably missed some as my head was in my hands.
3)Again passes from Pretorius went along the ground and destroyed attacking chances.
4)Again no players running onto the ball in front of them to attack. All are static. It couldn't be better illustrated than by the Foley break up the middle, the reverse angle replay shows most of his team mates slow jogging towards the Cane's line and some are WALKING. FFS.
5)How does Vito get away with scooping the ball out of the Tahs ruck in the Canes 22 with his hand in front of Bryce @ the 75 minute mark.
6) 3rd Canes try very lucky as most would have called the ball knocked on by Smith.
7)Palu - I am sure that he will be lauded (I see Cyclo has already started it). Most of the metres he made tonight were done so by picking the ball up from an offside position at four (4) rucks where he stationed himself as the pillar. Smith rightly objected to this with Bryce to no avail. This was the first full game Palu has played this year, the plaudits are not deserved. Only one player deserves a pat on the back. Dave Denis.
General Views:-
1)The Tahs are clearly not fit (as Bruce as been saying all year). They were slowing the play down from the 30 minute mark.
2)S. Timani - the high praise he has received is premature IMO. People attack Higgers for playing loose. This is precisely where Timani is most of the time. I will add the scrum was under pressure and very lucky not to be penalised while he was on. When he went off the scrum became totally dominant.
One major question I have, after watching the Shute Shield played in the mud bath at Manly Oval this afternoon and seeing Alcock run in two fine tries, why was he dropped from the 22? Especially given that the Tahs obviously went out with a no kick strategy. My view is that Alcock is the fall guy for the poor defence as Carter is for the poor attack. Interesting that the mid field was still a sieve without Alcock. IMO AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is not a 12.
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
Fixed for you. Resign. Walk away and take the board with them. Let somebody else train them for the four weeks to the next game. Those who have threatened to leave if Foley is sacked can immediately take their severance as well.[/quote]
J
Jiggles
Guest
I disagreed with you. My observation of the game was that he was one of the Tahs better players, which was the point of my post. I think you are selling his game short tonight. I'm not starting anything.
ACR
Desmond Connor (43)
Pretty much sums it up. I'll add (because it's fun to criticize); DECISION MAKING. I don't know how they do it in the juniors in Australia but the NZ u-20's focus on this and are selected accordingly. The skill set on offence is woeful, asides from TPN (via brute force) and occasionally AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) and Foley. It's just all too slow and static, no one running straight lines or effective dummy runs. Unluckily you ended up with a dud in Sarel Pretorious, too slow in everything and a poor passer regardless (which they already knew). Doesn't have the opportunities to take on the line like last year which was his only positive. Barnes doesn't have a lot to work with but he sill hasn't been good enough. Compare to Carter and Cruden who both unlocked rushing defences this weekend with their kicking.
I think Foley should just forget about trying to develop a style for the Waratahs and just out and out copy the work NZ sides do off the ball.
rugbysmartarse
Alan Cameron (40)
I'm back and forth on the foley thing. I often wonder however what the fuck they do at training. It's obviously not drills. Is it all analysis?
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
4 times from an offside position for the vast majority of his metres. I would say any other ref but Bryce, but we had that incident by Franks last night. My point is that he may well have been one of the better performers in a poor unit, but he was still one of the ones walking or slow jogging. IMO Denis is the only one who should walk tall.
rugbysmartarse
Alan Cameron (40)
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
What then is the point of your other posts. Of course the Coach has no responsibility for how the players play week in week out.
J
Jiggles
Guest
ACR,
I think criticism for criticisms sake is a poor traite to have. but besides that you have some valid points. I think a lot of the pressure Barnes feels is due to slow ball he gets, and a lot of that is due to a lack of fitness, work rate, and general urgency displaced by the Tah forwards.
I think criticism for criticisms sake is a poor traite to have. but besides that you have some valid points. I think a lot of the pressure Barnes feels is due to slow ball he gets, and a lot of that is due to a lack of fitness, work rate, and general urgency displaced by the Tah forwards.
D
daz
Guest
Sorry guys, I try not to criticise Oz franchises but on this occasion I can't help myself. That was fucking embarassing and woeful by the Tahs. Do we need another intervention to wake you all up?
The team is under pressure, the coach is under pressure, the management is under pressure and the fans are (yet again) disenfranchised. So what response do you give? Zero tries to four, at home. No cohesion, lack of basic balls skills and the barest hint of a game plan.
Fuck me, is this a club with 130 years of history in a rugby heartland, or should we just close the gates and hand the place over to another AFL expansion team?
Show some fucking pride in the jumper.
For the fans and supporters, I feel your pain.
The team is under pressure, the coach is under pressure, the management is under pressure and the fans are (yet again) disenfranchised. So what response do you give? Zero tries to four, at home. No cohesion, lack of basic balls skills and the barest hint of a game plan.
Fuck me, is this a club with 130 years of history in a rugby heartland, or should we just close the gates and hand the place over to another AFL expansion team?
Show some fucking pride in the jumper.
For the fans and supporters, I feel your pain.
J
Jiggles
Guest
I can see the type of game that Foley is trying to play, but there is just no urgency in the execution which is solely down to the players.
However they are also unfit, so I concede ground there which is an area Foley should be responsible for.
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
Is that what it is? I thought I had an aim with my crtitique. That would to seek improvement, as with anything else I am professionally called on to critique, even if I just do this because I love the game and have followed the Tahs for more years than I care to remember.
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