Waratahs V Force - Superugby Rd 4

[No4918]

As to the current sides merits - are the personnel really that good? I suspect that none of their backs would make a wallaby starting side if it was picked today, maybe only one forward would (Robinson). Maybe we are overrating the personnel that were involved in this game?

Don't think there are many players around Oz in general really putting there hands up demanding selection at this stage. Pyle and Higgers, Dennis done ok, Schatz looks good at 8 and can play McCalmans role better if Deans sticks with that type of 8.

 

[Slim 293]

I was backing your point of view regarding high expectations of the tahs team. Surely even you see that both AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) and Horne are well down on form? Not to mention tpn as well.

Horne isn't playing well... and his defence isn't up to scratch...

If we were to pick a team based solely on the form of the first 4 rounds he wouldn't make it..

 

[Slim 293]

Don't think there are many players around Oz in general really putting there hands up demanding selection at this stage. Pyle and Higgers, Dennis done ok, Schatz looks good at 8 and can play McCalmans role better if Deans sticks with that type of 8.

Fardy and Mowen have been impressive for the Brumbies too...

But, too early in the season to tell...

 

[MrMouse]

I do feel as though we should perhaps wait until May at least before selecting our Wobblies squads. But I'd have to agree w/ Slim, particularly on Horney.

 

[Hawko]

Well...didn't see that result coming, that's for sure.Well done to the Force for playing to their limited strengths and hanging in there. I watched the whole game waiting for the inevitable Tah breakaway and it just didn't happen. Seemed like Barnes was the only one trying to play attacking footy for the Tah's in the second half, and you could see his frustration that his runners just weren't there. Thought Timani was good when he came on as well.

While I agree that Barnes' support runners were just not there, some of the worst kicking in the game came from Barnes' boot. Overall I thought Hangers' kicking was more effective than Barnes' was. What incensed me was outside backs thinking that it was better to grubber, corner or chip kick than to take it into contact and recycle. Last week the Canes had similar possession to the Tahs and put on six tries. If I recall correctly, none of them came from kicks.

Overall I thought Barnes had a poor game, though few players last night had good ones.

 

[MrMouse]

3. Dennis
2. Dennis
1. Dennis

Yup, I'm giving all my points to Dave Dennis. HM to Barnes, who was ok, Carter, who was great off the bench but played very few minutes, and DM to Dean Mumm's autonomous limb, for giving us the boost we needed early on.

Being generous you could give pass marks to Kepu, Douglas, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), Kingston and Timani.

 

[Ruggo]

Well that was f*cked

I can cope with losing, but what I struggle with is a side not appearing to put in. This may sound silly, but an easy try early and they seemed to think the game was done and they could coast.

So .. .. ..

Why the total change in approach at the breakdown?
Against the Highlanders they were agressive at the breakdown, why the next week stand off and have tackling practise, simply why no counter ruck? Why no clean out?
Why were the backs so lateral?
Who in the backs was to be direct?
Why kick it away in a game where you are struggling to get possession?

But to the Force congrats, they were better on the night, Graham has a well drilled side that plays to their abilities and strengths

Spot on and very well said. I can only conclude that they did not show respect for the opposition and it is a very blunt reminder that you always have two respect your opposition. No easy games in this competition.

What has me perplexed with the Tahs is they went through the exact same situation 12 months ago and have learnt jack shit.

I think I know the answer but the blunt reality will only start a shit fight on the forum. I'm not touching this one with a 40ft pole.

 

[MrMouse]

I think I know the answer but the blunt reality will only start a shit fight on the forum. I'm not touching this one with a 40ft pole.

I'm curious, but you're probably right. Then again, most things can start shit fights here

 

[Lachlan]

Well done Force. True to form, the game turned into a snoozer. What a boring second half display. I was watching this with 4 mates and 2 of us were asleep by the final whistle.

 

[fatprop]

The tahs have had good teams, but have they ever had great ones? They have always lacked for a top line flyhalf which has limited their greatness. They did very well to make the two finals they did.

The tahs have had good coaches, but have they ever had great ones? Their best recent one was let go, and then got better afterwards.

Their game plans have often been a little one dimensional, but often executed well. It means you get to the 4-5 position, but can't really seal the deal.

As to the current sides merits - are the personnel really that good? I suspect that none of their backs would make a wallaby starting side if it was picked today, maybe only one forward would (Robinson). Maybe we are overrating the personnel that were involved in this game?

yep, no decent fly half since Ella, Barnes is the closest to quality we have had.

coach? Dwyer was/is a great coach and Link had 5 years, very few get more than that if they don't win.

Of the current side Wobs? A bit harsh, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) & Barnes would be selected as well

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Fair enough, write three people you believe could conduct a review without bias or preconceived ideas that you would be happy to do such a thing.

Gary Flowers
Justice P R Garling
Justice C R R Hoeben

 

[RedsHappy]

....No a coach is not judged soley on anything. That is the point. The Force forwards have been very good and a great strength for many years, found primarily and led well by Sharpe and Pocock so I do not attribute any great degree of this part of their game to Graham, but would readily concede that the game plan suited the strengths of the Force and so it was a prudent and well thought out plan for the day.....

I have been very critical of the Force's board, management and coaching as I see them as 'busy getting nowhere' over 6+ years of IMO wasted opportunity. I stand by my overall concerns and observations, but, as Gnostic says above, last night's game plan and its execution was sound as a way of exploiting the remarkable 'let's do it again' incompetence of the Tahs in front of their home crowd. Good on them, a good win and just when needed. And a significant improvement on how they played the Tahs in Sydney in 2011...now let's see how they handle the Rebels and Reds next up.

 

[Waylon]

What another rubbish Australian derby, fucking so sick of sitting through this garbage.....

So true

Despite being delighted about the Force winning, the game was so bad it left a sour taste

 

[Waylon]

Horne isn't playing well... and his defence isn't up to scratch...

Horne is letting in soft tries every week. It has been very noticeable how many one on one tackles he's missing. I haven't seen too much from him with the ball either. Pretty disappointing for one with so much ability and a reputation as a good defender. Mindset issues perhaps?

 

[Ruggo]

Horne is letting in soft tries every week. It has been very noticeable how many one on one tackles he's missing. I haven't seen too much from him with the ball either. Pretty disappointing for one with so much ability and a reputation as a good defender. Mindset issues perhaps?

Not in great form but I feel for the poor fella. When his body is going too break down again I am sure weighs heavily on his mind. If there was ever a player who could be forgiven for being a bit down on confidence.

 

[Scotty]

They're all proven performers, the Wallabies aren't being selected this week you know? Again more panic because of one performance.

I said 'the way they are going' (ie if they don't improve) and my original post said 'if the wallabies were selected tomorrow....'

 

[Scotty]

yep, no decent fly half since Ella, Barnes is the closest to quality we have had.

coach? Dwyer was/is a great coach and Link had 5 years, very few get more than that if they don't win.

Of the current side Wobs? A bit harsh, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) & Barnes would be selected as well

In the starting side I doubt barnes would be selected over JOC (James O'Connor), or AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) over Beale, Ioane or even Vuna. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) has been decidedly average for over 12 months.

I wasn't considering Dwyer a 'recent' coach.

 

[fatprop]

In the starting side I doubt barnes would be selected over JOC (James O'Connor), or AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) over Beale, Ioane or even Vuna. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) has been decidedly average for over 12 months.

I wasn't considering Dwyer a 'recent' coach.

JOC (James O'Connor) and Barnes would be in the starting side at 10/12

AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) on the wing, Vuna meh

 

[Shiggins]

Anyone who thinks the force planned for a boo fest again is silly

The force Did there best in attacking. The backs saw a good part of the ball. Should they apologize for not having world class backs that can lift up the stage and do crazy things that only a couple of players in each aus team can do. The tahs have a Few. Pretorius, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), Horne for example. They didn't do anything because they didn't have the ball.
Most of the tah fans on the forum have Been good sports but for the few people who have talked about a boring game I'm not apologizing for not having players like digby, JOC (James O'Connor), beal, Davies. I was very happy with the effort of the backline on sat night.




Http://www.youtube.com/shiggins316

 

[qwerty51]

I said 'the way they are going' (ie if they don't improve) and my original post said 'if the wallabies were selected tomorrow....'

And if it was selected tomorrow you don't pick people on a couple of weeks form. You'd pick proven performers. The best backline atm is still Genia JOC (James O'Connor) Ioane Barnes/Tapuai/Horne AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) Beale

Horne was named to be at 13 vs Wales but was injured during the week