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cyclopath said:
I was near that corner and it looked like a try for all money, live that is. But the TJ/AR was right on the spot and a replay on the big screen showed AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) did a touch too much than "immediately reach out and ground the ball over the goal line", Law 22.4(e). He was tackled and while held tried to reach out, which he's allowed to do, but if he doesn't score in that first reach, he's fucked. Then the matter of momentum occurred to me, but that won't get him home either: "If...the player's momentum carries the player in a continuous movement along the ground...", Law 22.4(d). AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)'s momentum was on top of the Tah tackler, not along the ground. Good decision by the TJ/AR.
Hawko
Tony Shaw (54)
On that display and last week's I don't think the Brumbies deserve to make the four. Giteau was poor and has to go to 12. Tyrone has to be dropped. Huxley probably the only option left for 10. Rocky is not impacting on the game as a marquee player should. Chisholm should retire immediately. They have some promise but need a good coach.
The Waratahs can make the four and maybe get a home semi if they win all three games with maybe a couple of BP's. But on tonight's display I don't think they can. The basic problems are:
1. Hickey's inability to set the Tahs on a gameplan that will win them games against the top teams. The Crusaders gameplan was poor and tonight's consisted of "show 100 different ways to kick the ball".
2. Weismantel's inability to coach a backline to run and pass effectively.
3. Without Horne at 13, there is no real penetration.
4. The game has moved on but Barnes has not. He doesn't understand that kicking now must be a surprise tactic by the 10, and the function of the 12 is to run at the defensive line and set up his supports. For the Wallabies he is now 4th choice for 12 behind O'Connor, Fainga'a and Giteau (in that order).
5. Burgess and Holmes have shown they are unable to quickly clear the ball to 10 and let the backline run free. Both need benching. The deplorable decision not to give McKibbin any game time earlier in the year against some of the weaker teams means he's had no time to get experience at S14 level and no time for us to see if he's any good. But I would still try him as run on against the Highlanders with Burgess to take over if he fails. I'm desperate.
6. Mowen is not Palu and we need to devise strategies to make ground with his skills. He can't copy Palu and be successful.
7. We need to set the forward attack lines slightly wider and have two separate pods working so that its not obvious where the point of attack will be. Right now the Tahs are easy pickings.
8. Kepu cannot cut it at LHP and is a THP nightmare. He has to be dropped for Palmer even though this will benefit the Brumbies next year. When Palmer came on tonight the scrum was being monstered and it instantly improved. I would play Palmer at THP next week to give him some serious game time. If Benny is still out I would play him at LHP and Baxter at THP. I hope Benny is OK because Kepu or Tilse as reserve terrifies me.
9. Robinson and TPN have to play finals, their replacements are not in the same class yet. Fitzpatrick could be but he's still very young for a front rower. So, they should not be rushed back next week if giving them another week will ensure they fully heal.
If any of the coaching staff think that tonight's performance is good enough to win the final and that urgent action doesn't need to be taken immediately, they should be shown the door. This is last chance stuff - even though the top three teams must collectively lose points the Tahs cannot win as they are playing now.
The Waratahs can make the four and maybe get a home semi if they win all three games with maybe a couple of BP's. But on tonight's display I don't think they can. The basic problems are:
1. Hickey's inability to set the Tahs on a gameplan that will win them games against the top teams. The Crusaders gameplan was poor and tonight's consisted of "show 100 different ways to kick the ball".
2. Weismantel's inability to coach a backline to run and pass effectively.
3. Without Horne at 13, there is no real penetration.
4. The game has moved on but Barnes has not. He doesn't understand that kicking now must be a surprise tactic by the 10, and the function of the 12 is to run at the defensive line and set up his supports. For the Wallabies he is now 4th choice for 12 behind O'Connor, Fainga'a and Giteau (in that order).
5. Burgess and Holmes have shown they are unable to quickly clear the ball to 10 and let the backline run free. Both need benching. The deplorable decision not to give McKibbin any game time earlier in the year against some of the weaker teams means he's had no time to get experience at S14 level and no time for us to see if he's any good. But I would still try him as run on against the Highlanders with Burgess to take over if he fails. I'm desperate.
6. Mowen is not Palu and we need to devise strategies to make ground with his skills. He can't copy Palu and be successful.
7. We need to set the forward attack lines slightly wider and have two separate pods working so that its not obvious where the point of attack will be. Right now the Tahs are easy pickings.
8. Kepu cannot cut it at LHP and is a THP nightmare. He has to be dropped for Palmer even though this will benefit the Brumbies next year. When Palmer came on tonight the scrum was being monstered and it instantly improved. I would play Palmer at THP next week to give him some serious game time. If Benny is still out I would play him at LHP and Baxter at THP. I hope Benny is OK because Kepu or Tilse as reserve terrifies me.
9. Robinson and TPN have to play finals, their replacements are not in the same class yet. Fitzpatrick could be but he's still very young for a front rower. So, they should not be rushed back next week if giving them another week will ensure they fully heal.
If any of the coaching staff think that tonight's performance is good enough to win the final and that urgent action doesn't need to be taken immediately, they should be shown the door. This is last chance stuff - even though the top three teams must collectively lose points the Tahs cannot win as they are playing now.
Langthorne
Phil Hardcastle (33)
On Giteau and Barnes:
they both showed flashes of OK to good play, but also flashes of poor to utterly crap.
Barnes is kicking a little too often, and not always well. But to be fair, one of his kicks led to a great try, and quite a few did make good touch (i can only assume there was a 'play it in their half' game plan). Barnes' defence is excellent, and his running and passing game has improved gradually over the season (but still has some way to go).
Giteau looked better Vs the Tahs than against the Canes, but again not as good as he could. His running game, when it appeared, was good, but was not as effective as if he was at 12. The Brumbies backline was generally poor, with the wingers being the pick of the bunch. This is a difficult situation for a number 10 to deal with.
Another problem both of them had is that their forwards rarely set a good platform for sweeping back play - I guess you could say i was down to them being evenly matched as opposed to plain rubbish....maybe a bit of both
they both showed flashes of OK to good play, but also flashes of poor to utterly crap.
Barnes is kicking a little too often, and not always well. But to be fair, one of his kicks led to a great try, and quite a few did make good touch (i can only assume there was a 'play it in their half' game plan). Barnes' defence is excellent, and his running and passing game has improved gradually over the season (but still has some way to go).
Giteau looked better Vs the Tahs than against the Canes, but again not as good as he could. His running game, when it appeared, was good, but was not as effective as if he was at 12. The Brumbies backline was generally poor, with the wingers being the pick of the bunch. This is a difficult situation for a number 10 to deal with.
Another problem both of them had is that their forwards rarely set a good platform for sweeping back play - I guess you could say i was down to them being evenly matched as opposed to plain rubbish....maybe a bit of both
T
TOCC
Guest
Moses said:
ToccFan
Bruce Ross
Ken Catchpole (46)
cyclopath said:
The essential point here is the need to change one's mindset. Instead of thinking of the bloke with the whistle as the "ref", it is much more sensible to view him as the "RDG" - as in "Random Decision Generator".
This is particularly so with regard to scrums but applies more generally; given the complexity of the Rugby Laws and the huge number of decisions that have to be made while breathlessly running up and down the field. It is worth bearing in mind that the number of whistle-blowing decisions made by a Random would be greatly exceeded by the times when his decision is not to blow the whistle.
And who knows how many times the whistle is blown simply because the Random needs a breather?
Had Hoiles adopted this pragmatic approach he would not have made the elementary mistake of turning the Random into a "Non-Random Decision Generator". Then, of course, crafty old Phil, with his years of experience in manipulating Randoms, did his best to ensure that Walsh stayed that way by brown-nosing him. Even Randoms need friends, though in this case a very obviously fair weather one.
Apoplectic spectators would do well to adopt the Random viewpoint. Their protestations are about as productive as shaking your fist at the weather. And as they age they not only run the risk of seizure but also being strangled in their sleep by a long-suffering spouse.
Langthorne said:
When playing a side whose tries all season are coming from props diving over or halves getting around the edges, it makes a lot of sense to require them to score from 75 metres away, especially when all they do is up and unders from that far out.
Scarfman
Knitter of the Scarf
Some good reviews on here - cheers Langthorne and Hawko.
I really thought that up-n-unders in your own half was consigned to the 2009 dustbin, but apparently it lives on the hearts of a few Wallabies. I would rather have the ball on my own 40 than have a 30% shot at it on their 40.
The fact that the game was rubbish didn't surprise me at all. But having the Brumbies win the scrums and rucks really did. Shows what Robbo and Palu are worth. A LOT!
Mumm deserves a big kick up the arse for not getting his piggies to lift. In short: Waratah backs save the arse of Waratah forwards SHOCK.
I really thought that up-n-unders in your own half was consigned to the 2009 dustbin, but apparently it lives on the hearts of a few Wallabies. I would rather have the ball on my own 40 than have a 30% shot at it on their 40.
The fact that the game was rubbish didn't surprise me at all. But having the Brumbies win the scrums and rucks really did. Shows what Robbo and Palu are worth. A LOT!
Mumm deserves a big kick up the arse for not getting his piggies to lift. In short: Waratah backs save the arse of Waratah forwards SHOCK.
TheRiddler
Dave Cowper (27)
NTA said:
Nick, your membership is in serious doubt. Hawko, your card is in the post.
Maybe a slightly one-eyed view here but was very disappointed that Alcock didnt get a good 10 minutes game time at the end. The breakdowns were ugly all night and with a tiring pack you would have thought that a young, fit, aggressive loosey that was pretty much man of the match on his debut performance could have torn it up. However, such an action would have required a good game plan from the management and the ability to react appropriately to the circumstances . Enough said.
And Giteau was shite. And so was Elsom.
Reddy!
Bob Davidson (42)
Thanks for that Langthorne. Not that I don't care how the other players went, but if the Tahs and Brumbies keep playing unconvincing rugby (although at least the Tahs have a game plan to work to) wallaby selection for their players is going to be the topic of discussion in the coming weeks rather than finals footy.
mark_s
Chilla Wilson (44)
I reckon Deans would be pretty depressed about the game last night, the conservative mindless tactics, the sloppy execution, the lack of continuity but most importantly the poor form of 2009 Wallabies like Moore, Chilshom, Giteau and Elsom. The only mitigating factors are the injury lists (especially for the brumbies) and the crap playing conditions last night at homebush.
It seems like both teams have struggled with the weight of expectation this year. It took the brumbies 80mins to start taking risks last night, as a tahs fan I was glad they didn't try much earlier but thats a very short termist view. It will be interesting to see how the brumbies bounce back next week with effectively nothing to lose. The Reds on the other hand have approached most games with an attitude of lets have a crack. I will never be a reds fan but their run has been admirable this year. Lets see how they go next week going in a favourites away from home.
While I am normally a fan of Walsh, his performance was bizzare last night, leaving aside the accuracy or otherwise of individual decisions, the string of scrum penalties and other infringements should have seen him going to the pocket early in the second half.
The AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) no try decision was wrong in my view, I would hate for the tahs to lose the bledisloe on a no try decision like that.
Both captains are ripe for criticism from a leadership perspective. Waughs decision making was poor - why opt for scrums when they were a lottery last night? Hoiles just shouldn't be captain, the evidence is there for all to see last night?
For the tahs, our lack of punch close to the rucks was obvious, but not surprising with both TPN and Palu were out. We are no chance in this comp if TPN stays injured. Waugh, Barnes and Beale were probably our best in general play. Holmes and Baxter were probably our worst.
Brumbies best were AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) and ?, I guess Mccabe tried hard.
It seems like both teams have struggled with the weight of expectation this year. It took the brumbies 80mins to start taking risks last night, as a tahs fan I was glad they didn't try much earlier but thats a very short termist view. It will be interesting to see how the brumbies bounce back next week with effectively nothing to lose. The Reds on the other hand have approached most games with an attitude of lets have a crack. I will never be a reds fan but their run has been admirable this year. Lets see how they go next week going in a favourites away from home.
While I am normally a fan of Walsh, his performance was bizzare last night, leaving aside the accuracy or otherwise of individual decisions, the string of scrum penalties and other infringements should have seen him going to the pocket early in the second half.
The AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) no try decision was wrong in my view, I would hate for the tahs to lose the bledisloe on a no try decision like that.
Both captains are ripe for criticism from a leadership perspective. Waughs decision making was poor - why opt for scrums when they were a lottery last night? Hoiles just shouldn't be captain, the evidence is there for all to see last night?
For the tahs, our lack of punch close to the rucks was obvious, but not surprising with both TPN and Palu were out. We are no chance in this comp if TPN stays injured. Waugh, Barnes and Beale were probably our best in general play. Holmes and Baxter were probably our worst.
Brumbies best were AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) and ?, I guess Mccabe tried hard.
sevenpointdropgoal
Larry Dwyer (12)
I've got to say that I didn't really think last nights game was all that alarming. Admittedly it wasn't a good time to be a spectator, but given the late season pressure, the local derby flavour, the injury toll, the ref and the slippery conditions, it was exactly what I expected to happen. It's also a fantastic illustration of what happens when your pack has been weakened, and you have two crap halfbacks on the field. If your halfbacks are taking 10 seconds to clear easy balls then the rest of your backs haven't got a hope in hell of doing anything worthwhile.
It'll be interesting to see whether Gits might finally rise to the occasion next week against the Reds. He's always made it clear that he'd rather be dead than playing anywhere other than number ten, and if he doesn't pull up his socks next week he might find himself walking onto the Tri Nations field with ten minutes to go wearing a reserves number.
On the plus side; I am pleasantly surprised by how well Beale is coming along. For a guy who promised so much, I was afraid that he'd be soon added to the enormous Australian utility back scrapheap, but fullback seems to be working for him ad he's looking more and more comfortable every game I see him play. He's not there yet, but I have faith.
It'll be interesting to see whether Gits might finally rise to the occasion next week against the Reds. He's always made it clear that he'd rather be dead than playing anywhere other than number ten, and if he doesn't pull up his socks next week he might find himself walking onto the Tri Nations field with ten minutes to go wearing a reserves number.
On the plus side; I am pleasantly surprised by how well Beale is coming along. For a guy who promised so much, I was afraid that he'd be soon added to the enormous Australian utility back scrapheap, but fullback seems to be working for him ad he's looking more and more comfortable every game I see him play. He's not there yet, but I have faith.
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