Waratahs 2021

[Braveheart81]

I agree that a quality THP is essential to allow HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes) to return to the LH side where he was developing as a real Wallaby prospect.

Who would the Tahs be likely to recruit that is better?

How long (if at all) will HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes) stay ahead of Bell at LHP?

I don't think there is a strong likelihood that he will be moving and I'd argue that Tupou and AAA are the only THPs better than him in the country.

For whatever reason the Waratahs have had a weak scrum for a number of years. The same front rowers look much better at scrum time for the Wallabies than they do for the Tahs.

 

[Drew]

Robertson played TH too, but he’s gone. I think he’s doing admirable job there. I think his bulking up for the harder position has lessened his impact in other parts of his game. If he plays there, so be it, he’s a good player who has already proven he can adapt and survive. But to me it showcases the disservice through lack of forward planning the board have done the Tahs faithful. Alongside not retaining and developing quality locking options and general bad squad management. Harrison and Bell are talented, it would’ve been better for them to work their way into a structure instead of being thrown straight into key positions.

 

[fatprop]

Agree there. Another example of no succession planning from the management. Kepu left, we have two wallaby LHPs and a promising rookie LHP; eenie, meanie, miney, mo (selector points at HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes)) you’re our new THP. I know he played both sides coming through, but it was a big ask. Another example of Tahs forward planning is that 3 years ago HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes) was playing 10-15 minutes off the bench, now he’s a senior player. Then Gibson selects smaller, more mobile locks to suit his game plan, chases off any up and coming bigger locks, leaves early on his contract and here we are.
If all these rookies and near rookies can build some cohesion around a simpler, more direct game plan, we will hope to see something good by seasons end into next year. We have to play like a tier 2 nation in the World Cup or the Force last year with their limited roster.

Wasn't HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes) in the Wobs squad as a THP?

 

[Drew]

Both

 

[Finsbury Girl]

Not sure if it was discussed elsewhere, saw on the Australian, Campo offered to come and help out at the 'tahs, was told to piss off (that last bit me para phrasing).

I know Campo is a polarising figure but geez you'd think one of the greatest wingers this country has produced would at least have something useful to add.

Very sad when he said no kids at his clinics could name a current wallaby.

 

[Blackadder]

Sadly, I was very wrong about the Tahs this season. I thought this team of youngsters would put up a much better showing than they have.

At this point the only hope is that they can improve as the season wears on and that having played the best two teams away, they're significantly more competitive against the Force and Rebels.

This Friday at home against the Force is a huge game for that reason.

I'm not sure what Penney could have done differently if the the Tahs are underspending the other teams by around $1m. That is a huge figure as a percentage of the overall wage bill and makes it very clear why we are only recruiting journeymen and kids. There's little point blaming him for letting people go if the salary budget he was left with literally made it impossible to offer existing players anywhere close to what they were already being paid (let alone competing with their overseas offers).

I don't see the point firing him at this stage. What is their to gain by putting one of the assistants in charge? It would be such a poisoned chalice for whoever took over. His position could become untenable very soon though. If the losses continue like this you just have to let him go even if it isn't actually going to solve anything.

Roger Davis absolutely needs to go as Chairman. He has been in the role for a long time and since 2014, things have steadily gone downhill. He's made many questionable public statements and actions over that time.

1 million dollars is a lot but a large amount of that is Hooper who isn't getting paid by the Tahs at the moment. It is stupid to be that far under but I have heard the Tahs are even further under than that. I understand poor finances but to compete you need to be equal to the other sides.

Penney's game plan did not work last year and isn't working this year. He has recruited poorly and had the say in who to release by his own admissions.

Our forward pack is being owned. Our defence as a team is shocking. Our attack is pointless hot potato throw the ball around hope for the best is rubbish. That is on Penney and the coaching team he put together.

I agree that the Tahs would probably give the coaching to one of the assistants and knowing the dumb management it would be Whittaker who should NEVER have been re-signed as part of the coaching team.

The team looks like headless chooks and many players look disinterested.

I agree re Rodger Davis

 

[Blackadder]

Bell should be coming off the bench as he is still young and still learning his craft. He is expected to mark people with way more experience and that is daunting enough but in the run on while still learning is stupid.

 

[hifflepiff]

Not sure if it was discussed elsewhere, saw on the Australian, Campo offered to come and help out at the 'tahs, was told to piss off (that last bit me para phrasing).

I know Campo is a polarising figure but geez you'd think one of the greatest wingers this country has produced would at least have something useful to add.

Very sad when he said no kids at his clinics could name a current wallaby.

Rugby's changed a lot since Campo's days, and judging by the analysis of his that I've seen I dont think he'd offer much of interest. But who knows, I doubt it could be much worse.

 

[Braveheart81]

Bell should be coming off the bench as he is still young and still learning his craft. He is expected to mark people with way more experience and that is daunting enough but in the run on while still learning is stupid.

He's struggling with the overall weakness of the scrum.

He played tests last year with Slipper injured and could push his way past Sio this year to be the Wallabies second choice with everyone available.

It would obviously be great if we had more test props in our squad but I don't think it is a reasonable expectation that a current Wallaby should be a bench player at Super Rugby level just because they're young.

Bell is better than most options we could recruit.

 

[Blackadder]

He's struggling with the overall weakness of the scrum.

He played tests last year with Slipper injured and could push his way past Sio this year to be the Wallabies second choice with everyone available.

It would obviously be great if we had more test props in our squad but I don't think it is a reasonable expectation that a current Wallaby should be a bench player at Super Rugby level just because they're young.

Bell is better than most options we could recruit.

Firstly bell should be learning off experienced players and they don't have to be test players. He is struggling at the scrum and needs to learn.

I don't agree with you that he should push past Sio. Eventually I hope so but not yet.

 

[The Grey Man]

What bullshit - I didn't say that at all. The Waratahs were thumped - everyone knows that but why kick them when they are down?

We have a complete match thread dedicated to kicking the Tahs when they are down. After two very woeful performances they damn well deserve some decent arse kicking. Why are you not on that thread preaching your philosophy?

Are you from the Penny family? Mr Penny also seems to think that some "love" will fix all ills in Tah land.

Why are you singling me out for being disappointed by these two woeful Team performances, and continuing to accuse me of being a Craig family relative?

In case you actually cared for somewhat inconvenient facts, an actual Craig Family relative has confirmed on another thread that I am not a Craig family member.

The actual Craig Family member has asked me to refrain from posting about Ed and inflaming the delicate sensitivities of others. I will crawl back into my hole and go back to the Woodies Shute Shield thread where I seem to be less of a polarising and inflammatory figure.

Good luck in your Sugar and Spice and All Things Nice World.

You will still find me at all Tah's and Woodies home matches. Even though they are useless this year, I have invested a lot of time, money and emotion over the years supporting my Club and State team, and a crap couple of years on the field ain't going to change that.

 

[sendit]

settle down Mr Craig

 

[Braveheart81]

Firstly bell should be learning off experienced players and they don't have to be test players. He is struggling at the scrum and needs to learn.

I don't agree with you that he should push past Sio. Eventually I hope so but not yet.

He has Tetera Faulkner to learn from who is a seasoned professional. Bell is already better than him. I don't think Bell gets better faster by playing 25-30 minutes at the back of matches.

This season is going to be tough but hopefully if these guys persevere they will be better for it.

I'll still be there to support them. They're my team and you take the bad with the good.

 

[sendit]

It's almost like they're resigned to the fact they'll probably suck for a few years, are going to save as much money as they can now while they're not competitive and let alot of young lads have a dig and see who comes through it well.

Which to be honest isnt the worst tactic, they don't have a home stadium at the moment, they were going to take a large financial hit regardless of their on-field performance

 

[Drew]

Paul Cully in the herald thinks HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes)’s career has been stymied by bad roster management at the Tahs in being pushed to THP. As can be read from my previous posts I agree, although I’d dispute he won’t be a good THP ever, but you’ve gotta think Kepu moved there after 5 years playing LHP for the Tahs and wobs. And I understand these are probably the best guys in those positions in the squad at the moment, but the board members making the bad decisions aren’t the ones we watch, cheer, criticise on tv or at the games.

 

[Rugby Mum 2]

We have a complete match thread dedicated to kicking the Tahs when they are down. After two very woeful performances they damn well deserve some decent arse kicking. Why are you not on that thread preaching your philosophy?

Are you from the Penny family? Mr Penny also seems to think that some "love" will fix all ills in Tah land.

Why are you singling me out for being disappointed by these two woeful Team performances, and continuing to accuse me of being a Craig family relative?

In case you actually cared for somewhat inconvenient facts, an actual Craig Family relative has confirmed on another thread that I am not a Craig family member.

The actual Craig Family member has asked me to refrain from posting about Ed and inflaming the delicate sensitivities of others. I will crawl back into my hole and go back to the Woodies Shute Shield thread where I seem to be less of a polarising and inflammatory figure.

Good luck in your Sugar and Spice and All Things Nice World.

You will still find me at all Tah's and Woodies home matches. Even though they are useless this year, I have invested a lot of time, money and emotion over the years supporting my Club and State team, and a crap couple of years on the field ain't going to change that.

Aha, long term partner? Not that there is anything wrong with that but it was your vomit inducing sycophantic posts that drew my ire. Sugar and Spice World is so much nicer than cranky old man world

 

[Th0mo]

Doorn's focus is a little wider, working at all levels to improve the state of rugby in NSW, rather than worrying solely about what the pros do.

As someone who has spoken to him directly (if briefly) about this, I'm comforted that he's concerned with the wider game, as it is the only way to actually get NSW out of the shit it is in.

Of course, that relies on all the little political tinpot organisations getting on the same wavelength.

Here's the real crux of this year's mess. NSW is responsible for majority of community rugby players in Australia. The fact we don't have a player budget so we can get kids on the park is frustrating while the leaches crow about their success using our supporters money to pay our juniors.

Victories like Saturday night for the Brumbies are pyrrhic if we wind up cutting teams again.

 

[Drew]

If the Rebels, Force or Brumbies had been mismanaged by their boards or been flogged as bad as the Tahs have (albeit against last years Grand finalists) the newspapers and these forums would be talking merging or axing teams, not just sacking the coach.

 

[wamberal]

If the Rebels, Force or Brumbies had been mismanaged by their boards or been flogged as bad as the Tahs have (albeit against last years Grand finalists) the newspapers and these forums would be talking merging or axing teams, not just sacking the coach.

Yep, sack the franchise in the biggest rugby market in Australia. That'd make the game great again.

 

[Drew]

Not saying that at all. We all know the oldest provincial team in the country in the largest rugby market in the country is untouchable. It’s just the board seems to hide behind that fact, while those other teams aren’t given that leeway.