• Welcome to the forums of Green & Gold Rugby.
    We have recently made some changes to the amount of discussions boards on the forum.
    Over the coming months we will continue to make more changes to make the forum more user friendly for all to use.
    Thanks, Admin.

Waratahs 2020

fatprop

fatprop

George Gregan (70)
Staff member
Pass it to Dunning! said:
How dire has the Tahs season started that this thread has become an idle daydream about the schoolboys we lost to league?
Click to expand...


It is the RWc cost, we had a load of test players and the best attacking threat in the country - pretty well all gone

They have been replaced with kids, some will step up - many will be found out - some will get better and learn - some won't

Add to that we have essentially a new coaching staff
 
wamberal

wamberal

Phil Kearns (64)
Pfitzy said:
Would better spend the energy being outraged that our schoolboy/club pathway is so utterly broken.
Click to expand...



Can you explain that a bit more please? Are there barriers stopping schoolboys from trying out for their local club when they leave school, or are there not enough incentives? Or both?
 
upthereds#!

upthereds#!

Peter Johnson (47)
Are there any personnel changes that we think could make a 'game changing' difference from amongst the current squad? I'm feeling Moeroa and the new Japan 7s winger should get a crack. Just a bit of a point of difference that would be worth exploring.
 
7137

7137

Alex Ross (28)
upthereds#! said:
I'm feeling Moeroa and the new Japan 7s winger should get a crack. Just a bit of a point of difference that would be worth exploring.
Click to expand...

Our main issues do not exist in the jersey’s 9-15. Fix the lack of front foot ball or it won’t matter who the backline is stacked with. In 2014 we had a pack with Kepu, TPN, Skelton, Potgeiter, Palu, even Douglas was in good form. Compare that to our pack today.
 
Running_rugby_1954

Running_rugby_1954

Ron Walden (29)
7137 said:
Our main issues do not exist in the jersey’s 9-15. Fix the lack of front foot ball or it won’t matter who the backline is stacked with. In 2014 we had a pack with Kepu, TPN, Skelton, Potgeiter, Palu, even Douglas was in good form. Compare that to our pack today.
Click to expand...

Agree, the big issue for me is the tight five. They are just struggling at the breakdown and in contact.

I’m not sure if there are much better options floating around though.
 
Micheal

Micheal

Alan Cameron (40)
7137 said:
Our main issues do not exist in the jersey’s 9-15. Fix the lack of front foot ball or it won’t matter who the backline is stacked with. In 2014 we had a pack with Kepu, TPN, Skelton, Potgeiter, Palu, even Douglas was in good form. Compare that to our pack today.
Click to expand...

What wankers we were back then. Remember when we were all sick of Cliffy Palu? Said he was washed up? Remember when we were divided on Skelton?

I'd give my left arm to have those two back today. Sick of these bean stalk forwards who would lose a fight with their pillow.
 
Hawko

Hawko

Tony Shaw (54)
Running_rugby_1954 said:
Agree, the big issue for me is the tight five. They are just struggling at the breakdown and in contact.

I’m not sure if there are much better options floating around though.
Click to expand...


Its not just the tight five. The whole pack is made up of lightweight stringbeans who can run all day but cannot make any impact.

In 2014 the Waratah pack broke even with the All Black pack (aka the Crusaders pack). In 2020 the Waratah pack was monstered by the Canterbury reserve team pack. That's thanks to Hore and Gibson. It will take years to fix and we can write off this year and next year while younglings grow and new bigger forwards are recruited. That's always assuming that the present duo learn from their predecessors' mistakes, which is not a given.

This year is stuffed. We need to spend money for next year recruiting good forwards from NZ who are cut off from NZ team selection by the player log-jam in front of them. Remember Lurch and Whitelock return next year, automatically taking two of the eight available spots. NZ Super salaries are less than Australians and if we skew the squad money towards the forwards we could buy quality for two years while we develop our own. We might have to tell RA to stuff their rules for two years, but they understand the problem. There are NO developed, experienced power forwards available anywhere in Australia. They are all locked up at the Reds and Brumbies. None would want to come to Sydney and destroy their career playing in a pack of fluff-bunnies.
 
Jimmyjam

Jimmyjam

Watty Friend (18)
Pat Tafa had a very good shift in the A game... looked for work, put his hand up for plenty of carries and dented the line. IMO he has to be brought into the matchday squad.. definitely as a lock. Doesn't seem to have the foot-speed or agility to play in the back-row. I'd happily swap him for any of the other 3 cream-puffs we currently have in the lock department.. and you can add Holloway to that list as well. He's the reincarnation of Higginbottom, all show and no go. Unfortunately has all the tools but none of the grit required. Like Higginbottom, such a waste of talent.
 
hifflepiff

hifflepiff

Charlie Fox (21)
Bring Tafa and Harris onto the bench and drop Swinton, all bark and no bite.

I'd also bring Moeroa into outside centre as fundamentally the Tahs need go forward.

I think Harrison's done pretty well all things considered, but constantly going backwards has made him look worse than he is.
 
Hawko

Hawko

Tony Shaw (54)
Braveheart81 said:
I reckon Dempsey has had a free run so far this season.

To me, he's our second best forward on paper after Hooper and he's been completely anonymous.
Click to expand...


If he was playing in NZ he would only be considered for selection as a 7 or a bench 6. At the Waratahs he is our first-choice 8. Says it all.
 
Braveheart81

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
Hawko said:
If he was playing in NZ he would only be considered for selection as a 7 or a bench 6. At the Waratahs he is our first-choice 8. Says it all.
Click to expand...


He's allegedly taller and heavier than Ardie Savea and 2cm and 3kg less than Kieran Read.

He's put in some strong performances for the Wallabies at 6 and 8. I don't think it's reasonable to think he's being played out of position or that he's not big enough to play 6 or 8.

He's just playing poorly.

His size is in no way an outlier for the 6 or 8 jersey in Super Rugby where he has played this season.

Our forward pack is playing like lightweights far more than actually being lightweights. Our props are really the only positions where I think we are giving up a fair bit of size on average.
 
Tomikin

Tomikin

David Codey (61)
When's Hanigan back, for all the drama he got given at Test level he puts some shifts in at Super Rugby, Get Tafa in at bench lock, Harris in for bench Backrow
 
molman

molman

Jim Lenehan (48)
Hawko said:
Its not just the tight five. The whole pack is made up of lightweight stringbeans who can run all day but cannot make any impact....
Click to expand...

Braveheart81 said:
Our forward pack is playing like lightweights far more than actually being lightweights.
Click to expand...

Derpus said:
Dempsey's best games have all been in Gold. He's never hit his stride for the Tahs.
Click to expand...

My general thoughts are it's more a question of application than potential for many of these players. I don't agree that the current pack couldn't be doing better and that the issues are all because of genetic limitations (being light weight / string-beans / powder puffs). We've seen many of these players perform better at various points but they just don't appear to have the ability to back it up with any consistency. If you reflect on teams such as Japan you can see there are ways forward without just having an all out power game but it requires accuracy and players continually performing their roles with precision. We just seem to be stuck in a no mans land of lacking both the muscle and failing to show the skill.

People are mentioning bringing over Kiwis but if the culture and attitude isn't right I'm not sure it would help. Case in point how well did Angus Ta'avao go at the Waratahs? He looked so poor and then a season later you'd be drooling at the thought of him in the tight five yet you look at the obvious passion and pride he has when he runs out for the Chiefs that wasn't there at the Tahs.

For all his flaws, Cheika was a great people motivator. Getting the players working for each other, being better than the sum of their parts is just such a large part of the game.
 
molman

molman

Jim Lenehan (48)
Tomikin said:
When's Hanigan back, for all the drama he got given at Test level he puts some shifts in at Super Rugby, Get Tafa in at bench lock, Harris in for bench Backrow
Click to expand...

I agree re: Hanigan. He copped a lot of flak from the pundits but he always looked like he cared. At Super Rugby level he was reasonably effective.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top