Waratahs 2018

[Inside Shoulder]

There is a massive difference in the standard between club and super rugby, Mason is doing well but part of that is being in a professional program and training with the likes of Foley & Beale everyday. That said I would like to see him get some more bench time in S15

don't think that is on the cards - nor Kellaway.
I think the Tahs have made their decisions

 

[fatprop]

I think Mason is in the options if Foley or Beale are wounded, to start or bench

 

[Brumby Runner]

Based on the last 30 minutes of the game on Saturday (which is all that I caught) Mason had a shocker. Poor passing, dropped balls and little in the way of backline management. His defense was the only good part of his game.

Mason will eventually go the way of Horwitz, McIntyre, Deegan etc who look pretty on the field but really are found very wanting when they face up to men. Unfortunately, they are the types of players who are coming through the schoolboys to U20s and I suspect even Stewart might fall into that category as well.

 

[Derpus]

Am I the only one who thinks maybe it's time to start Mack Mason? Foley doesn't do it for me and I'm sick of him being basically being untouchable. I think Mack could help the Tahs play a lot more direct and square to the line.

Yes, you are the only one. When Foley went off against the Lions our backline was a catastrophe. Mason is not going to do any better at playing off the base of a beaten pack than an experienced test 10 (who spends most of his time playing off the back of a beaten pack).

Our problems just are not related to our back-line at all. It's strategy and forward work in open play.

 

[Braveheart81]

Well that was an awful weekend.

A few observations:

1. The failure to convert pressure into points early in the game was hugely costly. It was probably less about pushing one pass too many on a break than in previous weeks and more about just failing to execute the final pass to score a try (e.g. Newsome just needing to pop a pass inside for us to score in the first half).

2. Tom Staniforth seemed to keep getting in the way and didn't improve the pack. He got pinged for holding on against Marx (and certainly wasn't the only one) because he held the ball in close on the ground rather than placing it back and creating some distance between him and Marx. He worked hard in defence but I don't think that was enough. Back to the bench next game in my opinion.

3. The Tahs didn't handle Marx at all well. Against Pocock a few weeks ago they limited his impact (he was still very good) by trying to keep the ball away from him. Too often it seemed like the Tahs opted for contact where Marx was clearly going to be in a position to attack the ball.

4. Fitzy had a poor game and our lineout struggled for the first time.

It was easily the worst performance of the year and I don't think the Lions were outstanding. Most of the tries they scored were very soft. The defence around the lineout was hopeless. The week off hopefully comes at a good time as the team clearly needs to regroup for the toughest month of the comp coming up. Certainly a win against the Blues is absolutely essential to gain a little momentum heading into three tougher NZ teams.

The Tahs are fortunate that they still sit on top of the Aussie conference but the risk is there that if they through up similar performances to that across the next month they will still be sitting on 5 wins and the loss column will outnumber the wins when they finish their NZ matchups.

 

[eastman]

Where are all the athletic quick wingers in New South Wales rugby? In a country of athletes, we have two very mediocre wingers in ourside.. I never understood why Harry Jones was not persisted with- at least he has pace and is a natural finisher. The NRL produces talented wingers on tap- look at someone like Josh Ado-Carr, he would be outstanding in Union.

 

[2bluesfan]

Well that was an awful weekend.

A few observations:

<snipped>It was probably less about pushing one pass too many on a break than in previous weeks and more about just failing to execute the final pass to score a try</snipped>

<snipped>
The Tahs didn't handle Marx at all well. Against Pocock a few weeks ago they limited his impact (he was still very good) by trying to keep the ball away from him. Too often it seemed like the Tahs opted for contact where Marx was clearly going to be in a position to attack the ball.
</snipped>

<snipped>Most of the tries they scored were very soft. The defence around the lineout was hopeless.</snipped>

Woah there! This sounds suspiciously like you expect our Tahs to have basic Rugby skills, tactical nouse and maybe even a game plan. You must be new around here

 

[Silverado]

Where are all the athletic quick wingers in New South Wales rugby? In a country of athletes, we have two very mediocre wingers in ourside.. I never understood why Harry Jones was not persisted with- at least he has pace and is a natural finisher. The NRL produces talented wingers on tap- look at someone like Josh Ado-Carr, he would be outstanding in Union.

I reckon that you sort of answered your own question..ie the NRL. NSW rugby has neglected junior club rugby and State schools. The NRL is strong in both and signs kids up very young. There's 16 teams in the NRL as opposed to 4 Super Rugby franchises, so players have a much higher chance of getting a decent contract in NRL. This doesn't work for specialist positions like the tight 5 or inside backs, but a good finisher winger will thrive in both codes. Sad to say that the incentive to play Australian rugby isn't that great at the moment, so an NRL contract trumps a Super Rugby contract


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[wamberal]

Strike me lucky. Yes, indeed, the are 16 NRL franchises, there are also umpteen professional or semi-professional teams at the lower levels of the game.



Yes, all the NRL clubs have paid scouts running around the place, looking for kids as young as 14 to sign up.



This is the way it is. It is specious to blame "NSW Rugby" for "neglecting junior rugby and State schools". Our resources are absolutely miniscule compared to league. No doubt if our code was more popular, if we had huge licenced clubs, if we had a huge broadcasting rights deal, we would be able to attract and/or retain more young talent.


But we don't, so we can't.

 

[Silverado]

Strike me lucky. Yes, indeed, the are 16 NRL franchises, there are also umpteen professional or semi-professional teams at the lower levels of the game.



Yes, all the NRL clubs have paid scouts running around the place, looking for kids as young as 14 to sign up.



This is the way it is. It is specious to blame "NSW Rugby" for "neglecting junior rugby and State schools". Our resources are absolutely miniscule compared to league. No doubt if our code was more popular, if we had huge licenced clubs, if we had a huge broadcasting rights deal, we would be able to attract and/or retain more young talent.


But we don't, so we can't.

I was just answering his question. Spoken like a true Politician to deflect blame, throw your hands up and walk away. I'm sure you saw all the Super Rugby results on the weekend. OZ rugby is going down the toilet and there needs to be reflection on what went wrong and how to improve or we'll disappear up our arse. To be content with this is how is will soon be replaced with this is how it was


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[Killer]

I'm not being sensitive, I'm wondering why of all the comments on here you jump at that. Especially using terms such as accosted.
The last time I politely made a public suggestion to you, you deleted it.
Do you have some sensitivity to being criticised on your website as it may encourage others to do the same?
Do you see some similarity between your situation and Clarkie?
Do you know Clarkie?

unbelievable Reg!
You deleted another post, I was doing you a favour and moving on by simply saying "I'll let you off the hook Reg"
Clarkie must be a very special person to you, the way you are acting.
I'll give you a tip Reg, If you want to make yourself look good, dragging someone down to do it doesn't work. Simply be better, drag yourself up.
No doubt you will delete this as soon as you see it. I wonder how many others have been treated like this by you and left the forum, there don't seem to be many here who contribute.

 

[RugbyReg]

What post did I delete?

 

[fatprop]

Based on the last 30 minutes of the game on Saturday (which is all that I caught) Mason had a shocker. Poor passing, dropped balls and little in the way of backline management. His defense was the only good part of his game.

Mason will eventually go the way of Horwitz, McIntyre, Deegan etc who look pretty on the field but really are found very wanting when they face up to men. Unfortunately, they are the types of players who are coming through the schoolboys to U20s and I suspect even Stewart might fall into that category as well.

A bit early boxing a guy in after watching him play 30 minutes of club, in a team he is unlikely to have seriously trained with all season. He would be lucky to get a walk through of the moves on Friday night

He has looked quite good for the Tahs

 

[barbarian]

unbelievable Reg!
You deleted another post, I was doing you a favour and moving on by simply saying "I'll let you off the hook Reg"

I deleted the post mate. It was rubbish, pure and simple. Please stop with the personal stuff.

Any more posts that don't relate to the Waratahs will be deleted.

 

[formerflanker]

Does anyone know the details of Alan Jones' target in today's Australian (paywalled)?

Are you as staggered as I am, to learn that NSW have appointed an “executive coach”? Apparently his job is to “facilitate change to their development”. Not sure who or what he’s developing, but I love his observation about his role: “I am not attached to the outcomes …” Now there’s a good job!
And what about this: “The biggest thing for the Waratahs is changing their culture to one that learns from loss — I call it learning how to lose. And they didn’t understand how to do that properly ...”.

 

[eastman]

Based on the last 30 minutes of the game on Saturday (which is all that I caught) Mason had a shocker. Poor passing, dropped balls and little in the way of backline management. His defense was the only good part of his game.



Mason will eventually go the way of Horwitz, McIntyre, Deegan etc who look pretty on the field but really are found very wanting when they face up to men. Unfortunately, they are the types of players who are coming through the schoolboys to U20s and I suspect even Stewart might fall into that category as well.

Late reply but I completely agree with the sentiment (you can also add Godwin to this list). All these players are somewhat manufactured players who look good in the overly structured system that is used in Aussie junior representative rugby- however they're ability to actually ball play and read the play is quite limited.

 

[Braveheart81]

Who are the better 10s though? It's not like there's been a bunch of 10s who have emerged three or four years later as being outstanding players who just weren't noticed when they were 19 and 20.

 

[Brumby Runner]

BH, I always thought Rohan Saifoloi was a better No 10 than Horwitz. Saifoloi seemed to outplay Horwitz every time I saw them on opposing sides. Not sure if he has since played for another country and is no longer around or eligible? This is just an example where I think the poorer of the two players got all the opportunities and then failed to live up to expectations.

I'm sure there must be a couple of others in the SS who haven't come through the normal channels but would give the game a shake at higher levels if only they had a chance.

 

[Braveheart81]

I don't think Saifoloi has ever been capped internationally. He is 3 years older than Horwitz and it is pretty debatable whether he's better. A better 10 maybe but Horwitz has seemed to firm into a 12.

I don't think either of them are really up to the standard of becoming a Super Rugby starter.

Saifoloi played Australian under 20s. It's not like he was missed in terms of a talented player coming through the ranks. He just never went any further.

I very much think Saifoloi would be another player we'd be agreeing wasn't really up to it if he'd had a Super Rugby contract for a few years.

 

[William88]

Does anyone know the details of Alan Jones' target in today's Australian (paywalled)?

Are you as staggered as I am, to learn that NSW have appointed an “executive coach”? Apparently his job is to “facilitate change to their development”. Not sure who or what he’s developing, but I love his observation about his role: “I am not attached to the outcomes …” Now there’s a good job!
And what about this: “The biggest thing for the Waratahs is changing their culture to one that learns from loss — I call it learning how to lose. And they didn’t understand how to do that properly .”.

Article attached.

Bewildering- imagine how much this would I cost.. to learn how to lose. They have to learn how to catch, kick and pass first!

http://www.thecoachingroom.com.au/blog/why-waratahs-ceo-andrew-hore-is-learning-how-to-lose