Waratahs 2013

[GaffaCHinO]

Following this logic it pretty much has to be Hodgo at the force. Of course, captains may be known internally already at the club(s) that haven't named them.

Well it wouldn't be a rugby season without some sort of chaos at the Force would it?

Slow down ppl.

Hodgo has shown in the last 6 months that he is twice the captain Pocock ever was he has almost single handedly brought the group together and has the full support of the players, coachs and the fans.

Maybe the artical is refering to a team who hasnt yet officialy named their captain but the playing group know who it is and they arent happy about it...

No drama at the Force just hard work and steady improvement.
Sent from my GT-I9300T using Tapatalk 2

 

[TOCC]

Hodgo has shown in the last 6 months that he is twice the captain Pocock ever was

Thats a highly subjective and debatable comment, but its a Tahs thread so no point continuing it in here..

 

[Slim 293]

uhh. yes?

Ah, had to go back a couple of pages which actually put the post in a different context....... nevermind..........

 

[GaffaCHinO]

Thats a highly subjective and debatable comment, but its a Tahs thread so no point continuing it in here..

Its actually not.

I have heard from ppl from with in the club say just that. The work that hodgo has done off the field has been massive something pocock never got involved in.

Poey played his heart out for the club but was no were to be seen once the boots came off.

But yes this is a tahs thread but i was just responding to others who brought the force into the conversation.

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[TOCC]

If anyone else has some input on the subject its probably more suited to the Western Force thread..


On a side not, the win against the Rebels was the first win the Tahs have had since Rd9 last year... Is the current/2012 super rugby losing streak the longest in Tahs history?

 

[Slim 293]

They're probably saying a lot of things now that he's no longer there.........

 

[Slim 293]

Anyways, who wrote the article?

Growden has a new pseudonym?

 

[qwerty51]

On a side not, the win against the Rebels was the first win the Tahs have had since Rd9 last year. Is the current/2012 super rugby losing streak the longest in Tahs history?

I think that was reported last season yeah

 

[Orange Peeler]

Oh please, armchair critics don't realize how hard professional players actually train these days.

If this is aimed at Tuqiri, Sailor or even Folau.. Its a bit of a laugh considering all 3 were automatic test selections in rugby league prior to switching.. Hardly just "anyone" pulled off the street.

TOCC,

Yes they do train more these days but I question the end results. I wish I was paid a six figure salary to run around the park, go to the gym, play video games in my spare time and look pretty on game day.

League players are not the answer full stop.

 

[TOCC]

TOCC,

Yes they do train more these days but I question the end results. I wish I was paid a six figure salary to run around the park, go to the gym, play video games in my spare time and look pretty on game day.

League players are not the answer full stop.

I'm not really sure why your point is....
So, you are concerned that they are just handing out Waratahs jerseys to just "anyone's" these days and that the players aren't producing the end results... Yet league converts like Tuqiri, Sailor and Rogers who all pulled on the Tahs jerseys went on to represent the Wallabies for a significant number of tests and were very good in there positions at the time and better then other players In the Tahs..

I have long been against high profile league converts, that doesn't mean I don't think Tuqiri, Sailor and Rogers weren't useful additions to the Tahs and Wallabies back line..tahu on the other hand

Having done some training camps with a couple of Sydney NRL teams, I can assure you their day entails more then touch, gym and video games..

 

[It is what it is]

TOCC,

Yes they do train more these days but I question the end results. I wish I was paid a six figure salary to run around the park, go to the gym, play video games in my spare time and look pretty on game day.

League players are not the answer full stop.

The reality is that the average NRL career is 43 games spread over 3-4 years, not sure of Pro rugby tenure.
There's not many people who have a career where they hit their maximum life time pay dirt before age 30.
Don't begrudge any pro sportsman their due.
For the vast majority, they don't make much money, the sacrifices are enormous, the injuries last a lifetime and many struggle post retirement.

 

[Quick Hands]

TOCC,


League players are not the answer full stop.

I think that rugby needs to get out of the idea of labelling people as "league players". It's unhelpful and not the way forward.

The northern beaches for example has strong league and union teams. There are 12 junior league clubs and 11 junior rugby clubs here and many of the best players play both. Some boys change quite late in their development, but still make it in their chosen code, others change in adulthood and can still master both games.

For decades rugby types whinged about league stealing our best players and now whenever someone who's playing league switches to rugby, people whinge about league players stealing our spots or league players couldn't understand rugby because it's so complex etc.

Whether people like it or not, in the professional era, people are going to change between codes. Rugby has to be part of that if we want to compete.

Regardless of whether a player comes from a league, union, aussie rules or soccer background, the test to get picked is how they perform. If Folau is considered good enough he will be picked by the coach, if there are better players around, then he won't get picked. It's quite a simple concept. League have been able to coach rugby code-changers for decades, is it seriously suggested that rugby can't cope with the reverse?

Folau has made a fairly good start and even Cheika admits that he was pleasantly surprised. I saw Folau interviewed and he said that he enjoyed the game and knew that he had things to learn.

Great publicity for the Waratahs and the code, good crowd in Hobart and still people trying to find fault! It's bizarre.

 

[Slim 293]

If he's good enough that's fair enough, but I think Australian rugby supporters have the right to be cynical about high profile ex-league players being fast tracked into the Wallabies.........

 

[Orange Peeler]

I'm not really sure why your point is..
So, you are concerned that they are just handing out Waratahs jerseys to just "anyone's" here days and that the players aren't producing the end results. Yet league converts like Tuqiri, Sailor and Rogers who all pulled on the Tahs jerseys went on to represent the Wallabies for a significant number of tests and were very good in there positions at the time and better then other players In the Tahs..

I have long been against high profile league converts, that doesn't mean I don't think Tuqiri, Sailor and Rogers weren't useful additions to the Tahs and Wallabies back line..tahu on the other hand

Having done some training camps with a couple of Sydney NRL teams, I can assure you their day entails more then touch, gym and video games..

TOCC,

My issue is that I fail to see any risk management strategy from the Waratahs with regards to the promotion of Israel Folau. Will the Tahs Management take the usual stance of burying their head in the sand when it all goes pear shaped. There must be a better way to manage this process. At the moment its just seems doomed to fail, which is frustrating.

Since you mentioned them, my view on Tuqiri, Sailor and Rodgers is that the ARU paid more than they were worth and as a result they had to take the field to avoid further embarrassment from the public. I agree with your note on Tahu.

I don't question the training effort of the players. Todays players are very good at training, however they are not necessarily the best players

 

[Dave Beat]

If he's good enough that's fair enough, but I think Australian rugby supporters have the right to be cynical about high profile ex-league players being fast tracked into the Wallabies...

Still trials, did you go to the game, people were interested so why not take advantage of the marketing opportunity. The ytd suggests a good culture and a team will be picked to suit a team / game plan. Still trials.

 

[Dave Beat]

TOCC,

My issue is that I fail to see any risk management strategy from the Waratahs with regards to the promotion of Israel Folau. Will the Tahs Management take the usual stance of burying their head in the sand when it all goes pear shaped. There must be a better way to manage this process. At the moment its just seems doomed to fail, which is frustrating. Best take advantage of game / trial time now before the comp starts. Waiting until the Shute Shield we'll be about 4 - 8 games in before we get a fair gage on his potential.

Since you mentioned them, my view on Tuqiri, Sailor and Rodgers is that the ARU paid more than they were worth and as a result they had to take the field to avoid further embarrassment from the public. I agree with your note on Tahu. Agreed, and I dont think the money spent affected junior development in any way.

I don't question the training effort of the players. Todays players are very good at training, however they are not necessarily the best players

True, but the best players also need to be physically up to the standard they train for. Have you read what Brad Thorn put himeslf through? More often than not the good trainers are making up to offset other weaknesses.
Example I'm not a McCabe fan, Tah's didnt want him, he trained hard to make a point and came out of it with a WOB's jersey.

 

[Orange Peeler]

The reality is that the average NRL career is 43 games spread over 3-4 years, not sure of Pro rugby tenure.
There's not many people who have a career where they hit their maximum life time pay dirt before age 30.
Don't begrudge any pro sportsman their due.
For the vast majority, they don't make much money, the sacrifices are enormous, the injuries last a lifetime and many struggle post retirement.

It is what it is,

There was no money when I played, I sacrificed a possible better future by sticking with my sport, and my injuries still plague me today, but I loved every minute of it - Glory Days
So I don't begrudge any sportsperson professional or not.

 

[Orange Peeler]

I think that rugby needs to get out of the idea of labelling people as "league players". It's unhelpful and not the way forward.

The northern beaches for example has strong league and union teams. There are 12 junior league clubs and 11 junior rugby clubs here and many of the best players play both. Some boys change quite late in their development, but still make it in their chosen code, others change in adulthood and can still master both games.

For decades rugby types whinged about league stealing our best players and now whenever someone who's playing league switches to rugby, people whinge about league players stealing our spots or league players couldn't understand rugby because it's so complex etc.

Whether people like it or not, in the professional era, people are going to change between codes. Rugby has to be part of that if we want to compete.

Regardless of whether a player comes from a league, union, aussie rules or soccer background, the test to get picked is how they perform. If Folau is considered good enough he will be picked by the coach, if there are better players around, then he won't get picked. It's quite a simple concept. League have been able to coach rugby code-changers for decades, is it seriously suggested that rugby can't cope with the reverse?

Folau has made a fairly good start and even Cheika admits that he was pleasantly surprised. I saw Folau interviewed and he said that he enjoyed the game and knew that he had things to learn.

Great publicity for the Waratahs and the code, good crowd in Hobart and still people trying to find fault! It's bizarre.

Quick Hands,

I totally agree with the view that if your good enough then you should be selected. I have no issues with this.
I am also a firm believer that it is harder to make a League player into a Rugby player.

 

[TOCC]

TOCC,

My issue is that I fail to see any risk management strategy from the Waratahs with regards to the promotion of Israel Folau. Will the Tahs Management take the usual stance of burying their head in the sand when it all goes pear shaped. There must be a better way to manage this process. At the moment its just seems doomed to fail, which is frustrating.

Since you mentioned them, my view on Tuqiri, Sailor and Rodgers is that the ARU paid more than they were worth and as a result they had to take the field to avoid further embarrassment from the public. I agree with your note on Tahu.

I don't question the training effort of the players. Todays players are very good at training, however they are not necessarily the best players

Those players you mentioned probably were overpaid....


Fair enough, but i guess my point is that there is a difference between overpaying players and players being undeserving of their spots... Apart from Tahu, I think the league converts all justified their selection at test level..

Folau hasn't earned his spot through the generic rugby pedigree routes, but his proven physical ability has placed him ahead of your average joe Shute Shield winger... Is he worth his paycheck? I don't think so, but I think his selection is well justified. I also think that the Tahs should be using Izzy extensively to promote the game in Western Sydey, not joining a western Sydney SS team is a mistake.

 

[Richo]

Richo,

There lies the problem, we let anyone have a Waratahs jersey.
The value of the hard earn't Waratah jersey has been lost and the culture eroded.
Management only care about profits and appear to have no idea on how to run the game at all levels.
The fans see all this and wonder why they should spend their money on memberships.
I pray and hope that Michael Cheika can bring the Franchise together and back on track.
The fans will come back when the Tahs are the dominating team we expect them to be.

TOCC already said it, but this is pretty hyperbolic. I'm certainly not a fan of the way the Tahs have been run, but this one has the lot: accusations of incompetence, devaluing the jersey, expectations of glory, lettuce, onions, tomatoes, on a sesame seed bun.

Seriously though, professional sport simply operates in a different way to the amateur era. It's essential that teams ensure financial stability first and foremost. The best franchises in professional sport anywhere in the world operate on a sound financial footing before anything else. The Tahs might have a shitty track record, but you really can't want them to be "the dominating team we expect them to be" without also having them care about profit.