Wallabies v USA Eagles, 5th September, Soldier Field, Chicago

[Red-L]

Neither have done anything to improve their claims to the 10 jersey.

The only place you can argue that Cooper is more likely to win a RWC is on paper. Performances close to his best are few and far between and none are recent. The only available evidence of either at the RWC is Cooper from 2011 and it didn't go well for him.

Most people backing Foley probably consider him a less risky proposition.

It's a far from ideal situation to be in a month out from the RWC but that's how it is. Neither have played well but one or both of them are likely to play 10 through the RWC.

I don't think there's any more basis in fact in saying that it's a smarter decision to pick Cooper than it is to pick Foley than the other way around.

I get your point. However I guess the only basis left is..Cooper at the top of his game is beter then Foley at the top of his game.

 

[Train Without a Station]

Neither have done anything to improve their claims to the 10 jersey.

The only place you can argue that Cooper is more likely to win a RWC is on paper. Performances close to his best are few and far between and none are recent. The only available evidence of either at the RWC is Cooper from 2011 and it didn't go well for him.

Most people backing Foley probably consider him a less risky proposition.

It's a far from ideal situation to be in a month out from the RWC but that's how it is. Neither have played well but one or both of them are likely to play 10 through the RWC.

I don't think there's any more basis in fact in saying that it's a smarter decision to pick Cooper than it is to pick Foley than the other way around.

BH I stated to read agreeing with what you said. But come on, let's be serious.

The only available evidence of either at the RWC is Cooper from 2011 and it didn't go well for him.

Because Cooper was good enough to be a Wallaby at the time and Foley not good enough to player Super Rugby it should be held against Cooper? The poster is making the point they consider our team has the best potential with Cooper at 10 and most likely to win it.

The reason people get upset about Foley's selection is most likely because it's based on the fact that he was just there in 2014. The perception that he is safer is based on opinion but zero fact when you consider his 2015 error rate. I agree that the way he has played (most likely by direction of his coach) causes error rates to increase. But regardless, you cannot consider a player who's biggest flaws are his tackle completion and kicking game and also has made 38 handling errors across 19 total games in 2015 to be "safe".

I agree that Cooper has had opportunity and underwhelmed. It would not at all be a poor selection to go with Foley and either way there are some issues that really need to be resolved with either option.

 

[Train Without a Station]

I get your point. However I guess the only basis left is..Cooper at the top of his game is beter then Foley at the top of his game.

But surely that's only a consideration if both are performing equally.

 

[Omar Comin']

Tolkien would be mad to play Manoa in the 2nd rower which means that's probably what he'll do. I think a LaValla/Dolan 2nd row combo would work better.

I tend to agree.

I don't think this will be anywhere near the blowout that the All Blacks match was. 1 we're not as good, 2 we will play an experimental lineup while the USA will play their best team, and 3 that US squad will have been training and playing together for months now, as opposed to the 1 week they had before the All Blacks game.

I don't think it will be close but if we win by more than 50 I'd be surprised. I think it will be more like 30 points.

 

[USARugger]

I'm sorry. I really am but I couldn't help but chuckle at that. Not at the Eagles getting pumped but more that we both know that the pairing will be Palamo and Kelly. Which actually is a massive shame. Guess Scully and Co. Won't be seeing much ball.

Even if we run Suniula/Niua our 12-13 and 13-15 channels are going to get abused heavily. If Palamo is in, the entire midfield becomes a liability.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Even if we run Suniula/Niua our 12-13 and 13-15 channels are going to get abused heavily. If Palamo is in, the entire midfield becomes a liability.

Mate, if either Palamo or Kelly are out there the backline will cease to function. Kelly has a really poor passing game and Palamo. Well, I'm not sure what his upside is supposed to be.

 

[Braveheart81]

Because Cooper was good enough to be a Wallaby at the time and Foley not good enough to player Super Rugby it should be held against Cooper? The poster is making the point they consider our team has the best potential with Cooper at 10 and most likely to win it.

I agree that Cooper has had opportunity and underwhelmed. It would not at all be a poor selection to go with Foley and either way there are some issues that really need to be resolved with either option.

The RWC bit was more a counterpoint to suggestions that based on past evidence, Cooper has a higher peak than Foley.

It's poor logic because you're not getting the form or ability that they have shown at some point in the past, just like using the 2011 RWC as evidence to suggest what a player will be like in 2015 is completely flawed.

At the end of the day I think Cheika will pick whoever he thinks will do the best job for him and it will have nothing to do with who he thinks has the highest potential ability.

 

[Omar Comin']

Another significant thing with this game - when the Wallabies get to Chicago they and the Eagles are going to have to do a media blitz for 2 weeks. There's still a lot of tickets unsold.

 

[Train Without a Station]

The RWC bit was more a counterpoint to suggestions that based on past evidence, Cooper has a higher peak than Foley.

It's poor logic because you're not getting the form or ability that they have shown at some point in the past, just like using the 2011 RWC as evidence to suggest what a player will be like in 2015 is completely flawed.

At the end of the day I think Cheika will pick whoever he thinks will do the best job for him and it will have nothing to do with who he thinks has the highest potential ability.

I think people are basing it on his 2013 form. Last time he played consecutive starting tests.

I think potential will be a factor. If you are the coach and you see both your options are below where you want, one option has shown he was able to get there in the past, and one hasn't, will you consider that?

But at the same time, if come business end Foley is looking superior to Cooper, Cheika will go with him. You can't ignore present performance.

 

[Scrubber2050]

Neither have inspiring game winning form

Foley gets 6.5/10 evry game whilst Quade can be a 3 or 11 outa 10. Trouble is I haven't seen a 11/10 since 2011 and nowdays seems more likely to play a 3/10.

I'd still like to see To'omua get a shot against the Yankers at 10.

 

[Train Without a Station]

Fuck me Scrubber that's absolutely bullshit.

Foley has ups (some have been very good) and downs and Quade isn't prone to being a 3/10.

 

[Scoey]

Don't argue with him TWAS. Once he goes cold on a player, they can't be fucked off quick enough. Quade is his latest target.

 

[Scrubber2050]

Fuck me Scrubber that's absolutely bullshit.

Foley has ups (some have been very good) and downs and Quade isn't prone to being a 3/10.

In respect of your first 3 words: I'm OK at the moment but Train I will keep that offer for a rainy day.

I reckon Quades performance last week was about 2. Think the Blacks scored about 21 points when QC (Quade Cooper) had the brain snap and was sent from the field. At least we had a chance at that point of the game. It was a game changing moment for me and plenty of others.

 

[Scrubber2050]

Don't argue with him TWAS. Once he goes cold on a player, they can't be fucked off quick enough. Quade is his latest target.

What a stupid comment with little thought - You probably think Toua should still be in the top squad, after playing 4 games in 7 years

"quick enough" is laughable - QC (Quade Cooper) hasn't performed on a consistently good basis (when on the field) for 3 fucking years

 

[Scoey]

Yep sure thing Scrubber.

 

[Train Without a Station]

In respect of your first 3 words: I'm OK at the moment but Train I will keep that offer for a rainy day.

I reckon Quades performance last week was about 2. Think the Blacks scored about 21 points when QC (Quade Cooper) had the brain snap and was sent from the field. At least we had a chance at that point of the game. It was a game changing moment for me and plenty of others.

So it's Cooper's fault the other 14 were resolute in defence in Sydney but not in Auckland? There's rightly been no lynchings of Kepu and Phipps for their silly YC's.

 

[Mr Pilfer]

Great, so Beale will play at 12 this game, we will probably win by 30 or more points and it will make him look good in the process. What about Lilo at 12 Cheika, that is someone you haven't tried???

 

[Pfitzy]

Cooper will benefit from more game time.

To be fair, he was offered 80 minutes game time in Auckland.

Its not Foley's fault he decided to sit down after 48.

 

[Braveheart81]

Great, so Beale will play at 12 this game, we will probably win by 30 or more points and it will make him look good in the process. What about Lilo at 12 Cheika, that is someone you haven't tried???

By the same token, how does it benefit our RWC campaign by giving a player a run who isn't in the squad?

That said, I expect Leali'ifano will be one of the 9 extra players taken to Chicago and will play in this match in some capacity.

 

[Scrubber2050]

By the same token, how does it benefit our RWC campaign by giving a player a run who isn't in the squad?

That said, I expect Leali'ifano will be one of the 9 extra players taken to Chicago and will play in this match in some capacity.

I hope Lilo goes - he is a victim of the French Connection