Wallabies v Springboks II, Allianz Stadium 7:35pm 03/09/22

[Adam84]

Time to rest White.. he stirred the Boks up with his antics last week and it came back to haunt him this week.

His on-field demeanour isn’t just antagonising the opposition, it’s antagonising the referee. There’s been a few matches now the referee has penalised White for talking back or cautioned Slipper he would do it if White kept yelling at the officials.

maybe it is too many minutes

 

[Kenny Powers]

ok you're trolling me now aren't you. You really think FF (Folau Fainga'a) (Folau Fainga'a), White and Noah are picked on Nepotism?

You actually believe that Noah isn't the best option at flyhalf for this match? Surely you can't believe it's Foley, he's so new to the squad he probably doesn't even know his teammates names. Noah had a solid match last game and a decent England series.

FF (Folau Fainga'a) (Folau Fainga'a) played the best match by a hooker all season prior to his poor performance last week, so it's not illogical why he was chosen and based on Porecki's poor performance off the bench this match it probably wasn't the wrong call.

I always laugh at the criticism "can't play behind a struggling pack" - no shit, no halves in world rugby can. Think Dan Carter looks good behind a pack going backwards?

White started the season strong and has really only recently gone downhill. I agree he probably deserves to be dropped now (I also hated the box kicking and niggle) but to say he wasn't picked on merit when he is one of the most experienced players on the field is pretty stupid.

By the way I hope Gordon gets a starting shot next match (but I'm sure you'll find a way to twist this into a Brumbies bias too).

Also, you forgot to bag out Valetini, AAA, Sio, Slipper, Ikatau, Wright, Swain, Samu, Arnold (ex-brumby, does he count?)

I think you miss understood my post. I actually think Noah L has a lot of potential and needs to be assisted in his development. As fly half he has to run the game and call the plays he is the boss. He has to be and not letting him be the boss just sets him up for failure. I just feel that when Nic White is playing there is seniority or personality thing that sees Nic White try to run game management and this pushes Noah L into the background and impacts his confidence. Would be good for his development to see Noah L work with another half back.
Not always down on the Brumbies players as I am really impressed with is Valetini. Use to think he was a bit over rated as he could switch off a times and go missing. Really impressed with his consistency now and good discipline. Obviously got the right feedback from coaching staff working with him across Brumbies and Wallabies and he took it all on board. For me he is the pin up boy for player development in Australia and there needs to be more of it.

 

[Dan54]

Time to rest White.. he stirred the Boks up with his antics last week and it came back to haunt him this week.

His on-field demeanour isn’t just antagonising the opposition, it’s antagonising the referee. There’s been a few matches now the referee has penalised White for talking back or cautioned Slipper he would do it if White kept yelling at the officials.

maybe it is too many minutes

He does look like a break wouldn't be worst thing for him Adam. As you say it's one thing to antagonise the opposition, but I thought it was telling when O'Keefe had to tell Slipper again to shut him up, saying I want to work with you, but it's hard with him in my ear or something similar.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

We can't afford the minor issues like a player pissing the ref off. We don't have the team or talent to cover for it right now.

I'd support Rennie is he left him out of a test or two coming up.

 

[Braveheart81]

O'Keefe wasn't bad per se but followed the law to the letter and never gave either side an opportunity to express themselves. Can't complain, the Wallabies know what he is like and had plenty of time to prepare for him, they appeared to have done nothing and looked surprised at every second penalty.

I was at the game and while the complaints about the referee were certainly evident around me (and online), I really couldn't see a problem with it.

Australia got penalised heavily in the first half when we were constantly under pressure and most of those had to happen, particularly with our ball at the breakdown. They were all pretty clear.

There were several dumb penalties Australia gave away which I can't see any issue with (Kellaway obstructing after the cross field kick, Slipper (I think) picking the ball up from an offside position).

I can't really see a way that the Wallabies could have been penalised less given the way they played.

 

[A mutterer]

I was at the game and while the complaints about the referee were certainly evident around me (and online), I really couldn't see a problem with it.

Australia got penalised heavily in the first half when we were constantly under pressure and most of those had to happen, particularly with our ball at the breakdown. They were all pretty clear.

There were several dumb penalties Australia gave away which I can't see any issue with (Kellaway obstructing after the cross field kick, Slipper (I think) picking the ball up from an offside position).

I can't really see a way that the Wallabies could have been penalised less given the way they played.

what about having a ref other than o'keefe?

 

[LeCheese]

Deservedness of penalties aside, the issue for mine is that following seemingly every game O'Keefe oversees, the post-match talk is about his style of officiating and how terribly dreary the game was. As others have highlighted, his decision making is typically correct by the letter of the law (which in itself says a lot) but other referees manage to keep more flow. For the good of the game, something has to change.

 

[Dan54]

I was at the game and while the complaints about the referee were certainly evident around me (and online), I really couldn't see a problem with it.

Australia got penalised heavily in the first half when we were constantly under pressure and most of those had to happen, particularly with our ball at the breakdown. They were all pretty clear.

There were several dumb penalties Australia gave away which I can't see any issue with (Kellaway obstructing after the cross field kick, Slipper (I think) picking the ball up from an offside position).

I can't really see a way that the Wallabies could have been penalised less given the way they played.

Yep unfortunately for refs we want them to let game flow i.e. let the penalties and knock ons that our own team be let through, but make sure every indiscretion the opposition makes is pulled up!
It's a fact of life , have you ever heard ANY supporter scream off side or knock on when his own team does it?

 

[Braveheart81]

Deservedness of penalties aside, the issue for mine is that following seemingly every game O'Keefe oversees, the post-match talk is about his style of officiating and how terribly dreary the game was. As others have highlighted, his decision making is typically correct by the letter of the law (which in itself says a lot) but other referees manage to keep more flow. For the good of the game, something has to change.

The game was pretty poor but I'm also not sure how much that can be down to the referee.

It was wet yet our tactics in those conditions were poor.

The game flowed in one direction because the Springboks were comfortably the better side. They scored 4 tries to 1.

I really feel like people are clutching at straws suggesting that the spectacle could have been improved through some stylistic changes to the refereeing. I'd love to see some specific examples pointed out.

 

[LeCheese]

The game was pretty poor but I'm also not sure how much that can be down to the referee.

It was wet yet our tactics in those conditions were poor.

The game flowed in one direction because the Springboks were comfortably the better side. They scored 4 tries to 1.

I really feel like people are clutching at straws suggesting that the spectacle could have been improved through some stylistic changes to the refereeing. I'd love to see some specific examples pointed out.

Definitely not trying to detract from the Boks' dominance, nor excuse the Wallabies' poor play, which were obviously the key differentiators on the game.

In hindsight it's probably the wrong thread for this as it's not necessarily specific to this match, but more a general observation from what I recall of repeated discussions on O'Keefe's very technical style, so I'll leave it here.

 

[Braveheart81]

O'Keefe has had some absolutely diabolical performances but I don't think this was one of them.

I'm quite interested where people think the game could have flowed better through different refereeing decisions in specific moments.

Were any penalties really so pedantic or inconsequential that they were unnecessary? Was either team prevented from playing by having their advantage called back for a penalty to them?

 

[Bullrush]

I'd like to see Samu start. Don't ask me bout the backrow balance or anything like that cos I don't know - I haven't followed the Wallabies closely at all this year but I watched the game on Saturday and as usual - Samu played well off the bench. I'd like to see him get more game time.

The early card didn't help at all and I thought the locks were pretty anonymous.

Would have loved to see AA uppercut Etzebeth. I thought the way he carried on should have warranted a YC.

 

[Dctarget]

Managed to have a tv at a party on the Wallabies for the first half before it was commandeered at HT to the Bulldogs game, which after our performance I didn't resist too hard. So, I don't have any deep thoughts on the game.

I saw Paisami go down, Lolesio apparently got a head knock, with Gordon on the wing? Hodge at 10? Who was with Ikitau?

Also, we retained the Mandela plate, tipped the Boks last week. Yeah it sounds like it were a diabolical performance but I'm happy with 1/2.

Also Eben looked like he was on speed or something. Doesn't do anything to dispel my absolutely libelous and unfair opinion they're all on 'roids.

 

[Joe Blow]

Awesome, hope he gets another shot, big fan of Wilson.
Would love to see for the bled:
7. McReight
6. Valetini
8. Wilson

Thats a good combo for the ABs. They are a different proposition than SA that require a bit more muscle. Holloway might go well.

 

[Joe Blow]

Nic White might be due a rest after starting and playing big minutes in every test (I think) this year. But he is still by quite a margin the best No 9 in the country. We all have an inkling of Tate's unexceptional passing game, and if anyone was paying attention last night they will have noticed many of Jake's passes were ill-directed behind the runner who had to baulk and reach back while getting hit in defence. I really don't savour the thought of either of them starting against the ABs but if it is to be so, then Tate imo would be the better option.

So much criticism of FF (Folau Fainga'a) (Folau Fainga'a), but Porecki gave away a stupid penalty for a neck roll with probably his first play after he came on and then was pretty much invisible for the rest of the match. I wonder what the anti-Brumbies cohort will accuse FF (Folau Fainga'a) (Folau Fainga'a) of when he plays for the Force next year?

FF (Folau Fainga'a) is looking the best he has since his debut. He probably brings a bit more power than Porecki who might get around a little quicker. A bit of rotation there and at half back is probably not a bad thing?

 

[Agent]

The coach specifically called out White's poor decision making and actual execution with his kicking game, one of the big reasons why he is supposedly 'selected' before Tate and Gordon.

Nitpick all you want about a couple of passes, but White's failed box kicks put the Wallabies into unneeded pressure.

I said it about 6 years ago…..Nic White can jam his box kick where the sun don’t shine!!
It is such a low percentage play which results in either giving the opposition a lineout on our 22, or invites the opposition to counter attack at us in our half. The Wallabies are using the box kick way too often for my liking - it’s time to mix it up and start looking for better options.
Besides that my neighbours are going to start calling the cops because I go bananas and start screaming at the TV every time Nic White puts up a bloody box kick!!

 

[Brumby Runner]

FF (Folau Fainga'a) (Folau Fainga'a) is looking the best he has since his debut. He probably brings a bit more power than Porecki who might get around a little quicker. A bit of rotation there and at half back is probably not a bad thing?

It's probably very timely for some rotation at No 9.

Personally, I don't think Porecki has as much influence on a game as FF (Folau Fainga'a) does and is prone to sometimes offering poor ball at lineout time, just like almost every No 2 we've tried in recent times.

But be forewarned. There is no guarantee that whomever replaces White or Fainga'a will have a better, or even as good a game as the player replaced.

 

[Lyall]

The game was pretty poor but I'm also not sure how much that can be down to the referee.

It was wet yet our tactics in those conditions were poor.

The game flowed in one direction because the Springboks were comfortably the better side. They scored 4 tries to 1.

I really feel like people are clutching at straws suggesting that the spectacle could have been improved through some stylistic changes to the refereeing. I'd love to see some specific examples pointed out.

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It's not exactly the answer to the question that you asked for but as pedantic as he appeared he didn't seem at all interested in issuing yellow cards for (delibarate) knock downs and contacts to the head. I'm sure I remember in other matches the referees carding players for the same actions???
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[Braveheart81]

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It's not exactly the answer to the question that you asked for but as pedantic as he appeared he didn't seem at all interested in issuing yellow cards for (delibarate) knock downs and contacts to the head. I'm sure I remember in other matches the refereees carding players for the same actions???
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The deliberate knockdown by South Africa late in the game was a yellow card.

I thought it was good refereeing not to yellow card AAA for the high cleanout. It was pretty innocuous.

Holloway is maybe lucky his intercept attempt wasn't a penalty but it certainly wasn't a yellow card. There was no opportunity for a line break.

 

[cyclopath]

I said it about 6 years ago…..Nic White can jam his box kick where the sun don’t shine!!
It is such a low percentage play which results in either giving the opposition a lineout on our 22, or invites the opposition to counter attack at us in our half. The Wallabies are using the box kick way too often for my liking - it’s time to mix it up and start looking for better options.
Besides that my neighbours are going to start calling the cops because I go bananas and start screaming at the TV every time Nic White puts up a bloody box kick!!

The box-kick, per se, is not a low percentage option, hence all good teams do it, a LOT. We do it poorly, in terms of blockers, execution, and chase. So it doesn't yield well for us. We need to get better at it.