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Train Without a Station
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We get it Groucho. You rate Palu highly.
Wallabies no 7 for the world cup
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We get it Groucho. You rate Palu highly.
Athilnaur
Arch Winning (36)
I'd like to think theres no individual player we are stuffed without. Cooper -> Barnes, Genia-> Burgess is far from silly. No O'Connor? We have options but damn that would hurt.
Pocock? I think we are taking him for granted. For whatever reason we don't have a back up player that comes even CLOSE to his work rate and that work is a spine to our whole play. His out put at the breakdown was 60% more than the closest rival v the blocks - and thats about par for him. He was second best tackler - he is usually our best. That's setting aside the 'in your face' value he brings by being everywhere when a team is trying to assemble an attack.
If Pocock fell over I'd want Beau fast, and be hoping like hell he could bring his A game to the big leagues.
Pocock? I think we are taking him for granted. For whatever reason we don't have a back up player that comes even CLOSE to his work rate and that work is a spine to our whole play. His out put at the breakdown was 60% more than the closest rival v the blocks - and thats about par for him. He was second best tackler - he is usually our best. That's setting aside the 'in your face' value he brings by being everywhere when a team is trying to assemble an attack.
If Pocock fell over I'd want Beau fast, and be hoping like hell he could bring his A game to the big leagues.
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gecko
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It's a big mistake for mine.
Yes if Pocock goes down permanently he's replaced and we're at the same place. Yes whether we have an openside vs USA or russia doesn't really matter. If however Pocock goes down for 1 or 2 matches mid tournament we're in trouble. If he's out for the quarters or the semis we can't directly replace him because we'll want him for the final.
I don't buy the argument that any old blindside will do the same job as an openside. The job of an openside isn't just getting the big steal. They're the workhorse of the pack, making tackles, often 1st or 2nd to the break down and slowing down the ball. Whether they make the big steal or not is less important. Too often in the last few years we've lost test because we get beaten at the breakdown. Beau Robinson sh*ts all over Elsom, McCalman, Samo, Higgenbotham and Palu at the break down.
Do we need 3 no8s? I'd say no, especially when one of the 6s (Higgenbotham) played 8 last week.
It's an unnecessary risk.
Yes if Pocock goes down permanently he's replaced and we're at the same place. Yes whether we have an openside vs USA or russia doesn't really matter. If however Pocock goes down for 1 or 2 matches mid tournament we're in trouble. If he's out for the quarters or the semis we can't directly replace him because we'll want him for the final.
I don't buy the argument that any old blindside will do the same job as an openside. The job of an openside isn't just getting the big steal. They're the workhorse of the pack, making tackles, often 1st or 2nd to the break down and slowing down the ball. Whether they make the big steal or not is less important. Too often in the last few years we've lost test because we get beaten at the breakdown. Beau Robinson sh*ts all over Elsom, McCalman, Samo, Higgenbotham and Palu at the break down.
Do we need 3 no8s? I'd say no, especially when one of the 6s (Higgenbotham) played 8 last week.
It's an unnecessary risk.
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wikman
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Agreed. Although i can see the point at having 3 number eights when at least one can play flanker as well (Scott). It maybe due to Palu not being 100% and is a bigger possibility re-injuring than Pocock.
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gecko
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Samo, McCalman and Palu all play 8. Higgenbotham has played there a fair bit too, including last weekend. Elsom can also play 8 at a pinch. That's 4 genuine options and Elsom as fallback, Palu's injury doesn't validate that sort of coverage.
Meanwhile we have Pocock at 7 and.... has anyone played more than a game there in the squad?
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gecko
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Samo, McCalman and Palu all play 8. Higgenbotham has played there a fair bit too, including last weekend. Elsom can also play 8 at a pinch. That's 4 genuine options and Elsom as fallback, Palu's injury doesn't validate that sort of coverage.
Meanwhile we have Pocock at 7 and.... has anyone played more than a game there in the squad?
Sandpit Fan
Nev Cottrell (35)
And what would be the relationship of that statement to whether or not McKenzie instructed him to play loose?
Sandpit Fan
Nev Cottrell (35)
If Palu had a bit more game time under his belt I'd agree completely. Just think he is a little underdone at the moment and not sure we have enough games in hand for him to build up.
todd4
Dave Cowper (27)
Palu's inclusion alongside 35-year-old revelation Radike Samo and Ben McCalman gives Australia three No.8s, but came at the expense of Matt Hodgson as a back-up No.7 for Pocock.
Deans, though, said it was a gamble worth taking.
"That's a reflection of very much how the game's evolving, how the game's being played and being adjudicated," he said.
"Obviously we gave every possible permutation a lot of consideration and we believe that the players we've chosen will cater for our needs.
"It's obviously tough on Hodgo, among others."
Deans said McCalman would fill the No.7 role if Pocock went down.
This is an extract from article in todays paper, McCalman to be Pococks backup.
Deans, though, said it was a gamble worth taking.
"That's a reflection of very much how the game's evolving, how the game's being played and being adjudicated," he said.
"Obviously we gave every possible permutation a lot of consideration and we believe that the players we've chosen will cater for our needs.
"It's obviously tough on Hodgo, among others."
Deans said McCalman would fill the No.7 role if Pocock went down.
This is an extract from article in todays paper, McCalman to be Pococks backup.
Reddy!
Bob Davidson (42)
Eh, I dunno - I've forgotten how Palu plays, haven't seen much of him these last 2 years. Samo on the other hand is the greatest number 8 of all time.
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Rev Spooner
Guest
For all of Palu's bulk and supposed speed he is generally an "invisible" man on the field - much in the David Lyons mould. Promises a lot but rarely delivers.
Richo
John Thornett (49)
The 2009 EOYT team would be surprised to learn that. Maybe they'll want their votes back?
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2009-12-03/palu-heads-eales-medal-after-spring-tour/1168166
Scotty
David Codey (61)
Scotty
David Codey (61)
The relevant part is bolded.
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Rev Spooner
Guest
I would.
The article actually reinforces why I don't rate him - "Blockbusting number eight Wycliff Palu has capped a dramatic form turnaround by being named the Wallabies' best player on their spring rugby tour.
Axed during the earlier Tri-Nations series ...."
This guy is either invisible, having dramatic form changes or injured.
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
Hold onto something solid, but I think I actually agree worth Deans on this. I feel the risks of having a fetcher getting penalised for doing his job and pouring his hands in is outweighed by the counter ruck possibilities of having a mobile 8, old style 7, type player. I speculated at the start of the S15 that perhaps a return to a Poidevin type 7 would be the way of the future with the way the breakdown is being reffed and it looks like I ask not alone in thinking this. Slowing opposition ball is a dangerous reason to select a 7, IMO making the opposition commit players to every ruck or be turned over by counter ruck and put preasure in this way on the opp. 9 thereby slowing the ball and tying up his backrow running options at every ruck.
If McCalman is the best possible choice to fill the role, I dont think so, he doesn't have the physical presence in his preferred spot of 8 so I would have preferred Robinson with instructions to keep his hands out, unless out was a sure thing turnover. Such instruction would have negated his biggest problem, penalty rate.
Groucho
Greg Davis (50)
The key point is where Deans says: "That's a reflection of very much how the game's evolving, how the game's being played and being adjudicated."
What he is saying there is that the role of the seven is evolving. He simply doesn't want to back Pocock up with a fetcher. If Pocock gets injured, he wants to muscle up with a 6/8 style player.
What he is saying there is that the role of the seven is evolving. He simply doesn't want to back Pocock up with a fetcher. If Pocock gets injured, he wants to muscle up with a 6/8 style player.
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