Wallabies 3rd choice RWC hooker.

[Gnostic]

Makes you wonder why these attributes are not being assesed at a younger level. Saia is now getting towards mid career and it is probably too late but why was he not identified as loose forward material when he was younger? Why was Ben Daley not identified as hooker material younger as he goes very close to fitting fatprop's description above. His physique is very suitable for a hooker. Hindsight is a wonderful thing but what a waste.

Both are good players with good application, good attitude and strong work ethic but both are playing out of their niche that would see the best results out of them.

Do you think that some players look at what positions appear to be light on options and say I am going to make a tilt at that spot to maximise my chances of making the Wallabies. With Smith and Waugh having dominance of the 7 spot for so long how many other promising 7's moved overseas to get some game time. Lipman comes to mind, Beau Robinson, Salvi. There can be no doubt that some players like S. Finger and A. Frier were more suited to a back row spot than Hooker but Oz didn't have a lot of Hooker options on the retirement of Kearns and Foley until the advent of Moore and now TPN.

I do however think it comes back to coaching and selection and what skill sets they want. It comes back to my hated "work rate" argument. The set piece in Oz has been compromised for a long time because "work rate" is valued over and above effectiveness and technical skill at the set piece. I doubt very much if we will ever see a "Pot Plant" at THP for Oz again. Its rather ironic as Pato Noriega and Link Mackenzie would not get selected now using the current template of players we see getting selected.

I agree. Do you think we get too caught up in the weight side of the eqaution and not compare it with the players height? Players like Mealamu and Rutlidge are light but have a low centre of graity which would most certainly help them play tighter. Adam Frier also fits into that mould.

To a point, I think we get too caught up with weight and don't look enough at how good the player themsleves are and how good their skill set is for the position they play in. Willie O at 6' and 130Kg would have been a great front rower if we concentrate only on those aspects, Lomu 125Kg and 6'4" some would say too tall. It makes no assessment of the individual's skill set. Look at how many players have been compared to Lomu over the years, quite a few have had the physique (the most recent being Nadolo) but nobody has matched his skill set yet.

 

[Hawko]

How do you mean Hawko? Do you think Link is a fan of Fainga'a, not a fan of Hanson or does not like making changes?

Sorry just interested as to why you said that about Link's selections

I think Hanson has played well enough that he should be starting, but Link clearly doesn't agree. Wouldn't be the first time Link and I have disagreed on selection, despite the fact that I think he should be our next Aussie coach. As Hanson tends to play tighter than Fainga'a, who plays like another 7, he's not as visible but he's been very effective in my view and should always start against big scrummaging packs (as should Holmes instead of Daley). If I try to understand why Fainga'a has been chosen, I think its because Higgers and Houston are not very mobile and the pack just needs an extra quick, mobile fetcher around the park. Putting Higgers at 8 and Houston to the bench to bring on a more mobile backrower would have the same effect and allow Hanson to start.

 

[Ash]

The Reds would be better off starting Schatz at 8 and Houston off the bench if they want a more mobile backrow. Schatz has a higher workrate, is more mobile, and will play tighter than Houston.

 

[Gnostic]

The Reds would be better off starting Schatz at 8 and Houston off the bench if they want a more mobile backrow. Schatz has a higher workrate, is more mobile, and will play tighter than Houston.

This whole outlook is a blight on Australian forward play. Just Like Brown he has a great "work rate" but lets examine it net effectiveness. Lazy Leroy has a far bigger impact on the fewer rucks he gets to.

 

[farva]

3rd Hooker for the World Cup

I think that the first two are pretty much locked in place with TPN and Moore going.

The third spot is one of the most open of all the positions I feel. Who will get it? I can think of 5 possibilities. Fa'ainga, Hanson, Whittaker, Charles and Fitzpatrick.

I think Saia Fa'ainga and Nathan Charles are the leading candidates. Out of that I would like to see Charles get it as he is the better tight hooker, but Fa'ainga has the experience...

Discuss.

 

[light]

Well if we could avoid taking both Fa'ainga's that would be ideal..

Who'd have thought I'm a Reds fan

 

[Brumbies Guy]

Hasn't this exact thread been done already?

Edit - here: http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/fo...abies-3rd-choice-RWC-hooker.?highlight=hooker

 

[farva]

Hasn't this exact thread been done already?

Has it? If so can a mod delete it then?

 

[Slim 293]

I'm going with Charles.

Fainga'a worries me. Even though whoever the third hooker is will only come off the bench against the minnows.

I would've taken Edmonds over Fainga'a. If you're going to have a seagull, you may as well have a seagull with a reliable set piece.

 

[daz]

I voted Saia. I think he needs to lift his game in line-outs urgently, and I think he needs to fix whatever is causing him to be continually pinged at the breakdown.

Having said that, he has been a solid fixture for the Wobs in the last 2 seasons and while he is well below TPN and Moore in the pecking order, he has been part of the rebuilding fabric under Deans and importantly, understands the set up.
That cannot be underestimated in a WC year.

If TPN doesn't get up from injury, I'll bet my lunch money Saia gets the bench gig.

 

[Slim 293]

I think both Faingaas have been attending the Richie McCaw school for the breakdown.

Unfortunately for them there is only one way to enter a ruck.

 

[Jnor]

I'm going with Charles.

Fainga'a worries me. Even though whoever the third hooker is will only come off the bench against the minnows.

I would've taken Edmonds over Fainga'a. If you're going to have a seagull, you may as well have a seagull with a reliable set piece.

I'd be happy if choosing any one of the five if that was the case but if there's an injury or two it could well be that whoever it is ends up running on for a semi final or even the final. It's close but I think I'd go for Charles over Saia, but only just.

 

[BDA]

Hard choice between Saia and Charles. Niether is good enough to play against and tri-nations of six nations team.

Saia's poor in the set piece which is really the hooker's bread and butter. He's a weak scrummager and his throwing is inconsistent.
Charles does the basics well but he's not as effective as Saia in the loose.

Flip a coin. I'm sure Deans will go with Saia given that he did the hard yards last year and has been involved with the team now for one season. I have no issues with that selection esspecially because he's a guy that will flourish against minnow teams. I could see him scoring some tries in our easier games.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Saia will be picked, I'm pretty certain of that. My preference would be with Nathan Charles, but the fact that Saia has played test footy already will swing it in his favour I think.

 

[Brumbies Guy]

Saia's 10 or so test caps and the Reds impending finals experience leading up to the RWC should give him the nod.