Wallabies 2024

[Fergo]

Does it?

Bell
Tupou
Ala'alatoa
Frost
Skelton
Valetini
Ikitau
Nawaqanitawase

Are all players I'm confident building around going forward. I can't say the same about McDermott.

Kellaway is reliable but likewise I'm not sure he offers the upside potential we need from a key position like fullback. I can certainly see Jorgensen pushing for that spot in the next couple of years.

Tupou and Ikatau need much improvement before you start counting them in as secured. The BaaBaas game showed their fitness needs a big boost.

The squad for France wasn’t too far off in considering the options available. A few of the younger players will improve before the July game. Need another fly half to back up Gordon but most of all there needs to be some big fit props and hookers coming through. i see Canham from the Rebels as a focus in the locks and potentially Wilson from the Reds to expand his game. I‘d even go as far as seeing how he can transition to 6, or at least learn the duties to improve his game to be a viable contender. The Wallabies need a bigger and stronger pack and that’s we’re the focus needs to be. Bigger running centres also on the shopping list. Not sure if Kerevi’s days are done or it was lack of fitness due to injury.

 

[Fergo]

And I’ll be heading down to AAMI to make sure Carter is in front of the goal posts every day.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

My wishful thinking for next year.

Lonergan and Lolesio Wallaby 9&10 providing the combination from their playing at the Brumbies. Tate to come on in the last 20 for maximum chaos

You mean Lonergan & Jack Debreczeni

 

[whitefalcon]

You mean Lonergan & Jack Debreczeni

Entirely possible.

 

[Hawko]

NO Halfback or 10 is going to look much chop behind a beaten pack and all the time we are getting done at the breakdown both on attack and defence and even our set piece is fairly easy, at least our lineout is.
Fix the forward problems first before you start messing with the backs.

Without trying to belittle the need to improve the pack, a good halfback can still look good when the pack is getting beaten up. Exhibit 1: Ken Catchpole played behind beaten packs for much of his career but still looked great. His ability to clean up shit ball and hit his 10 with it accurately was legendary. Sadly most of you have never seen him, but 50+ years later I still remember him.

 

[A mutterer]

I'd argue there are still big question marks over McDermott's ability at test level. He has some pretty substantial holes in his game and it is still a problematic position for the Wallabies.

He's got the inside track now with White fading but I don't think it's an obvious long term selection. If he is our long term starter then he needs to be consistently a fair bit better than he has been so far for it not to remain a position of concern going forward.

Compare him against the WC finalists halves

Does he have a better pass?
Does he have a better kick?
Is he faster to the ruck?

Some flashy darts are great but are added value to core skills

 

[rugbyAU]

My wishful thinking for next year.

Lonergan and Lolesio Wallaby 9&10 providing the combination from their playing at the Brumbies. Tate to come on in the last 20 for maximum chaos

Not bad Lolesio will be our 2nd best 10 now and he’s a solid goal kicker they’ll be obviously playing together in a likely successful brumbies side that should make final 4 again next year, and Lonergan starting, Tate off the bench works well

 

[eastman]

NO Halfback or 10 is going to look much chop behind a beaten pack and all the time we are getting done at the breakdown both on attack and defence and even our set piece is fairly easy, at least our lineout is.
Fix the forward problems first before you start messing with the backs.

By this line of thinking the only halfbacks in the World who are going to look consistently good are those playing for France, South Africa and Ireland.

Forward pack dominance obviously helps but it’s a little bit of a cop out. Regardless Australia‘s strength at the moment is the forwards..

 

[eastman]

Tupou and Ikatau need much improvement before you start counting them in as secured. The BaaBaas game showed their fitness needs a big boost.

I wouldn’t read too much into a Barbarians game played at the end of a very long season, and those two players very much have assured positions if they come out of Super Rugby injury free.

 

[Froggy]

I don't see the fascination with Gordon learning to kick goals. Anyone can, it doesn't have to be the 10, he just needs to kick well out of hand. The two greatest Wallaby 10's in my time, Mark Ella and Steve Larkham, didn't kick goals. The Wallabies have had great goal-kickers from all positions, Matt Burke from fullback, Stirling Mortlock from centre, John Eales from lock. It is crucial we have a test level goal-kicker in the side, but it doean't need to be our 10.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

We don’t have other positions kicking well either.

Will definitely benefit his career otherwise it’s always a factor when selecting sides.

Jorgenson has kicked growing up and Sua’ali’i kicked really well for the Roosters. Could be options on the table soon that help Carter.

 

[Tomthumb]

I don't see the fascination with Gordon learning to kick goals. Anyone can, it doesn't have to be the 10, he just needs to kick well out of hand. The two greatest Wallaby 10's in my time, Mark Ella and Steve Larkham, didn't kick goals. The Wallabies have had great goal-kickers from all positions, Matt Burke from fullback, Stirling Mortlock from centre, John Eales from lock. It is crucial we have a test level goal-kicker in the side, but it doean't need to be our 10.

It's not a fascination, it's a great help to the team if the 10 can kick goals so you don't have to shoehorn in a goal kicker and push a potentially better player out of the team, exactly what happened during the World Cup

 

[dru]

We keep including Skelton in pack names "to build around". For the life of me, outside of RWC years (and even there it isn't as effective as seems to be implied), I can't see us building anything in the pack when a fulcrum of the pack structure and systems is missing in training. It is not as if those structures and systems are constant when he isn't there. Which is most of the time.

 

[Tomikin]

Agree, although he could also lift his passing game, as others have done, and become the 9 we need. At this time he is the best and plays well enough at the international level. I thought the young Force 9 showed a lot of promise and will be interesting to watch this coming season.

So his best is International standard, but someone like AAA isn't.. why not just say I like these players and should be selected.. leave the international standard bull crap else where

 

[fatprop]

So his best is International standard, but someone like AAA isn't.. why not just say I like these players and should be selected.. leave the international standard bull crap else where

He just has to be the best we have in the opinion of the coach, as I have said before we have a reasonable first 15 and then ....

all the options are compromises, we just watched Jones have a youth policy ie "f*ck it, the marginal squad incumbents haven't performed so lets try the kids" which went exceedingly well

Who knows what the next coach decides, we may bring back all the elderly mediocre or stay with the mediocre younglings with some hope that they grow into test players

We have two great props, one elderly prop who can contribute decent minutes then ...............
An adequate hooker (who became the captain?)
One decent lock
A backrow struggling to find balance
Average 9s,
Mediocre 10s
A great 13
A good back 3

There are holes everywhere

 

[Agent]

I wouldn’t read too much into a Barbarians game played at the end of a very long season, and those two players very much have assured positions if they come out of Super Rugby injury free.

Agreed. From what I know (which is very little) the Baabaas week would have been like a week of Mad Mondays with a game of rugby at the end, especially at the end of a RWC year. Actually sounds like great fun!

 

[Froggy]

Nobody is suggesting shoehorning a player in, Burke, Mortlock and Eales weren't exactly shoehorned in. I'm just making the point that it shouldn't necessarily be Gordon who has to kick goals, and it doesn't make him ineligible to be our 10 because he's not a goal-kicker. For example, if we were to pick Ryan Lonergan at 9 (who would be my first choice at this point of time) hew can kick goals.

 

[Braveheart81]

Nobody is suggesting shoehorning a player in, Burke, Mortlock and Eales weren't exactly shoehorned in. I'm just making the point that it shouldn't necessarily be Gordon who has to kick goals, and it doesn't make him ineligible to be our 10 because he's not a goal-kicker. For example, if we were to pick Ryan Lonergan at 9 (who would be my first choice at this point of time) hew can kick goals.

The main point is that not being a first choice goal kicker makes Gordon's position in the team more precarious.

It would be different if another first choice starter was a good goal kicker (such as Lonergan) but as it stood recently it meant we did compromise elsewhere by fitting in a goal kicker who otherwise probably wouldn't have been selected.

When Gordon's form came under question it became an easy decision to drop him. It wasn't that Donaldson was obviously a better option at 10, it was that if Donaldson could do a similar job at 10 we could improve our side by bringing in Kellaway.

 

[Desmond]

By this line of thinking the only halfbacks in the World who are going to look consistently good are those playing for France, South Africa and Ireland.

Forward pack dominance obviously helps but it’s a little bit of a cop out. Regardless Australia‘s strength at the moment is the forwards..

I think if we did fix our scrum and lineout first it lays a platform for the backs. Besides Tupou i can not think of a single dominate forward in any area (Scrum, Contact, Ruck or Lineout). If our strength is the forwards we are in deep deep trouble. If you cannot at the very least hold the opposition in a scrum you will not win a world cup or make the finals as shown recently.

 

[Slim 293]

Besides Tupou i can not think of a single dominate forward in any area (Scrum, Contact, Ruck or Lineout).

Bell? Valetini? Frost?