Wallabies 2023

[Tomthumb]

I mean the NRL definitely has our number currently as a professional domestic competition. In the media Suaalli has nearly exclusively been referred to as a Wallabies signing but both Rugby Australia and NRL journos.

No real chat about the benefits of the signing for the Waratahs because Super Rugby is so irrelevant in this country at the moment.

That's because international Rugby is the pinnacle of the sport

I don't mind league but they come across as extremely childish with all this. I mean if you are such a superior sport, why get so upset about one player leaving. It's pretty pathetic

 

[PhilClinton]

That's because international Rugby is the pinnacle of the sport

I don't mind league but they come across as extremely childish with all this. I mean if you are such a superior sport, why get so upset about one player leaving. It's pretty pathetic

Totally agree, they've gone toys out of the cot big time with this. Some of the comments from their older heads are absurd. Gould ranting about him having to leave the game straight away. That's coming from a bloke who literally signed any entirely new batch of players, at a new club, 2 years out from their start date.

 

[Members Section]

Don't forget PNG.

& a couple of towns across the nth of eng that you wouldn't walk down the street of

 

[Derpus]

So the Sua'ali'i move seems to be pretty much an all round win. Pros:
- good chance he performs for the Wallabies (and Tahs I guess). I think there's enough history of similar athletic outside backs succeeding in crossing over to suggest he will at the very least be a moderate success. People probably use Vunivalu as a counterpoint but he did look deadly when he first came over before he fried his hamstrings. Injury is a risk with any sporting contract.
- pisses off Gus Gould.
- is another step in a pretty long line of marketing driven decisions from McLennan. Adds another reason for casuals to switch on to the Lions and RWC. That three year period is going to be absolutely essential to kickstarting Rugby in Aus and it seems clear McLennan is trying to get his ducks in a row for that (see also private equity).
- At least partly subsidised by a private benefactor

Cons:
- I suppose you can argue we can't afford it but, even then, the eyeballs he brings in surely justifies his salary as it did with Folau.
- You can also argue that local players might be put off by his bumper salary. I think this is nonsense though - if they want more money they should just get better at playing rugby football. Ample opportunity for the top tier of players to earn a million+ in rugby.
- could possibly have used this money to get back a big name lock. That said Rory Arnold costs about the same and does he come with any of the benefits? He arguably isn't even in our best side.

I was against it initially but having read some of the pros and cons and enjoyed the angst generated in the NRL community I've been swayed. IMO signing Sua'ali'i has very little to do with beating the All Blacks.

 

[Dctarget]

- could possibly have used this money to get back a big name lock. That said Rory Arnold costs about the same and does he come with any of the benefits? He arguably isn't even in our best side.

Doesn't seem Arnold really cares about playing for the Wallabies, same for Coleman. Skelton could be a good get but he's tail end of his career. Kerevi is pretty fragile these days.

The real question is would Nathan Cleary have come over for 1.6 mil? He'd solve a few fly half issues for the Wallabies.

 

[Derpus]

Doesn't seem Arnold really cares about playing for the Wallabies, same for Coleman. Skelton could be a good get but he's tail end of his career. Kerevi is pretty fragile these days.

The real question is would Nathan Cleary have come over for 1.6 mil? He'd solve a few fly half issues for the Wallabies.

Yeah I would've taken any of those halves running around in NRL at the moment including guys like Moses, Reynolds etc. There are definitely better outside backs too. A guy like Tommy Turbo would be unstoppable in rugby.

I think being young have having 'next big thing' status weighs in his favour though.

 

[SouthernX]

- could possibly have used this money to get back a big name lock. That said Rory Arnold costs about the same and does he come with any of the benefits? He arguably isn't even in our best side.

spending 1.6 million on a big name lock is a better investment then spending 1.6 million on a big name winger..

the silver lining is when we lose a player to France or Japan we are not losing them to the wallabies (if they are good enough and have the caps they will continue to be selected)

I fear rugby league will one day come along and swoop in on an irreplaceable player from the wallabies setup & we won’t be able to take that talent on end of year tour.

 

[upthereds#!]

Exactly, i rate Sua'ali'i as a potential full-back option but i think Jorgo is clearly the smarter footballer and just is a natural full-back. Sua'ali'i played both wing, out-side center and a little bit of fullback throughout his schoolboy (2017 - 2019 - he did not play for kings in 2k20 and 2k21 due to his league contract) years and even made the Aus 2019 u18s schoolboy team as a winger at only 16 years of age.

Potential Waratahs backline if he joined the squad right now would look like this (imo)

10. Donaldson
11. Pietch
12. Foketi
13. Sua'ali'i
14. Marky Mark (Nawaqanitawase) (Nawaqanitawase)
15. Jorgensen

That has to be the strongest backline in super rugby.

Donaldson is an average Super Rugby 10
Pietch is an average and not really proven Super Rugby winger
Foketi is a solid Super Rugby player, not of international standard
Marky Mark (Nawaqanitawase) has barely started to play acceptable rugby so hold your horses, still struggles defensively
Then you got 2 teenagers.

Backline exceptionally inexperienced. Average age of 22. Keep looking

Barrett>Donaldson
Clarke>Pietch
RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck)> FOKETI
Ioane > Sua'ali'i
Telea> Marky Mark (Nawaqanitawase)
Perofeta>JorgensEn (for now)

 

[Dctarget]

Donaldson is an average Super Rugby 10
Pietch is an average and not really proven Super Rugby winger
Foketi is a solid Super Rugby player, not of international standard
Marky Mark (Nawaqanitawase) (Nawaqanitawase) has barely started to play acceptable rugby so hold your horses, still struggles defensively
Then you got 2 teenagers.

Backline exceptionally inexperienced. Average age of 22. Keep looking

Barrett>Donaldson
Clarke>Pietch
RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck) (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck)> FOKETI
Ioane > Sua'ali'i
Telea> Marky Mark (Nawaqanitawase) (Nawaqanitawase)
Perofeta>JorgensEn (for now)

I would argue the Rebels backline next year with our new signing will be even better:
10. Gordon 11. Kellaway 12. Ili 13. Ripley 14. Monty 15. Tupou

 

[qwerty51]

“Rugby Union is poaching our players”

* team list *

What's happened to that backrow? Are they still in rugby?

 

[Doritos Day]

Doesn't seem Arnold really cares about playing for the Wallabies, same for Coleman. Skelton could be a good get but he's tail end of his career. Kerevi is pretty fragile these days.

I don't think any Australian players are really screaming out to be brought home, probably just Koroibete.

Skelton is signed through to 2025. Kerevi injury risk (and R.A. clearly not that serious with a one year offer). Cooper old. They are the four banging down the door for Giteau picks at this WC. The rest aren't markedly better than their Australian-based competition.

Staniforth and BPA would also be a good shout.

Clearly the focus post-WC will be keeping talent around instead with a changing of the guard, $ spent on Gordon, Lynagh, Jorgensen, McReight, Frost etc. alongside another NRL raid or two. That's a pretty solid strategy for building a team that is both good and hopefully recognisable/marketable.

 

[Braveheart81]

What's happened to that backrow? Are they still in rugby?

Tuinona is now playing for the Hino Red Dolphins in Japan.
Roach retired and moved to Sydney to study medicine (taken from a RugbyReg post last year).
Masibaka debuted for the Force last year and is now playing for Montpellier.

 

[Slim 293]

Tuinona is now playing for the Hino Red Dolphins in Japan.

Or rather, along with Rory Arnold... not playing for the Hino Red Dolphins.

 

[wamberal]

& a couple of towns across the nth of eng that you wouldn't walk down the street of

I remember the days when the English league team used to wallop the Kangaroos. They produced some wonderful footballers.

 

[BDA]

Huh? Who really cares what Brandon Smith thinks about Rugby? Who really cares what Brandon Smith thinks about anything?

Have us beat how? League has this weird Napoleon complex due to the fact that outside the east coast of Australia and South Auckland, no one knows what League is. There is a reason that when Jarryd Hayne and Valentine Holmes tried the NFL they were referred to as "Rugby Players"

100%. the reaction of the NRL coaches and administrators to losing one player to Rugby (a player that always had rugby aspirations might I add) is a bit embarrassing honestly. Everything from Gould claiming "good riddance" to Sualli's own team mate essentially implying he's a glorified winger that's not worth the money. I actually thought McLennan hit the nail on his head with his comments yesterday.

Honestly the NRL really shouldn't give two shits about losing Sualli when they have plenty of up and coming talents to fill his spot. There is clearly some deep-seated insecurities at play.

The only people in the NRL that have a right to be genuinely upset about this should be those in charge of the NSW Origin Side. Sualli was already in the extended squad at 18 years old. He likely would have been a centre piece of that team over the next decade. Probably why Gould is so salty.

I actually think it's a great signing for rugby for a whole range of reasons. Talent wise the guy is only 19 and is already knocking on the door of Origin selection; the fact that there's already been some discussion about him taking Tedesco's place at fullback (a guy who is probably the best outside back in the NRL) says it all. Talent aside, the buzz it generates for the game makes it good bang for buck.

 

[scrans21]

Foketi is a solid Super Rugby player, not of international standard

I agree with most of what you said except for this point. I think Foketi proved last year that he's our second best 12 behind Kerevi (and I say this as a Reds fan with a huge hard on for Paisami). He was excellent all year, really stepped up in the internationals and looks to have carried that form into this year.

 

[fatprop]

Foketi is a solid Super Rugby player, not of international standard

I would have agreed with you prior to his efforts in our tests last year, I thought he was pretty good (surprised me)

 

[rodha]

Gotta point out - there are no unprecedented heights for the All Bleks.

Look at this from this angle:

Eddie will get an easier ride initially (2023-2025) due the outstanding development Rennie has done over last 3 years - in establishing the nucleus of the side for the 2023 World Cup and beyond, 2025-27 will be an interesting period as Eddie's record of developing teams himself is mostly non-existent.

In contrast, Razor will inherit a basket case after Foster spent the last 4 years stalling the development of the team, due to backing wrong players & combinations in crucial positions for almost an entire WC cycle, and then an exodus of senior All Blacks post 2023, means that Razor is going to be undertaking a significant rebuild come 2024.

Fortunately for All Black's supporters - Robertson's track record of rebuilding sides, bringing through the next generation in a seamless transition is exemplary.

Unfortunately for Wallabies fans - Eddie is not (a rebuilder of rugby teams).

For Eddie, the period after the initial seasons from inheriting Rennie's solid team (much like after he inherited the core of Lancaster's team for 2016-2019 cycle) will be very interesting to say the least.

 

[SouthernX]

Fortunately for All Black's supporters - Robertson's track record of rebuilding sides, bringing through the next generation in a seamless transition is outstandingly good.

don’t think you can call any crusaders side a rebuild. They have good depth. Players leave or get injured and it’s next man up.

 

[Ignoto]

I would have agreed with you prior to his efforts in our tests last year, I thought he was pretty good (surprised me)

If you pick Foketi in a cup competition, be prepared to not have him available in later games.

Him, Hunter and Perese all seem to be good for a few games and then bust themselves.