Wallabies 2023

[PhilClinton]

Still think it's a stretch too far at 12, I don't think his running game is that good anymore, nor his defense. But I love the sound of a fit and in form JOC (James O'Connor) (James O'Connor) at 10, let Quade and JOC (James O'Connor) (James O'Connor) fight it out.

I don’t think the Wallabies will be considering him as a first choice 12, especially considering they just added two more centres to the squad.

 

[Wallaby Man]

I don’t think the Wallabies will be considering him as a first choice 12, especially considering they just added two more centres to the squad.

Agreed. I think JOC (James O'Connor) challenge now is to prove his versatility for a 22/23 jersey than directly going into the side at a first choice 10/12/13/15.

 

[PhilClinton]

Agreed. I think JOC (James O'Connor) (James O'Connor) challenge now is to prove his versatility for a 22/23 jersey than directly going into the side at a first choice 10/12/13/15.

Yep - I think for next year the Reds will be looking at

10. Creighton
12. JOC (James O'Connor)

If he can regain some confidence, and when you consider he’s been a reliable 10 for several years now (to the point of winning SRAU player of the tournament in 2021) and has played in RWCs at 13 and 14, he clearly has the skill set to fill that 22/23 role going forward. A lot will come down to how his body holds up.

 

[Penguin]

If they are not all injured/suspended.

Yeah there is depth as in players fighting for spots but no world class locks outside of Arnold & Skelton

Philip - gets the absolute most out of himself
Swain - serious potential
Neville - good club player taking an opportunity
Frost - potential

To be classed as "World Class"a player needs to be dominant for an extended period in the test arena. Neither Skelton nor Arnold have achieved this by a long shot. Good players with world class potential.....

 

[Penguin]

Got to laugh at these comments judging Arnold and Skelton from their EOYT cameos.

Go speak to anyone up north about their performances for two of the best clubs in Toulouse and La Rochelle. They wouldn't look out of place in a Champions Cup XV of the tournament for the last two years.

There is a fair argument about how much value we get out of them when they get brought into the squad so late however which is why I don't understand why they don't get brought in ASAP even if they don't play yet.

It still doesn't automatically make them world class. That is a title earned not bestowed by the internet.

 

[qwerty51]

It still doesn't automatically make them world class. That is a title earned not bestowed by the internet.

Ok?

It makes them selectable for the Wallabies.

 

[Penguin]

Ok?

It makes them selectable for the Wallabies.

The original comment bringing up the subject was about them being world class. I took your comment as backing that notion up.
Of course I welcome their selections under the relevant parameters.

 

[Joe Blow]

I am yet to be convinced by Skelton but am open to being proven wrong. He has done nothing in test rugby to suggest that he can dominate at that level

 

[dru]

It still doesn't automatically make them world class. That is a title earned not bestowed by the internet.

Of course it is bestowed by "the internet". It comes from a supportive view from fans of the game and social media is as good as anywhere else to gauge it. And that in no means that it isn't earned.

 

[Penguin]

Of course it is bestowed by "the internet". It comes from a supportive view from fans of the game and social media is as good as anywhere else to gauge it. And that in no means that it isn't earned.

It's not earned because neither have proven themselves consistently at international level over a prolonged period. That's the definition of world class. It's not a matter of opinion.

 

[Hawko]

I am yet to be convinced by Skelton but am open to being proven wrong. He has done nothing in test rugby to suggest that he can dominate at that level

In the last two years I think he has had two (?) games off the bench. In his second he was pretty good. You'll never be proven wrong unless he gets good time in the squad and on the field. Nobody can prove they can dominate at test level with half an hour's playing time.

As good as our locks have been this year, none of them have proven that they can dominate at test level. Why does Skelton have to prove he's this good before he plays? Would our current locks play as well as him in the Top League? They might get a few less cards, but I don't think they'd all command the status and dollars he does.

We are stuck with a policy that does not allow people to be selected if they play overseas (beyond three exceptions) because the Board is petrified that if it's open slather then everyone will migrate north. Either you toss out the policy, or you modify it, or you potentially don't select the best players for the Australian team. We might keep the Super comp viable if we don't select overseas players, but then again we might not make it any farther than the world cup round robin or the quarter finals. That will not help Australian Rugby viability either.

Injuries have killed our test campaign so far. Unless we give Rennie some leeway to choose the people he wants, we are not going to get the results we want and we will remain in the 6-10 category. We could easily lose five of the next six games. Where does that put us in the pecking order? Not top four, that's for sure.

 

[liquor box]

Yep - I think for next year the Reds will be looking at

10. Creighton
12. JOC (James O'Connor) (James O'Connor)

If he can regain some confidence, and when you consider he’s been a reliable 10 for several years now (to the point of winning SRAU player of the tournament in 2021) and has played in RWCs at 13 and 14, he clearly has the skill set to fill that 22/23 role going forward. A lot will come down to how his body holds up.

I hope you are right about the Reds, I hope Lynagh is on the bench

 

[stillmissit]

In the last two years I think he has had two (?) games off the bench. In his second he was pretty good. You'll never be proven wrong unless he gets good time in the squad and on the field. Nobody can prove they can dominate at test level with half an hour's playing time.

As good as our locks have been this year, none of them have proven that they can dominate at test level. Why does Skelton have to prove he's this good before he plays? Would our current locks play as well as him in the Top League? They might get a few less cards, but I don't think they'd all command the status and dollars he does.

We are stuck with a policy that does not allow people to be selected if they play overseas (beyond three exceptions) because the Board is petrified that if it's open slather then everyone will migrate north. Either you toss out the policy, or you modify it, or you potentially don't select the best players for the Australian team. We might keep the Super comp viable if we don't select overseas players, but then again we might not make it any farther than the world cup round robin or the quarter finals. That will not help Australian Rugby viability either.

Injuries have killed our test campaign so far. Unless we give Rennie some leeway to choose the people he wants, we are not going to get the results we want and we will remain in the 6-10 category. We could easily lose five of the next six games. Where does that put us in the pecking order? Not top four, that's for sure.

Hawko, I believe that the policy is sound enough and we can afford to go to 4 but I think that would be it. We are generally 'short' of locks and have been for a while. AFL takes a lot of tall guys these days and we should be scouting South Africa for young talent and checking AFL youngsters who don't make it.
I found your last sentence to be a 'glass half empty'. You could be right but I would bet you are wrong!

 

[dru]

In the last two years I think he has had two (?) games off the bench. In his second he was pretty good. You'll never be proven wrong unless he gets good time in the squad and on the field. Nobody can prove they can dominate at test level with half an hour's playing time.

As good as our locks have been this year, none of them have proven that they can dominate at test level. Why does Skelton have to prove he's this good before he plays? Would our current locks play as well as him in the Top League? They might get a few less cards, but I don't think they'd all command the status and dollars he does.

We are stuck with a policy that does not allow people to be selected if they play overseas (beyond three exceptions) because the Board is petrified that if it's open slather then everyone will migrate north. Either you toss out the policy, or you modify it, or you potentially don't select the best players for the Australian team. We might keep the Super comp viable if we don't select overseas players, but then again we might not make it any farther than the world cup round robin or the quarter finals. That will not help Australian Rugby viability either.

Injuries have killed our test campaign so far. Unless we give Rennie some leeway to choose the people he wants, we are not going to get the results we want and we will remain in the 6-10 category. We could easily lose five of the next six games. Where does that put us in the pecking order? Not top four, that's for sure.

With limited positions available from overseas, and then they have limited time in training with the team before games, you need to select players who can slot into the exact same game plan and not require further team and/or tactic changes. Koroibete, Kerevi, and even Quade pretty much do this.

I haven't been watching NH rugby but do take note of Skelton's reputation at face value. Certainly if they have managed to get him to potential then he should be a ruck, scrum and maul monster, let alone bashing hard yards in tight. But is he jumping?

He would probably slot in at 5, tight head side. 4 would need to be the line out guru - nothing strange there. Next I think we need three reliable jumpers, so 4, 6 and 8. In my mind this would either just fortunately align or the 6 role becomes more a hybrid lock/6 and we need 8 as a solid option.

I would imagine this is going to end up a different configuration without Skelton in SH tests than in the NH with him. And he doesn't get the time needed for the team tactics to adjust around him in general.

It's a nice problem to have, but the selection is not simply down to whether Skelton is theoretically good enough. It's a prime example of how having our players competing locally is a major benefit to the Wallabies.

 

[Joe Blow]

Just the fact that hes not a real lineout option is an issue. The other side of it is it does not appear as if he is motivated to play. I mean, he will if RA jump through all the hoops but he has been approached many times since going OS and has shown a complete lack of will to jump through any hoops himself.

 

[stillmissit]

With limited positions available from overseas, and then they have limited time in training with the team before games, you need to select players who can slot into the exact same game plan and not require further team and/or tactic changes. Koroibete, Kerevi, and even Quade pretty mcc do this.

I haven't been watching NH rugby but do take note of Skelton's reputation at face value. Certainly if they have managed to get him to potential then he should be a ruck, scrum and maul monster, let alone bashing hard yards in tight. But is he jumping?

He would probably slot in at 5, tight head side. 4 would need to be the line out guru - nothing strange there. Next I think we need three reliable jumpers, so 4, 6 and 8. In my mind this would either just fortunately align or the 6 role becomes more a hybrid lock/6 and we need 8 as a solid option.

I would imagine this is going to end up a different configuration without Skelton in SH tests than in the NH with him. And he doesn't get the time needed for the team tactics to adjust around him in general.

It's a nice problem to have, but the selection is not simply down to whether Skelton is theoretically good enough. It's a prime example of how having our players competing locally is a major benefit to the Wallabies.

Good post dru: I would like to see Holloway at 6 or 8 as the alternate jumper and his running and distribution could add a lot to Australia. Skelton looks like a monster in the cameo's I have watched him on utube. I was expecting him to rip into it in his 30 mins last year and I thought the speed of the game caught him unprepared. Open to anything that will improve our tight forwards as we are not great in that area, particularly breakdown work.

 

[Proud Pig]

I agree with RA on this. They have said you wanted to be able to pick three from overseas we gave you three. Now you are saying well you know what I really want another one so lets make it four.
Where does it stop, I mean five is only one extra on top of the four and really once we are at five six is only one more.
We have picked a number and made a call at three, either stick to it or throw the rule out entirely and make it open slather.

 

[Serge]

I agree with Rugby Australia on this. They have said you wanted to be able to pick three from overseas we gave you three. Now you are saying well you know what I really want another one so lets make it four.
Where does it stop, I mean five is only one extra on top of the four and really once we are at five six is only one more.
We have picked a number and made a call at three, either stick to it or throw the rule out entirely and make it open slather.

I think three would have stayed as the number for Rennie had we not had the number of injuries in some key positions that have led to what might be called extenuating circumstances.

 

[PhilClinton]

I think three would have stayed as the number for Rennie had we not had the number of injuries in some key positions that have led to what might be called extenuating circumstances.

Yep, he's not asking to bring in another half back to the squad, it's a second rower which is a position identified as injury savaged.

I still have hope that RA are going to work in a loophole where they count Kerevi as an Australian based player because he's playing 7s at the moment, and allow the 4th overseas based player to be selected. That way they aren't seen as going back on their word necessarily.

 

[Members Section]

Yep, he's not asking to bring in another half back to the squad, it's a second rower which is a position identified as injury savaged.

I still have hope that Rugby Australia are going to work in a loophole where they count Kerevi as an Australian based player because he's playing 7s at the moment, and allow the 4th overseas based player to be selected. That way they aren't seen as going back on their word necessarily.

We just need him to sign he's next deal in aus already!