Wallabies 2023

[cyclopath]

But both Gordon and Donaldson kick it significantly further than Foley too. Bernard is at or near the bottom of a pretty long list.

Any data to back this up or is it the vibe?

 

[TSR]

Any data to back this up or is it the vibe?

is it a overly controversial statement though.

As a Tahs fan, do you consider Foley’s ability to kick deep from his own end to be a strength? Genuinely interested. I always thought it was well accepted Foley didn’t have a great boot.

Edit: sorry, I’ve realised the original comment was about his goal kicking anyway

 

[dru]

Hodge is definitely your 23 if you have a 6:2 bench. He certainly offers more versatility in the 22 jersey than a specialist 10 but I think it depends on what your overall structure looks like.

Assume your centres are Kerevi and Ikitau and your back three are Koroibete, Petaia and Kellaway or Wright. If your 23 was Perese then you probably do have a specialist 10 in the 22 jersey because Perese covers the centres and wing and Petaia/Kellway/Wright (whoever was on the wing) covers fullback.

If Hodge is also covering 12 and 13 then he certainly makes sense as the player covering 10 as well.

BH, the other back bench utility that would help is a 23 whose day job is 15 backing as second play maker. Short of Jock Campbell and Debreceni I can't think of one. Donaldson? Wright, Petaia, Kellaway all seem no to me.

The centres who might back as second playmaker gets empty after about Stewart. I wouldn't count Foketi, Paisami, Kerevi, who am I forgetting?

Hodge has pretty much got his arse on the way to the RWC at that count.

 

[cyclopath]

is it a overly controversial statement though.

As a Tahs fan, do you consider Foley’s ability to kick deep from his own end to be a strength? Genuinely interested. I always thought it was well accepted Foley didn’t have a great boot.

Dunno, I do remember a 48m kick in 2014 with some clarity. Anecdotal data up the wazoo!! The strength or otherwise of a 10 is probably determined by more than how far they kick it.
In any event, I find it somewhat irritating when people post opinions as data, and present it as an immutable fact. Is it better to kick it 60m straight down the guts, or 45 m towards a touchline? I don't know. People see what they want to see.
A few years back there was debate on here about the effectiveness of a bunch of goal-kickers. I dug out the data (not too hard to do if one wants to try) and the results were interesting. For that reason I tend to not go with the vibe, but data.
I'm on record here many times stating that I think Cooper is our best option (if fit). If not, I don't believe Lolesio, Hodge or Gordon are necessarily next.

 

[LMU]

He could be the best goal kicker of the bunch and he's the starting 10 for the second best team in Japan.

If he gets picked it won't just be because he's a good goal kicker.



What makes you think that?

I thought it was a decision for the Japanese club to release Kerevi for any Test duties. The last time he got injured and missed the season, lost his contract with Suntory and had to find a new club. I imagine both player and club would be thinking long and hard about any extra activities.

 

[Doritos Day]

I thought it was a decision for the Japanese club to release Kerevi for any Test duties. The last time he got injured and missed the season, lost his contract with Suntory and had to find a new club. I imagine both player and club would be thinking long and hard about any extra activities.

Unless I’ve missed something his contract with Suntory was expiring and he was already looking for a new club when he got injured

 

[LMU]

Unless I’ve missed something his contract with Suntory was expiring and he was already looking for a new club when he got injured

Maybe I missed something, I understood his contract with Suntory finishes in July. He has missed a whole season and Suntory didn't offer a new contract. If he hadn't of been injured on Wallaby duty and played the season (and played well) I would imagine Suntory would have renewed.

 

[PhilClinton]

I thought it was a decision for the Japanese club to release Kerevi for any Test duties. The last time he got injured and missed the season, lost his contract with Suntory and had to find a new club. I imagine both player and club would be thinking long and hard about any extra activities.

There is a test window which all competitions are required to release players for on international duty. When Kerevi first signed with Suntory, he was only inelgible for those tests because of a rule set in place by RA. That rule has since been amended and he has played in every test during that window that he has been available for.

Kerevi has stated he will be remaining in Japan, after turning down a 1-year deal with a second-year team option to return to Super Rugby earlier this year.

Latest reports suggest he is either re-signing with Suntory for $1M+ or signing with a 2nd division Japanese club in a deal worth around $1.5M a season.

Nothing is suggesting him re-signing in Japan will jeopardise his ability to play for the Wallabies. It may have an impact on his contract value, but based on him turning down the RA offer, he will still be earning more in Japan.

 

[LeCheese]

Maybe I missed something, I understood his contract with Suntory finishes in July. He has missed a whole season and Suntory didn't offer a new contract. If he hadn't of been injured on Wallaby duty and played the season (and played well) I would imagine Suntory would have renewed.

Let's not forget he was injured during Comm Games 7s, not Wallabies duties

 

[LMU]

There is a test window which all competitions are required to release players for on international duty. When Kerevi first signed with Suntory, he was only inelgible for those tests because of a rule set in place by Rugby Australia. That rule has since been amended and he has played in every test during that window that he has been available for.

Kerevi has stated he will be remaining in Japan, after turning down a 1-year deal with a second-year team option to return to Super Rugby earlier this year.

Latest reports suggest he is either re-signing with Suntory for $1M+ or signing with a 2nd division Japanese club in a deal worth around $1.5M a season.

Nothing is suggesting him re-signing in Japan will jeopardise his ability to play for the Wallabies. It may have an impact on his contract value, but based on him turning down the Rugby Australia offer, he will still be earning more in Japan.

I understand all this except the Japan Club does not have to release the player. I remember numerous times this was quoted over the years. If i was a 2nd tier club paying $1.5m a season, i wouldn't let him go anywhere. Eddie has influence at Suntory but I don't think that extends to 2nd tier clubs.

 

[Dctarget]

I understand all this except the Japan Club does not have to release the player. I remember numerous times this was quoted over the years. If i was a 2nd tier club paying $1.5m a season, i wouldn't let him go anywhere. Eddie has influence at Suntory but I don't think that extends to 2nd tier clubs.

Technically they do have to release him according to reg. 9 if it's in the international window. Australia has recently tried to keep the Japanese clubs on side by not taking the players for the full season. But there would be a massive outcry if they tried to keep Samu for the World Cup and probably the Championship too.

Also, his new contract has been signed since he has played for the Wallabies as an OS player, so they know it's coming.

 

[PhilClinton]

I understand all this except the Japan Club does not have to release the player. I remember numerous times this was quoted over the years. If i was a 2nd tier club paying $1.5m a season, i wouldn't let him go anywhere. Eddie has influence at Suntory but I don't think that extends to 2nd tier clubs.

Well no, you obviously don't understand because that's just blatantly incorrect. As stated by myself and other posters, there is an international window where teams are required by World Rugby to release players for international duty.

Any team that signs Samu Kerevi knows this.

The more you keep doubling down on this to more you're coming off as a tool. Just accept the fact that Kerevi will likely be starting for the Wallabies if he's fit.

 

[Rebel man]

Well no, you obviously don't understand because that's just blatantly incorrect. As stated by myself and other posters, there is an international window where teams are required by World Rugby to release players for international duty.

Any team that signs Samu Kerevi knows this.

The more you keep doubling down on this to more you're coming off as a tool. Just accept the fact that Kerevi will likely be starting for the Wallabies if he's fit.

Exactly.

 

[stillmissit]

Dunno, I do remember a 48m kick in 2014 with some clarity. Anecdotal data up the wazoo!! The strength or otherwise of a 10 is probably determined by more than how far they kick it.
In any event, I find it somewhat irritating when people post opinions as data, and present it as an immutable fact. Is it better to kick it 60m straight down the guts, or 45 m towards a touchline? I don't know. People see what they want to see.
A few years back there was debate on here about the effectiveness of a bunch of goal-kickers. I dug out the data (not too hard to do if one wants to try) and the results were interesting. For that reason I tend to not go with the vibe, but data.
I'm on record here many times stating that I think Cooper is our best option (if fit). If not, I don't believe Lolesio, Hodge or Gordon are necessarily next.

Following the data is fine assuming it is accurate and interpreted scientifically - a big if. The odd thing about humans is that intuition can sometimes outdo data but it is more of an exception.
I have no data to offer you apart from old eyes which have seen a fair bit but I would be prepared to bet you that Gordon will be a better option than Foley at this WC, I would also put Lolesio in front of Foley due to what I am seeing this season.
The problem with historical data is that its usefulness disappears rapidly and that is as much a rapier to the heart of rugby players as most things.

 

[Members Section]

There is a test window which all competitions are required to release players for on international duty. When Kerevi first signed with Suntory, he was only inelgible for those tests because of a rule set in place by Rugby Australia. That rule has since been amended and he has played in every test during that window that he has been available for.

Kerevi has stated he will be remaining in Japan, after turning down a 1-year deal with a second-year team option to return to Super Rugby earlier this year.

Latest reports suggest he is either re-signing with Suntory for $1M+ or signing with a 2nd division Japanese club in a deal worth around $1.5M a season.

Nothing is suggesting him re-signing in Japan will jeopardise his ability to play for the Wallabies. It may have an impact on his contract value, but based on him turning down the Rugby Australia offer, he will still be earning more in Japan.

Hasn't played yet for Santory, wonder if he will be ready by july or Eddie holds him back till the France game

 

[Dctarget]

Eddie used an informal leadership team of Hooper, Slipper, Ala'alatoa, White, Kellaway & Holloway at the wallabies camp apparently.

Kellaway an interesting inclusion to me. The rest make sense.

 

[stillmissit]

BH, the other back bench utility that would help is a 23 whose day job is 15 backing as second play maker. Short of Jock Campbell and Debreceni I can't think of one. Donaldson? Wright, Petaia, Kellaway all seem no to me.

The centres who might back as second playmaker gets empty after about Stewart. I wouldn't count Foketi, Paisami, Kerevi, who am I forgetting?

Hodge has pretty much got his arse on the way to the RWC at that count.

Agree and a fine thing to. He ain't our best player but he is functional and has real guts. An essential part of the glue.
Will be interesting to see how Eddie sees it.

 

[LeCheese]

Kellaway an interesting inclusion to me. The rest make sense.

Been on the (non-Wallabies) scene for a while and would be one of the most senior in the camp. Makes sense imo

 

[Braveheart81]

I have no data to offer you apart from old eyes which have seen a fair bit but I would be prepared to bet you that Gordon will be a better option than Foley at this WC, I would also put Lolesio in front of Foley due to what I am seeing this season.

Unless you've been watching the Japanese Top League to somewhat compare like for like this seems like you can only be comparing current year Super Rugby form against last year's test form.

 

[Members Section]

Unless you've been watching the Japanese Top League to somewhat compare like for like this seems like you can only be comparing current year Super Rugby form against last year's test form.

He is winning an playing a real rsa game style they are coached by Former bulls coach Frans Ludeke & are stacked with a few rsa internationals but other than that I dont think anyone can offer you much as in how he is going