Wallabies 2023

[LeCheese]

In round 5, neither Rebels starting centres were Wallaby eligible, the Brumbies 12 isn't Wallabies eligible and the Force 13 isn't Wallabies eligible.

Given Kerevi isn't in the country (and is still injured) and Paisami is also now out with a substantial injury it's hard to make a Wallabies squad without Foketi and/or Perese in the centres even if their form hasn't been fantastic.

If you were looking at form Australian centres you're really only talking about Ikitau and Flook.

Yep, that's valid - but I don't take it as a sign that Super Rugby, as a whole, has too many international; more that it's a unique circumstance across a couple of positions at the moment.

Would be interesting to see the % breakdown of Wallabies eligible players across the squads.

 

[Braveheart81]

Yep, that's valid - but I don't take it as a sign that Super Rugby, as a whole, has too many international; more that it's a unique circumstance across a couple of positions at the moment.

Would be interesting to see the % breakdown of Wallabies eligible players across the squads.

It's a problem we've encountered before though that we end up with a glut of ineligible players in a single position that then has flow on effects to the Wallabies.

I think it does somewhat show how hard it is to effectively spread players around though. Players play where they want to and largely the money isn't massively different. The Force for example weren't going to offer the completely untested Mosese Tuipulotu substantially more money than the Waratahs were this year to move to Perth so they could have another Australian eligible centre.

Likewise players who don't get the offer or opportunity they want from their current side are often not going to do everything in their power to stay in Australia and play for another Super Rugby side. If anything, the chance to move overseas could be more enticing particularly for younger, unattached players.

 

[BDA]

Does anyone else have question marks over Hooper? I thought he was pretty ineffectual for the wallabies last year and he's not really setting the world on fire for the Tahs either. He doesn't seem to be much of a threat at the breakdown and he's not as effective with ball in hand as he was in years past. Still has a great gas tank but i'm not sure that's enough. Really keen to see what he can produce against a strong brumbies back row this weekend.

 

[qwerty51]

He's been awful, to put it simply. There are still 10 matches to go.

 

[John S]

All those years of carrying both Waratahs and Wallabies on his shoulders has caught up with him I think. He doesn't have the same buzz this year.

 

[Eddie's Eyebrows]

He's still going about his work with the energy that has become synonymous with Hooper... he's just not being as effective. Falling off tackles, getting blown away at breakdowns. Getting knocked back when attacking the line.

 

[BDA]

At this rate I'd probably prefer McReight or Samu (depending on the make up of the rest of the pack). I'd say both are more effective than Hooper in particular aspects of their game (McReight at the breakdown and Samu in the collision)

 

[Tomthumb]

With the amount of Rugby he has played, 31 years old for Hooper is about 51 years old for the rest of us. Not surprising he isn't the same guy anymore

 

[rodha]

Eddie living rent free in your head still I see

I don't expect much from Eddie but this outstanding Wallabies outfit (developed by Dave Rennie) would sleepwalk into the 2023 Quarter's coached by a lemming as their draw is such that anything short of the Semi's would be an abject failure. So it's a beautiful gig to walk into as arguably even if you're inept you'll still manage to go deep into the tournament and retain your dignity.

 

[Adam84]

as a benchmark for being labelled outstanding, I’d say a 50% win rate is the minimum requirement.

2022 Wallabies were not outstanding, they bounced between hopeless and adequate.

 

[Tomthumb]

I don't expect much from Eddie but this outstanding Wallabies outfit (developed by Dave Rennie) would sleepwalk into the 2023 Quarter's coached by a lemming as their draw is such that anything short of the Semi's would be an abject failure. So it's a beautiful gig to walk into as arguably even if you're inept you'll still manage to go deep into the tournament and retain your dignity.

Yeah, 38% win record. Give that man a gold star!

 

[rodha]

as a benchmark for being labelled outstanding, I’d say a 50% win rate is the minimum requirement.

2022 Wallabies we’re not outstanding, they bounced between hopeless and adequate.

I meant what he ultimately developed (in a broader, bigger picture sense). the groundwork established during his tenure.

and to be fair, we only saw 3 games (in 2021) with his full strength preferred team and they looked like world-beaters.

 

[Braveheart81]

What did he ultimately develop?

We're an inconsistent side with a bunch of gaping holes in the team. He finished with the worst record of any modern Wallaby coach and you're saying that the team he left us with is outstanding on the back of three performances in 2021?

 

[rodha]

What did he ultimately develop?

We're an inconsistent side with a bunch of gaping holes in the team. He finished with the worst record of any modern Wallaby coach and you're saying that the team he left us with is outstanding on the back of three performances in 2021?

Remember that Cheika didn't look beyond his term, he didn't bring through the next generation.

After 2019 WC thousands of caps left overseas, leaving Rennie to build a new team virtually from scratch.

He developed depth across the board and implemented astute gameplans to exploit opposition team's weaknesses, the first coach since McKenzie to do so. He also used his bench players effectively - again something that only McKenzie before him did smartly.

Robbie was reluctant to use his substitutes at all which resulted in countless matches the Wallabies lost in the dying stages after initially developing strong leads. Cheika at least used his bench, but he rarely got the balance right, lightweight packs got lighter as the match progressed.

 

[qwerty51]

rodha would love to know how you excuse the England series results and the Bledisloe in NZ a week after nearly beating them.

 

[SouthernX]

Remember that Cheika didn't look beyond his term, he didn't bring through the next generation.

After 2019 WC thousands of caps left overseas, leaving Rennie to build a new team virtually from scratch.

He developed depth across the board and implemented astute gameplans to exploit opposition team's weaknesses, the first coach since McKenzie to do so.

can you please tally these thousand(s) caps… won’t be hard. Start with the veterans

 

[Braveheart81]

Remember that Cheika didn't look beyond his term, he didn't bring through the next generation.

After 2019 WC thousands of caps left overseas, leaving Rennie to build a new team from scratch.

Rob Valetini and Jordan Petaia made their debuts in 2019.
Tom Banks, Folau Fainga'a, Jake Gordon and Pete Samu debuted in 2018.
Taniela Tupou, Matt Philip and Marika Koroibete debuted in 2017.

It is hard to find a player who has debuted after that was held back because Cheika ignored the future beyond that 2019 RWC.

The 2020 debutants included Wilson, Lolesio, Paisami, McDermott, McReight, Swinton, Tom Wright, Angus Bell.
2021 debutants included Kellaway, Lonergan, Swain, Ikitau, Leota, Perese, Foketi.

Pretty much none of these players were really on the radar to play for the Wallabies in 2019 or earlier.

Of course guys who were core players under Rennie such as Slipper, Ala'alatoa, Hooper, Hodge, Kerevi, Cooper etc. debuted earlier than that (some before Cheika started coaching the Wallabies).

How exactly didn't Cheika look beyond his tenure any more than any other coaches do? Which players who have debuted since should have had already had a bunch of caps when Rennie started?

 

[Dctarget]

Lads how has Rodha tricked you into arguing about what you just swore off doing a week ago? You know he gets off on this weird merry go round of nonsense, don't give in

 

[Braveheart81]

Lads how has Rodha tricked you into arguing about what you just swore off doing a week ago? You know he gets off on this weird merry go round of nonsense, don't give in

It's too hard to ignore.

 

[John S]

View attachment 15577

It's too hard to ignore.

It's called the ignore button for a reason worked wonders for me, I can only see the reasonable replies to something quite probably ridiculous