Wallabies 2023

[Braveheart81]

We had the talent to beat England IMO. Those last two games were entirely winnable and, for the third game, should have been won.

I think they are quite tactically naive, to be honest. England turned the screws on us when they had early dominance in game two by taking every point on offer. For our dominance in that first 15 minutes of game three we got nothing. Kicking goals wins test matches.

We missed our only shot at goal in that period though and we didn't turn down any shots at goal.

Our opportunities were more to score tries and we couldn't execute.

I would argue that our biggest issue currently is discipline. We still give away far too many dumb penalties in almost every test. There were a lot of key moments in that test where we lost momentum or gifted points on the back of discipline.

 

[Derpus]

We missed our only shot at goal in that period though and we didn't turn down any shots at goal.

Our opportunities were more to score tries and we couldn't execute.

I would argue that our biggest issue currently is discipline. We still give away far too many dumb penalties in almost every test. There were a lot of key moments in that test where we lost momentum or gifted points on the back of discipline.

Sure discipline was crap too.

Another issue within our control and not stemming from a lack of talent.

 

[liquor box]

We missed our only shot at goal in that period though and we didn't turn down any shots at goal.

Our opportunities were more to score tries and we couldn't execute.

I would argue that our biggest issue currently is discipline. We still give away far too many dumb penalties in almost every test. There were a lot of key moments in that test where we lost momentum or gifted points on the back of discipline.

Didn't we turn down a penalty chance in front when we were about 11 points down with 20 mins?? to go?

I realise that this would still leave us with 8 points to get even but there was plenty of time left.

 

[Braveheart81]

So where did we get to after this series? A look at some/most of our players and how they performed across the three games:

Angus Bell - was excellent, particularly in the second test. Shame he got injured in the third test but he is clearly a long term Wallabies star.
James Slipper - had a really strong series playing on both sides of the scrum. He's clearly in our best 23 and while I generally expect Angus Bell to start going forward we don't lose much with Slipper starting.
Dave Porecki - great debut in the first test and performed well all series. His set piece is really reliable and he's good around the park. He's the clear first choice hooker going forward until someone changes that narrative.
Folau Fainga'a - was poor in the second test and blew a key lineout that lost a lot of momentum to our comeback. Was very good off the bench in the third test. The 16 jersey is pretty solidly his for now.
Taniela Tupou - had a poor series overall. He did a few good things in the second test but also made a bunch of errors. His scrummaging was not close to being dominant. He has all the talent but isn't putting it together consistently at this point.
Allan Ala'alatoa - solid series.
Scott Sio - was playing well until he got injured. Definitely our 5th prop right now.
Matt Philip - was really good in the third test and generally had a solid series. It's getting harder for him to keep his spot when Arnold is available but he's pushing hard to keep it.
Darcy Swain - terrible brain explosion in the first test and he's damaged his chances of remaining a first choice lock. Could find himself lower down the queue after a great introduction by Frost.
Nick Frost - excellent in the third test. He's going to make it hard to leave him out of our best 23 even when Arnold joins.
Cadeyrn Neville - very good in the first test and a shame he got injured in the second. Expect him back in the 23 when he is healthy based on a strong start.
Rob Leota - was alright but nothing more than that. Definitely a question over who our 6 is going forward.
Harry Wilson - didn't have a good game in the third test in his only opportunity. Might have to wait for his next shot.
Michael Hooper - was probably only solid in the first two tests by his standards but had some excellent moments in the first test in key defensive plays. Was very good in the third particularly in the first half winning several turnovers (albeit not through pilfers). Thought his leadership through the series was good.
Rob Valetini - was good through the series. Pretty bolted on selection at number 8.
Pete Samu - had a really good series. He's a lock for the 20 jersey now.

I'll come back later and do the backs.

 

[liquor box]

We had the talent to beat England IMO. Those last two games were entirely winnable and, for the third game, should have been won.

I think they are quite tactically naive, to be honest. England turned the screws on us when they had early dominance in game two by taking every point on offer. For our dominance in that first 15 minutes of game three we got nothing. Kicking goals wins test matches.

We also seem to want to run it from the middle third of the pitch. The percentage play is to kick for territory or a contestable bomb which pretty much all the top sides now utilise as their primary midfield tactic. This is a tactical decision.

And it's weird to be so focused on a running game when our set piece, particularly the lineout, actually looked to have a little ascendency.

And honestly can we just bench Tupou? He's probably our best player, but he's half arsing it.

I have long thought we don't take enough chances at drop goals, it is not the most exciting way to play the game but as soon as we get advantage within 30m of the line we may as well have a shot.

This does not happen very often so it would be hard to work out "money ball" stats on whether it is viable but given the number of chances we would get even a low percentage would give us 3-6 points we may not have gotten.

 

[Braveheart81]

Didn't we turn down a penalty chance in front when we were about 11 points down with 20 mins?? to go?

I realise that this would still leave us with 8 points to get even but there was plenty of time left.

Yes. I would have taken the three then too.

I was responding to the criticism of the first 15 minutes where we had all the territory and possession and didn't score points and then went down 3-0.

 

[Marce]

The Wallabies have reached 400k followers in instagram. Many don't care about social networks but I think it would be a BIG mistake ignore it. The new generation carry their mobile everywhere, every second of their life.

It's a pretty good number if you compare with the numbers of international rugby teams and popular sport teams in Australia.

England Rugby 1M
France Rugby 683k
Springboks 676k
Irish Rugby 588k
Welsh Rugby 383k

In Australia:

Cricket Australia 1.1M
NRL 1.1M
AFL 989k
NSW Blues 370k
QLD Maroons 389k

So elite rugby is the face of RA in the country and overseas

 

[dru]

So where did we get to after this series? A look at some/most of our players and how they performed across the three games:

Angus Bell - was excellent, particularly in the second test. Shame he got injured in the third test but he is clearly a long term Wallabies star.
James Slipper - had a really strong series playing on both sides of the scrum. He's clearly in our best 23 and while I generally expect Angus Bell to start going forward we don't lose much with Slipper starting.
Dave Porecki - great debut in the first test and performed well all series. His set piece is really reliable and he's good around the park. He's the clear first choice hooker going forward until someone changes that narrative.
Folau Fainga'a - was poor in the second test and blew a key lineout that lost a lot of momentum to our comeback. Was very good off the bench in the third test. The 16 jersey is pretty solidly his for now.
Taniela Tupou - had a poor series overall. He did a few good things in the second test but also made a bunch of errors. His scrummaging was not close to being dominant. He has all the talent but isn't putting it together consistently at this point.
Allan Ala'alatoa - solid series.
Scott Sio - was playing well until he got injured. Definitely our 5th prop right now.
Matt Philip - was really good in the third test and generally had a solid series. It's getting harder for him to keep his spot when Arnold is available but he's pushing hard to keep it.
Darcy Swain - terrible brain explosion in the first test and he's damaged his chances of remaining a first choice lock. Could find himself lower down the queue after a great introduction by Frost.
Nick Frost - excellent in the third test. He's going to make it hard to leave him out of our best 23 even when Arnold joins.
Cadeyrn Neville - very good in the first test and a shame he got injured in the second. Expect him back in the 23 when he is healthy based on a strong start.
Rob Leota - was alright but nothing more than that. Definitely a question over who our 6 is going forward.
Harry Wilson - didn't have a good game in the third test in his only opportunity. Might have to wait for his next shot.
Michael Hooper - was probably only solid in the first two tests by his standards but had some excellent moments in the first test in key defensive plays. Was very good in the third particularly in the first half winning several turnovers (albeit not through pilfers). Thought his leadership through the series was good.
Rob Valetini - was good through the series. Pretty bolted on selection at number 8.
Pete Samu - had a really good series. He's a lock for the 20 jersey now.

I'll come back later and do the backs.

Pretty much agree there. Things to add:
I rate Bell highly after this series.
Slipper, what a servant, as you say, guaranteed in the 23.
Porecki, solid, but got caught in the scrum for a section of game three. Needs to be looked at. Still the starting hooker as we go forward and thank god we finally have a hooker who can throw.
Tupou may have been poor, but he still ranks as our no1, #3. Unfortunately if he has much more like this series then things can change.
I'm keen to see Swain given another chance, but squeezing in will be interesting. I could not rate Frost higher after game 3.
I think we overdo the criticism of Wilson, but did not perform as strongly as Leota, who as you say, was only alright.
Hooper a little quiet in the first time forever?!? So what, tell someone who gives a @#$! Still our stand out at 7. McReight not showing enough at all in A.

Surprisingly with these two assessments, there is a real need for the pack to muscle up with more mongrel more consistently as we go forward. It is a pretty decent base line all the same.

 

[RugbyReg]

Tupou made great metres on Saturday night in the heart of the defense. It was brilliant. I also thought he defended ok making some key tackles His big issue was his handling and not just doing the basics (passing). He was up against a great scrummager and held is own, despite that start in the 2nd test. The big Saffa Scrum coach should be all over him about his technique because you can see when he's going to get himself in trouble. It's his feet placement.

 

[Rugby Head]

Tupou may have been poor, but he still ranks as our no1, #1. Much more like this series however and things can change.

To be fair, he was coming off a calf injury and hadn't played rugby for over a month so was probably half cooked. I see him stamping his foot down against the Argies.

 

[RugbyReg]

Some combined stats from the series. Do they tell us everything we need to know? Not really. Most obvious takeouts for mine are:

1) ill-discipline - too many penalties and in key areas which allowed Farrell to punish us (despite his poor kicking %age).
3) Lack of clinical finish. As we saw Saturday night. We seemed to create plenty of opportunities if you look at defenders beaten (though not pure clean defenders) but we couldn't finish the deed. That's a big key at this level - taking those rare chances.

 

[Dctarget]

Our discipline was fine on the weekend, 10 penalties v 11.

forward pack is missing pilferers. Our 2, 6 & 8 aren’t particularly strong across the ball, compared to other internationals we’re seriously losing out there.

 

[Derpus]

Some combined stats from the series. Do they tell us everything we need to know? Not really. Most obvious takeouts for mine are:

1) ill-discipline - too many penalties and in key areas which allowed Farrell to punish us (despite his poor kicking %age).
3) Lack of clinical finish. As we saw Saturday night. We seemed to create plenty of opportunities if you look at defenders beaten (though not pure clean defenders) but we couldn't finish the deed. That's a big key at this level - taking those rare chances.
View attachment 14131

Interesting that they made 3 more clean breaks than us.

Man - there's nothing in those stats to suggest we should be losing these games. Just pisses me off more.

Also interesting they kicked more than double the number of penalties we did but conceded only a handful less than us.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Our discipline was fine on the weekend, 10 penalties v 11.

forward pack is missing pilferers. Our 2, 6 & 8 aren’t particularly strong across the ball, compared to other internationals we’re seriously losing out there.

You're right. A secondary guy is a must. That's why the Pooper combination has a good level of effectiveness for a period of time. Tahs this year looked great with Hooper and Gamble. Mahe Vailanu also got on the ball quite a bit. Harry Wilson might be the guy. Hasn't had much time to show it yet this year in Tests.

We won't see McReight & Hooper on the field at the same time.

Rae Rae

 

[Braveheart81]

Our discipline was fine on the weekend, 10 penalties v 11.

In my view it's the type of penalties we gave away.

Hooper gave away a dumb one where he took out the halfback.
White was involved in two. Firstly a terrible attempt at a kick over the top that was charged down then Paisami picked up while off his feet then trying to carry it out of our 22 and trying to get up for a second run rather than rolling and releasing.
Wilson cleaning out beyond the ball halting an attack.

There's still too many that are avoidable and have a high cost that weren't going to give us any advantage.

When we're defending and give away a penalty advantage I also think we're not good enough at killing the play afterwards.

 

[Wilson]

Our discipline was fine on the weekend, 10 penalties v 11.

forward pack is missing pilferers. Our 2, 6 & 8 aren’t particularly strong across the ball, compared to other internationals we’re seriously losing out there.

I think I'd like to see Samu come into the starting back row alongside Hooper and Valetini at this stage. He's been in career best form over the series and will add a bit more threat over the ball. Not certain he can do it as a starter, but there's only one way to find out.

 

[Tomikin]

So where did we get to after this series? A look at some/most of our players and how they performed across the three games:

Angus Bell - was excellent, particularly in the second test. Shame he got injured in the third test but he is clearly a long term Wallabies star.
James Slipper - had a really strong series playing on both sides of the scrum. He's clearly in our best 23 and while I generally expect Angus Bell to start going forward we don't lose much with Slipper starting.
Dave Porecki - great debut in the first test and performed well all series. His set piece is really reliable and he's good around the park. He's the clear first choice hooker going forward until someone changes that narrative.
Folau Fainga'a - was poor in the second test and blew a key lineout that lost a lot of momentum to our comeback. Was very good off the bench in the third test. The 16 jersey is pretty solidly his for now.
Taniela Tupou - had a poor series overall. He did a few good things in the second test but also made a bunch of errors. His scrummaging was not close to being dominant. He has all the talent but isn't putting it together consistently at this point.
Allan Ala'alatoa - solid series.
Scott Sio - was playing well until he got injured. Definitely our 5th prop right now.
Matt Philip - was really good in the third test and generally had a solid series. It's getting harder for him to keep his spot when Arnold is available but he's pushing hard to keep it.
Darcy Swain - terrible brain explosion in the first test and he's damaged his chances of remaining a first choice lock. Could find himself lower down the queue after a great introduction by Frost.
Nick Frost - excellent in the third test. He's going to make it hard to leave him out of our best 23 even when Arnold joins.
Cadeyrn Neville - very good in the first test and a shame he got injured in the second. Expect him back in the 23 when he is healthy based on a strong start.
Rob Leota - was alright but nothing more than that. Definitely a question over who our 6 is going forward.
Harry Wilson - didn't have a good game in the third test in his only opportunity. Might have to wait for his next shot.
Michael Hooper - was probably only solid in the first two tests by his standards but had some excellent moments in the first test in key defensive plays. Was very good in the third particularly in the first half winning several turnovers (albeit not through pilfers). Thought his leadership through the series was good.
Rob Valetini - was good through the series. Pretty bolted on selection at number 8.
Pete Samu - had a really good series. He's a lock for the 20 jersey now.

I'll come back later and do the backs.

AB/JS - Agree both number 1 or bench
DP - I don't think his scrum work is as good as the others, and around the park his not quite as Dynamic, but his really really reliable, in a position we have struggled in. Worth continuing with but by no means locked in.
FF (Folau Fainga'a) - My bolter for the 16 Jersey is Alex Mafi, if he hadn't been injured
TT - Poor series I'd start him off the bench coming into Argies tour, just more impact
AA - We missed him with the K.O. I think he could have made a real difference through the full series
SS - Agree
MP (Moana Pasifika) - Logger Jam here, but I like the stability of picking him every game soild
DS - Errgh
NF - Agreed - Probably was cooked by the end of the 3rd test 80 minutes for locks ain't good
CN - Frost but older, I like him as a vet who is a hard man
RL - Agree
HW - Didn't have a great game, some coach killers in there, but think his a talent and is the backup 8 ATM
MH - I dont think he was up to his usual standard, I felt he also got monstered a little more then normal.. still captian still 7 easily
RV - Agreed, although I was expecting them to use him more
PS - Absolutely Brilliant series, his bench impact is outstanding

 

[PhilClinton]

Our attack is pathetic, we're doing the same dumb shit under Cheika (look at our run metres compared to England). We're not tactically better, we don't know how to play proper pressure Test rugby and can't break down defences after sustained pressure. Rennie won't be sacked before the RWC but I don't think he's the saviour by any means. A false dawn.

Are we suffering from the same issues that the Kerevi-era-Reds had?

Kerevi was clearly the best attacking weapon in Super Rugby before he left for Japan, yes his skillset was quite limited compared to now, but he was getting the Reds over the gain line with every carry. But the Reds still sucked.

With Kerevi in the side at 12, especially with a young flyhalf, he becomes the attacking identity of a team. Maybe we need to change that and move him to 13, get another play maker in the backline to help give the ball some legs.

 

[Joe Blow]

Pretty much agree there. Things to add:
I rate Bell highly after this series.
Slipper, what a servant, as you say, guaranteed in the 23.
Porecki, solid, but got caught in the scrum for a section of game three. Needs to be looked at. Still the starting hooker as we go forward and thank god we finally have a hooker who can throw.
Tupou may have been poor, but he still ranks as our no1, #1. Much more like this series however and things can change.
I'm keen to see Swain given another chance, but squeezing in will be interesting. I could not rate Frost higher after game 3.
I think we overdo the criticism of Wilson, but did not perform as strongly as Leota, who as you say, was only alright.
Hooper a little quiet in the first time forever?!? So what, tell someone who gives a @#$! Still our stand out at 7. McReight not showing enough at all in A.

Surprisingly with these two assessments, there is a real need for the pack to muscle up with more mongrel more consistently as we go forward. It is a pretty decent base line all the same.

Pretty well on the money but I can only guess that you didn’t watch much of the As games? McReight was everywhere and was a step above everyone else on the paddock in both games. He was bullying rather than being bullied. He’s getting stronger and carry’s the ball often and well.
Hooper is Hooper and he has earned a little breathing space if he has an off game or two, which is very rare for him. He will need to bounce back in the RC. Looked a bit tired or distracted? I’m sure he will show his true worth in the next game.
It is going to be almost impossible to leave McReight out of the RWC squad.

 

[Joe Blow]

Gleeson might be worth a look at for 6. He is very busy. Not sure about his set piece work but he looks a future star