Waldrom selected in English RWC training squad

[Gnostic]

Very interesting that the largest Union in the world (in registered player numbers) now has 15% of its players in the RWC training squad born overseas and in most cases those players are only in Blimey for Rugby.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/13830977.stm

 

[Groucho]

It is Blighty, as in pestilence.

 

[tigerland12]

I find it hard to believe someone would want to play for a country other than their original. I'm sure Waldrom grew up worshipping the All Blacks and aspired to playing for them.

I know, personally, I wouldn't want to play for another country except Australia

 

[cyclopath]

I find it hard to believe someone would want to play for a country other than their original. I'm sure Waldrom grew up worshipping the All Blacks and aspired to playing for them.

I know, personally, I wouldn't want to play for another country except Australia

And yet there is a long list of players for many countries who started life elsewhere. Not least of all for Australia. There would be all sorts of motivations - proud to play for their adopted country, the chance to play International Rugby that may not have existed at home (especially for NZ-origin players).
But I agree with the last part - I couldn't imagine wanting to play for another country.

 

[ChargerWA]

Hello Pot, are you there? It's the kettle.

But I do agree, Imagine running out for the Poms against Australia, in Australia. That's the prospect facing Waldrom if he gets up. You would feel like a dirty dirty man.

 

[Gagger]

This is your job. It's what you do for a living and most probably your life will be defined by it.

There are a few firms where all the top talent works and their earning potential is about 3-5 times what everyone else gets.
On top of that you'll never know really how good you are unless you work on this circuit.

You've been told (and it's pretty obvious) that you'll never make the top firm in your country.

Do you just say "too bad" and settle, or do you look at another firm where you can secure a future for you and your family?

I admit it's not a slam dunk either way, but I can definitely understand decisions like Waldrom's.

 

[antipodean]

Depends. Some of them are born in a country but raised in another. Hape may as well be English, he moved there to play league and then switched to rugby. Others such as Riki Flutey would never have played Test rugby for their home nation.

 

[Doc]

Obviously the ABs would be Waldroms first choice, but the reality is if you aren't going to get picked and are eligible elsewhere why not. There would be dozens of current test players in the top 20 nations playing for others than their birth right. In fact you'd be hard up finding a test team that doesn't contain at least one player not born elsewhere.

All this talk of "I wouldn't play for anyone but Australia" is irrelevant for guys like us, it's not a choice likely to be faced with. Personally, I'm 'eligible' for about 3-4 other nations and if they came knocking I wouldn't think twice (I'd also have to find a magic genie first). I'm pretty sure almost any rugby players, esp those not good enough would give a nut for a test cap, even if it was a tier 3 side.

 

[MajorlyRagerly]

I think this situation is a real Matt Burke quote - unless you've had the opportunity yourself, you dont really understand.

I find it unfathomable that good NZ rugby players could want to beat the AB's & it pisses me off no end the thought that Flutey, Waldrom, Hape, Hartley are prepared to do that.

But then again, I work in HK, likely moving to blightly once done my stint here & thus it's unlikely I'll contribute to NZ in a professional way again in my career. I guess, in some ways, it's kind of the same. It just happens to be that these guys jobs co-incides with my passion. Hence, I am forced to agree with Gagger! (feel sick).

Antipodean - Can't agree with you re Flutey. He's come on leaps and bounds since leaving NZ. I think he would be in the mix.

 

[antipodean]

Antipodean - Can't agree with you re Flutey. He's come on leaps and bounds since leaving NZ. I think he would be in the mix.

I think the move has been good for him personally and professionally - he was never going to get the game time at the Hurricanes. But unless he was a first choice first five-eighth in a Super franchise, he'd not be in the running; there's better second five-eighths in the country. Or certainly the selectors know who they want.

 

[Dumbledore]

Antipodean - Can't agree with you re Flutey. He's come on leaps and bounds since leaving NZ. I think he would be in the mix.

Absolutely no chance, he's been in disgraceful form the last couple of years.

As for Fatty Waldrom, can't really blame him to be honest - while loyalty/nationalism/blah blah/whatever does come into it, test rugby is still the absolute pinnacle of the sport. If you're offered a shot to play at the highest level, you take it. I think this reflects more poorly on the England set-up than it does Waldrom.

 

[daz]

It is a good discussion point though. I recall the absolute shock and revulsion I felt when Rod Marsh went over to help the Poms beat us, after a lifetime of being the greatest Pom basher in cricketing history. I'm sorry to say that even though I basically understood the reasons why, nevertheless Rod's stock dropped a few notches with me. It was only years later when I grew a mature brain that I moved on...

Sport, like all aspects of life, is a contrary mistress. You miss out on the Wobs, so what do you do? Sulk? Give up? No, you go ply your trade elsewhere.

Be good to get a list together of Oz sportsmen who couldn't crack it at national level who went on to national duties with another country....

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

I don't think I could ever play test footy against Australia, were I ever good enough to even contemplate it. When you grow up playing the game dreaming that you'll wear your countries jersey, it's a little odd to turn around and do the opposite.

However.......plying ones trade overseas in the name of developing your career and providing for yourself and your family is 100% understandable. I did it and I'm sure many others here did too. If you can't get a gig playing at the top level in your home country, I can understand wanting to do it elsewhere as a way of advancing yourself. It would also help if you somehow felt some animosity towards your home country sporting hierarchy too -- it provides additional motivation. Look at Kevin Pietersen.

 

[Blue]

This is your job. It's what you do for a living and most probably your life will be defined by it.

There are a few firms where all the top talent works and their earning potential is about 3-5 times what everyone else gets.
On top of that you'll never know really how good you are unless you work on this circuit.

You've been told (and it's pretty obvious) that you'll never make the top firm in your country.

Do you just say "too bad" and settle, or do you look at another firm where you can secure a future for you and your family?

I admit it's not a slam dunk either way, but I can definitely understand decisions like Waldrom's.

Another case in point. Schalk Brits. Told in no uncertain terms by White he is too small, and then by PdV that he is about the seventh best hooker in SA. So what must he do? Be happy to play out his career at the WP and Stormers, or go overseas and at least make a good living and secure his future? Loyalty schmoyalty.

The same people who called him lightweight and critisized his play in SA now call him a turncoat and defector and can't enjoy the fact that he is a Saffer export who has done us proud by being rated by English players as the best on the park (yes you Paarl).

Most people who whinge about this sort of thing are just plain small minded and jealous.

Let's be serious, there are preciously few players who have left their home country in the lurch here and "defected to the enemy."

Gives me the shits this.

 

[tigerland12]

There is a differance between leaving and playing overseas and actually playing for your new country.
Understandable if the player has been living there for a long time, but Waldrom has only been there for a season?

England rugby side becoming the new English cricket side....find the pommy.

 

[Geeves]

Good on them for making the national side.

I wrote this ages ago but it deals with the media and other here gushing over Mike Harris finding out he had an Aussie grandmother. Damn but I would hate to think the number of past and current Wallaby players that have dual citizenship.

Why do some people react as if its "one of ours" goes over there gets into their national side they are scum. But if a player comes here and "represents us" its alright.

Damn but hell there are a number of countries that have pillaged the Pacific Islands for players and if they serve the required time and then they make the international side. All I can say is well done anyone who makes an international side and enjoy the World Cup.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Well said Blue, Geeves and Gags.

 

[Blue]

There is a differance between leaving and playing overseas and actually playing for your new country.
Understandable if the player has been living there for a long time, but Waldrom has only been there for a season?

England rugby side becoming the new English cricket side....find the pommy.

Had the likes of Brits not been capped for SA he would be starting for England.

Don't see why it makes a difference how along Waldrom has been there. He is eligible. The English selectors can't start playing gatekeeper. The rules are clear.

England has long been a destination for people all over the world who have some sort of family ties. That's why the place is littered with us Saffas, Aussies and Kiwis who choose to live and work there. The sports teams are simply a reflection of the greater society.

 

[antipodean]

It's categorically not England's fault these players make themselves available for selection. If they're good enough, why wouldn't you put them in your squad?

 

[tigerland12]

England must be short on number 8's if they need Waldrom in the squad, he was never international level