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Under-20 Competitions including Oceania & World U20s

FNC Rugby

Allen Oxlade (6)
So Boston dropped or injured? Sid Harvey keeps his spot even with his in ability to defend? Harvey trying to tackle a 6 ft 6 Saffa around the shoulders was crazy with only one outcome.
it doesnt matter as long as you are on the pathway your actual performance on the field is irrelevant
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
There lies the point, the pathways programs are broken if a kid is continued on that pathway just because he was selected on a pathway at 14! Alot changes between 14 & 19 and for kids who mature later how do they get a head if RA continue to pick from there chosen pathway players.....

Except he's very clearly still worthy of selection as evidenced by the fact that there's at least 8 halfbacks playing for their state side and he is in the top 2 of those.

Players aren't just kept in these squads because they were selected once and nothing ever changes.

Some players have moved (particularly at under 19 level) to get more opportunity with another state.
 

FNC Rugby

Allen Oxlade (6)
Except he's very clearly still worthy of selection as evidenced by the fact that there's at least 8 halfbacks playing for their state side and he is in the top 2 of those.

Players aren't just kept in these squads because they were selected once and nothing ever changes.

Some players have moved (particularly at under 19 level) to get more opportunity with another state.
his performances would speak otherwise but because he is a "pathway" player he will continue to get picked and i think that is the point you're missing.
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
his performances would speak otherwise but because he is a "pathway" player he will continue to get picked and i think that is the point you're missing.

Is he worse than all of the following players?

Darcy Standfield, Tama Tunui, Lachy Smith, Callum Reidy, James Martens, Wally Wentzel.

There are plenty of 9s playing at the same of competition around the country. I don't think it was a surprise that Martens and Sharples were picked as the top two.

I'm sorry your son didn't get selected. It's weird to fixate on one player so much though.
 

The Ghost of Raelene

Rod McCall (65)
it doesnt matter as long as you are on the pathway your actual performance on the field is irrelevant
This is a kid that hasn’t been part of the pathways at all and earnt his crack at rep sides from Club performances. He’s a country kid that’s come to Sydney.

Love to see all the supposed guns not being selected.

I have quite a bit of knowledge across the youth systems as wankerish as that sounds and 95/100 the right kids make the squads. Hardest areas are front row to get right as the physical development is huge but a lot of the others are pushed by jaded family and parochial supporters.
 
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Backintheolddays

Johnnie Wallace (23)
Times have changed, generally for the better but are always subject to improvement. I had the pleasure of being in elite athlete identification over 30 years ago across many sports with the AIS. Nepotism and family/ regional influence were rife.
The focus was on the specific age group however with only a very limited view to the future.
The current approach does factor much more heavily the future element but still suffers from the human condition of bias, whether unconscious or otherwise. If you choose a kid as a 14yo and he keeps on turning up it is very unlikely your objectivity will be such that if through the years no one is markedly better you will just stick with the incumbent.
Australia is well behind the States and Europe is objective athlete assessment and is still led by “the gut” across most sports. Rugby Union is well off the pace for a science based approach.
 

Italophile

Watty Friend (18)
Ireland were so poor v Italy last night though that's not to sell Italy short. They were up for it in terrible hot, humid conditions. Some promising young talent on display.
 

BackRower

Frank Row (1)
Prass. Didn’t get picked. He has a big boot but not much else.

Prass. Didn’t get picked. He has a big boot but not much else.
We must be looking at two different players then but everyone has their own opinions and bias. Having worked with a lot of ball players 9s, 10s, 12s and 15s over the years. I was impressed with what I saw of that big guy Prass in the u20s lead up games, with his organisation, a great catch / pass and he is a solid presence on the field for a young, developing player. So would suggest a little more than just a boot!. Was chatting with an agent who knows of him and as most of us don’t get our heads out of NSW & NZ, he appears somewhat an unknown, but he was a regional Qld kid, played Qld 16s / 18s then AUS u18s, before playing prem grade for Brothers in hospital cup last year, then heading to train/play with the Force academy in both 10 / 15. He said he went well in the u20s academy games, in connecting the team/backline, making territory for an under gunned academy team, made very few handling mistakes and was 100% of the tee for all those games he played/kicked. So yes Prass fits a different mold, to the small ball running 10s AUS pushes. The boot for a ball player is just a tool to manage field position in defence, getting the team out of trouble and to gain territory with precision in attack, especially against bigger, mobile teams. In retrospect, with the underwhelming start to the AUS u20s WC campaign and the lack of precision in managing field position and poor distance / accuracy shown with the boot from both the AUS 10s (who play a similar style of 10) & 15 at this WC… it may have been a handy point of difference for the team to have a Prass type player on the field when going up against those bigger, mobile teams but that’s just opinion and we all know what opinions are like….
 

BackRower

Frank Row (1)
Iv'e gone down a rabbit hole.

It's astonishing how many have a Test cap although there are a lot that will sit with 1-5 games and not 20+which is really then an established Test player and not someone given a crack. Edmed, Maddocks, Stewart are not in the same category as Bell, McReight, Valetini etc.

It is then very noticeable the amount of guys that never had a pro career along side so many guys who got Test caps.

Few guys are double counted if they made the squad in different years as well as people like Tuipolotu, Lomax who have played for other nations.

Internationals by year:
2015: 7 out of 28 - 5th
2016: 8 out of 28 - 6th
2017: 10 out of 29 - 6th
2018: 8 out of 28 - 5th
2019: 10 out of 26 - 2nd (unbelievable amount of talent in this side)Bell, McReight, Loloseio, Donaldson, Wilson, Nawaqanitawse, Frost, Tuipolotu) Genuine Test players. Then L Lonergan, Nasser, Van Nek, Tizzano in this squad as well. Will Harris, Will Harrison, Reilly are mugs in this lot but stand outs in other years.
2020: 9 out of 35 - NC Spicy cough

Comps after this from 2023 feel unfair to count as the players are still in the development years.

Not going to compare to other countries as it serves no purpose with different playing environments but when we average about 8 getting at least one Test cap it's fairly safe to assume that only 2-4 of them will have a long Test career. If Aus can do that routinely you have 7-8 years of developing 3 stars each year that's a Wallaby match day squad. Then add the bolters like Jorgo, war horses like Slipper and the form/testing picks like Nasser, Lancaster and you have the Wallabies. I don't really see a time where we have 50+ legitimate guns in country unless RL was made illegal. Maybe the third tier comp will help but I think it will have more capacity to strengthen the depth within our Super Rugby sides and over a long period of time through competition for spots develop more Wallabies.
That's interesting, thanks for sharing
 
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