Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Its the form of players not teams - but even based on teams the Gordon boys have more reason than anyone to complain
U/15 SJRU, NSW, Schools
- Thread starter Wood Rat
- Start date
- Status
Its the form of players not teams - but even based on teams the Gordon boys have more reason than anyone to complain
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
Oh this is going to be fun.
State Champs is a NSW JRU activity. Everything in the programme should be viewed in the context of it being NSW JRU Policy. When they refer to higher rep teams they mean NSW State Team not the Sydney JRU or NSW Country JRU teams.
The "regional" tournament is a joint SJRU/NSW JRU tournament which is primarily used by Sydney JRU to finalise their teams for the SJRU vs Country games.
Literature from NSW JRU will point to the Sydney vs Country game being the main factor determining the selection into the State team. This is contrary to what they publish in their JSC material. To further confuse things, NSW JRU will always make exceptions, and the country folk will often cite that there is a quota in place for Sydney JRU in the State team when they win, and vice versa from the Sydney folk if the SJRU team wins.
The truth is somewhere in the middle.
Parachuting under age boys into higher age groups like Tyrone.
I see nothing particularly sinister with this, provided they turn up to State champs in one or other age division. Many of these boys actually play their regular club games at an age level up. Some drop back to their proper age division for reps, some don't. This is not without ample precedent both in the Schools RU world or the Juniors.
There will typically be some U15 boys at U16 Schools trials at Knox. Sometimes these boys make the U16 Schools, or Juniors team. Similarly there are boys from the U16's that play for GPS III or ISA II or the like at the OPens (under 18 schools games) midweek, and then drop back to U16 for the Sat Sun U16 games at Knox. Sometimes they don't play U16 SChool trials at Knox, but get selected from their performance at the Schools Under 18's. Parachuted in yes probably, but at least these kids participated in a trial before the selectors.
I have difficulties with players who are uninjured who do not attend JSC who somehow find themselves nominated in the Zone teams for regionals or later trials. These boys are the famous Hugh Jarse Paratroopers.
So performance at the Zone games at Regional tournament gets you selected into a Sydney JRU higher representational team.
The Country folk select their Country rep team before the JSC, so the teams at JSC representing their Zones are playing purely for their Zone/region, not for a position in a higher representative team.
It is all absolute gobbledogook and nonsense. There are far too many parties interested in their own importance, and the importance of their own organisation fighting over the same pool of boys.
Join George Smith's revolution and help restructure junior rugby and realign and repave the pathway. Contribute to the debate on the National Tournaments thread.
The Sermon on the Under 16's can wait, but feel free to browse through last years thread. Very little has changed apart from the names of the rugby players and their parents.
State Champs is a NSW JRU activity. Everything in the programme should be viewed in the context of it being NSW JRU Policy. When they refer to higher rep teams they mean NSW State Team not the Sydney JRU or NSW Country JRU teams.
The "regional" tournament is a joint SJRU/NSW JRU tournament which is primarily used by Sydney JRU to finalise their teams for the SJRU vs Country games.
Literature from NSW JRU will point to the Sydney vs Country game being the main factor determining the selection into the State team. This is contrary to what they publish in their JSC material. To further confuse things, NSW JRU will always make exceptions, and the country folk will often cite that there is a quota in place for Sydney JRU in the State team when they win, and vice versa from the Sydney folk if the SJRU team wins.
The truth is somewhere in the middle.
Parachuting under age boys into higher age groups like Tyrone.
I see nothing particularly sinister with this, provided they turn up to State champs in one or other age division. Many of these boys actually play their regular club games at an age level up. Some drop back to their proper age division for reps, some don't. This is not without ample precedent both in the Schools RU world or the Juniors.
There will typically be some U15 boys at U16 Schools trials at Knox. Sometimes these boys make the U16 Schools, or Juniors team. Similarly there are boys from the U16's that play for GPS III or ISA II or the like at the OPens (under 18 schools games) midweek, and then drop back to U16 for the Sat Sun U16 games at Knox. Sometimes they don't play U16 SChool trials at Knox, but get selected from their performance at the Schools Under 18's. Parachuted in yes probably, but at least these kids participated in a trial before the selectors.
I have difficulties with players who are uninjured who do not attend JSC who somehow find themselves nominated in the Zone teams for regionals or later trials. These boys are the famous Hugh Jarse Paratroopers.
So performance at the Zone games at Regional tournament gets you selected into a Sydney JRU higher representational team.
The Country folk select their Country rep team before the JSC, so the teams at JSC representing their Zones are playing purely for their Zone/region, not for a position in a higher representative team.
It is all absolute gobbledogook and nonsense. There are far too many parties interested in their own importance, and the importance of their own organisation fighting over the same pool of boys.
Join George Smith's revolution and help restructure junior rugby and realign and repave the pathway. Contribute to the debate on the National Tournaments thread.
The Sermon on the Under 16's can wait, but feel free to browse through last years thread. Very little has changed apart from the names of the rugby players and their parents.
I tend to agree and having watched Norths and barbars closely through the reps the form of the team and individuals just wasn't there to justify their 9 selections.
Particularly in the backs where 5 were selected.
Brainstrust
Watty Friend (18)
If this years manly 15's resemble last years team that may explain it. 2012 manly 15's were beaten 103? Nil by Gordon and rightfully deserved 0 to go through. I don't believe Manly had a team in the 16's this year.
Manly need to invest a lot of effort into their junior rep program, otherwise those types of outcomes will continue, outside of the odd age group that is gifted.
Freddo Frog
Ward Prentice (10)
There were a few boys based around the Manly area who played for Gordon reps this year. I have no issue with boys playing out of their area but it almost always happens when there's no viable local alternative. Probably says a bit about what they think of Manly as an option.
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
State Champs at U15 are still 15 minutes each way or is it 20 minutes?
Not much time to really impress as a team with resilience. Zero or hero at State champs results can rest on a missed conversion, a broken tackle, a kick not going into touch. Some mobs get lucky at tournament time.
Zone Tournament: an artificial selection of kids thrown together with one or two training sessions if they are lucky. For some given the recent weather probably zero effective training sessions. Selectors try out kids in interesting positions sometimes. Kids out to impress selectors play selfish games rather than in the best interests of the team.
Really hard to do "proper" analysis on form of teams and translate that to selection of individuals.
The Selectors are generally looking for all rounder kids who can play in several positions (to cover injuries) who can play the type of game that they intend to play in a one off game against the Country boys in a full game of 30? minute halves.
About 1/2 these kids will make the Sydney 16's, and in 2 more years time you will be surprised who is in the U18 Schoolboy teams compared to who were the absolute top dogs in the U15's. Selection in U15 Juniors team actually counts for very little in the grand scheme of things.
If your kid made it, give him a hug and say well done you are proud of him. Then tell him that he needs to train really hard because there are 100 kids who didn't make it this year and they will be training really hard to get his position.
If your kid didn't made it, give him a hug and say well done you are proud of him for giving it a good go.
Then tell him that he needs to train really hard because if he doesn't,there is no way he will get selected next year because at least 50 of the other 100 kids who didn't make it this year will be training hard to have another go at being selected next year.
Not much time to really impress as a team with resilience. Zero or hero at State champs results can rest on a missed conversion, a broken tackle, a kick not going into touch. Some mobs get lucky at tournament time.
Zone Tournament: an artificial selection of kids thrown together with one or two training sessions if they are lucky. For some given the recent weather probably zero effective training sessions. Selectors try out kids in interesting positions sometimes. Kids out to impress selectors play selfish games rather than in the best interests of the team.
Really hard to do "proper" analysis on form of teams and translate that to selection of individuals.
The Selectors are generally looking for all rounder kids who can play in several positions (to cover injuries) who can play the type of game that they intend to play in a one off game against the Country boys in a full game of 30? minute halves.
About 1/2 these kids will make the Sydney 16's, and in 2 more years time you will be surprised who is in the U18 Schoolboy teams compared to who were the absolute top dogs in the U15's. Selection in U15 Juniors team actually counts for very little in the grand scheme of things.
If your kid made it, give him a hug and say well done you are proud of him. Then tell him that he needs to train really hard because there are 100 kids who didn't make it this year and they will be training really hard to get his position.
If your kid didn't made it, give him a hug and say well done you are proud of him for giving it a good go.
Then tell him that he needs to train really hard because if he doesn't,there is no way he will get selected next year because at least 50 of the other 100 kids who didn't make it this year will be training hard to have another go at being selected next year.
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
There's another half in there, who can play anywhere.
Fullback and 12 and 13
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Thanks, that would make at least 4 centres and a couple of fb's but no wingers from my understanding.
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
The other half Rixon played there in state champs, Zubak could play there of the norths boys.
Gordon had any number who could play there and were not picked.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
OK, didn't see anything special on the wings or FB from Norths, IMO MNZ wing and MWZ wing and FB were best performers in those possies.
lineoutjumper
Stan Wickham (3)
done a bit of digging on there norths backs
rixon- halfback but plays fullback for SHORE 15As
wennerbom- halfback/fly-half
smith- inside centre (most likely at centre pairing with lough for sydney)
zubak- centre/wing
gregory- fullback
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Wennerbom has a beautiful pass both ways and Is a natural left foot kick.
Smith is a backrower who is in the early stages of a conversion: he plays inside as does lough. He's never played outside.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Smith is a backrower who is in the early stages of a conversion: he plays inside as does lough. He's never played outside.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Thanks,
Wennerbom from Joey's.
With the MWZ IC that's three IC's selected which is a little unusual, but then I think the selections in general are unusual.
Shane Smeltz
Fred Wood (13)
So, theoretically, if I had a 13 year old boy who plays for a Manly Village club and has dreams of getting into a SJRU team in the next few years, should I be moving him on from Manly?
Manly did well at the State Champs in 11s & 12s but after that age group, not so good. Very not so good.
Maybe my boy doesn't have what it takes to get into SJRU, but he is only 13 so who knows in the future.
Any advice, anyone? Much appreciated, thanks.
I like to watch
David Codey (61)
Theoretically, it's a sport,played for fun.
It is surprising how many stars at 12 fall by the wayside as the kids mature physically.
If you are thinking of moving a 13yo from his mates to improve his chances of a rep jumper 2 or 3 years down the track,you have lost the plot.
In any event, in the late teens, the only rep jumpers with cred are Schools jumpers.
It is surprising how many stars at 12 fall by the wayside as the kids mature physically.
If you are thinking of moving a 13yo from his mates to improve his chances of a rep jumper 2 or 3 years down the track,you have lost the plot.
In any event, in the late teens, the only rep jumpers with cred are Schools jumpers.
U
Unders Line
Guest
Theoretically, you should stop being a pushy parent. Moving 13/14 children between rep sides to put him on the winning team is ridiculous.
I agree with your comments. However, players as young as 12 do make the switch. Two of Southern Districts 12's switched to Lindfield to enable them to play for Gordon. I am not sure if this was due to aspirational parents or poaching. It somehow satisfying to see them lose in the State Champs. I think Manly ended up winning it.
To answer the gentlemens question fully one would have to acknowledge that statistically your chances of getting picked in a SJRU representative sides increase if you were to undertake that strategy. However, it seems illogical and absurd to do so just for this reason.
- Status