The Wallabies Thread

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Agree. But I think it's easier to get someone fit than it is to make them a hard bastard.

I really don't get the Hooper love. Taking a look at the ruck analysis ForceFan had on the home page just before the RWC Final, what exactly does Hooper bring to the table that is so irreplaceable or unique?

Certainly and I look at what Cheika was able to do with Skelton to see that the potential is there.

I can understand the Hooper love. He's certainly not your classical 7, well not in the mould that Michael Jones created in his pomp and guys like Pocock and McCaw continued. He's not an out and out fetcher, more like the ball running and tackling monster like the guy in my avatar. He and Pocock complement each other well and almost all of our best footy this year has been with them both on the paddock at the same time. With that said, if we were to revert to Pocock, Fardy and a big blockbusting eight (like we had when Kef was at his peak) I'd be just as happy. I just don't think we've had a guy who does that more recently. Pocock to me is out and out our best fetcher, but the skills that Hooper brought to the game, as well as his amazing fitness and work rate made it hard to leave him out. With more time to develop his team I'll be interested to see what TGC does in the medium to long term. The good thing is that we have a truckload of great young back rowers in Australia at the moment.

 

[Spruce Moose]

I hope Chubby has a slightly more imaginative approach. We are now at the start of the four year cycle, we need to look for, and test, some new blood.



By the way, the name you are looking for is Folau.

Yep apologies for the miss-spelling, Monday mornings are prime time for a little bit of dyslexia.

Not sure I like this 4 year cycle thing, think we should aim for selecting the best 15 blokes we have at that moment and not select guys we want to come good in four years. I believe this is what England have tried with good intentions (will be interesting what their review comes up with), but can lead to having a little egg on your face with no trophies in four years and being unlucky at RWC. I think Bledisloe 2016/17 should be our focus then in '18 we can start thinking about Japan 19.

 

[Viking]

Agree. But I think it's easier to get someone fit than it is to make them a hard bastard.

I really don't get the Hooper love. Taking a look at the ruck analysis ForceFan had on the home page just before the RWC Final, what exactly does Hooper bring to the table that is so irreplaceable or unique?

Low hard driving tackles that break momentum and he does them on players like Burger and Kaino so it's quite a powerful skill to have in the team. Combine this with his ball-running and work-rate, ability to fetch occasionally makes him a pretty good option. He wasn't nominated for player of the year for nothing.

I'd imagine since Poey is in the team he shifted his priority slightly away from the rucks. His ruck stats were always one of top in the wallabies team when poey wasn't there... obviously not in Poey's league but still where you'd imagine they'd be for a 7.

 

[Braveheart81]

Players like Vaea and Lopeti Timani will need to increase their skillsets and fitness if they want to get a crack at test level.

Currently neither are a lineout option and Vaea in particular isn't fit enough.

England is probably the only top 10 side that regularly plays a one dimensional number 8 in Vunipola and often that's just for a stint off the bench.

I think there's a pretty strong chance we'll continue to see Pocock and Hooper together when healthy and McCalman's form has been strong. It's going to be hard for new players to break into that group when they're healthy and available.

 

[USARugger]

Yep apologies for the miss-spelling, Monday mornings are prime time for a little bit of dyslexia.

Not sure I like this 4 year cycle thing, think we should aim for selecting the best 15 blokes we have at that moment and not select guys we want to come good in four years. I believe this is what England have tried with good intentions (will be interesting what their review comes up with), but can lead to having a little egg on your face with no trophies in four years and being unlucky at RWC. I think Bledisloe 2016/17 should be our focus then in '18 we can start thinking about Japan 19.

England's problem was reverting on their 4-year game plan at the beginning of the RWC.

 

[Viking]

Players like Vaea and Lopeti Timani will need to increase their skillsets and fitness if they want to get a crack at test level.

Currently neither are a lineout option and Vaea in particular isn't fit enough.

England is probably the only top 10 side that regularly plays a one dimensional number 8 in Vunipola and often that's just for a stint off the bench.

I think there's a pretty strong chance we'll continue to see Pocock and Hooper together when healthy and McCalman's form has been strong. It's going to be hard for new players to break into that group when they're healthy and available.

One of those guys off the bench is a nice prospect. Timani has the frame to be a decent jumper and last year Vaea was getting fitter with every game. A strong pre-season will do him well. I'm excited by those two.

 

[fatprop]

Players like Vaea and Lopeti Timani will need to increase their skillsets and fitness if they want to get a crack at test level.

Currently neither are a lineout option and Vaea in particular isn't fit enough.

England is probably the only top 10 side that regularly plays a one dimensional number 8 in Vunipola and often that's just for a stint off the bench.

I think there's a pretty strong chance we'll continue to see Pocock and Hooper together when healthy and McCalman's form has been strong. It's going to be hard for new players to break into that group when they're healthy and available.

The positive thing about this side is that most will be around for a while, assuming form is constant, it will take some massive efforts to dislodge most of the current team.

In the end it is a couple of wingers, a 12 and THP up for grabs for next season, and that assumes Gits, Mitchell, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) and Kepu don't put their hands up

 

[Braveheart81]

The positive thing about this side is that most will be around for a while, assuming form is constant, it will take some massive efforts to dislodge most of the current team.

In the end it is a couple of wingers, a 12 and THP up for grabs for next season, and that assumes Gits, Mitchell, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) and Kepu don't put their hands up

Agreed.

The bulk of this team will still be in the right age range in 2019 so there's little reason to expect wholesale changes building for 2019 (which I don't think would happen anyway).

I'm sure we'll see a bunch of new faces in Wallaby squads from next season but unless there are injuries I think they'll mostly be on the periphery.

You'd imagine the June test window will be a time when Cheika is less likely to use foreign based players so we might see more new faces then.

 

[Pfitzy]

Agree. But I think it's easier to get someone fit than it is to make them a hard bastard.

I really don't get the Hooper love. Taking a look at the ruck analysis ForceFan had on the home page just before the RWC Final, what exactly does Hooper bring to the table that is so irreplaceable or unique?

Nonstop energy and top notch defence.

Thing you need to remember about the final is we lost Douglas - our enforcer - early in the match. Had he stayed there, the physicality in contact would have been at a higher level, and the AB ball carrying and defense would have been less effective.

Bigger loss than Giteau IMHO.

 

[Viking]

Nonstop energy and top notch defence.

Thing you need to remember about the final is we lost Douglas - our enforcer - early in the match. Had he stayed there, the physicality in contact would have been at a higher level, and the AB ball carrying and defense would have been less effective.

Bigger loss than Giteau IMHO.

I agree. Douglas was the biggest revelation for me this tourney even more so then Gits. He offers something no other lock in Aus does. I can see some great battles with Douglas against the likes of Etzebeth, Rettalick in the future and I'm quietly confident Douglas will be able to hold his own against them.

 

[fatprop]

I agree. Douglas was the biggest revelation for me this tourney even more so then Gits. He offers something no other lock in Aus does. I can see some great battles with Douglas against the likes of Etzebeth, Rettalick in the future and I'm quietly confident Douglas will be able to hold his own against them.

i wouldn't say that yet, but there is hope

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Yep apologies for the miss-spelling, Monday mornings are prime time for a little bit of dyslexia.

Not sure I like this 4 year cycle thing, think we should aim for selecting the best 15 blokes we have at that moment and not select guys we want to come good in four years. I believe this is what England have tried with good intentions (will be interesting what their review comes up with), but can lead to having a little egg on your face with no trophies in four years and being unlucky at RWC. I think Bledisloe 2016/17 should be our focus then in '18 we can start thinking about Japan 19.

Totally agree. You can set yourself up for an awful lot of disappointment by basing everything on winning the RWC. I say we just focus on each year winning as many tests as we can and see what happens in 2019. A lot can change in four years, or even one year as we just saw.

 

[Braveheart81]

Trying to base your selections around who you think might be the best players in four years time is fraught with danger.

Some players will improve more than others and some you thought were going to be superstars will plateau.

If you're going to be good enough in four years time you're going to be good enough to be selected at various points along the way.

 

[Viking]

i wouldn't say that yet, but there is hope

Yes that's what I meant. He ain't there yet but there certainly is hope!

 

[Caputo]

I would rest the Japanese based flexible contracts next year and give them some rest early in the cycle.
Beale at Full Back for Folau
Christian Lealifano for Foley but thinking about Jack D
Ita Vaea for McCalman

For the European based would only pick on NH tours
Kervei for Giteau but start Toomoua
Toomane for AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
Horne for Mitchell
Smith for Kepu

It would be interesting to see if he wants revolution or just shaping.

Will he need to tap the two Benny's on the shoulder and send the off shore for the next two Props to break through.

 

[BDA]

hmm I don't know if I'd be intentionally resting next year. 2016 and 2017 are probably the best chances to win back the Bledisloe. I think our 2016 team could be basically our world cup side with a few more kinks ironed out. New Zealand lose McCaw, Carter, Nonu. Hard to see them reaching the same highests as their 2015 team, at least not immediately. Let's strike while the irons hot.

With that said, some of the players you named as possible replacements are worth a run. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) and Mitchell are no longer necessary. We have three excellent wingers who were a part of the world cup squad that can take things from here. Likewise I'd like to see To'omua transition to starting 12, although it couldn't hurt to have Giteau come down for TRC, even if just for his influence on the squad.

No way I'd rest Foley or Folau. madness

 

[Spruce Moose]

Agree, the situation with the Euro based players will be interesting. The England Tour and RC are when they are in the off-season/pre-season so they would be lacking match fitness but perhaps Cheika has a plan to deal with that. Perhaps offering them the chance to prove their fitness at training camp if they were keen to give up their holidays for the Wallabies. The one I'm saddest to see go is Kepu as felt he is one of the best Props in the world (IMO) at the moment and is improving. As he has 63 caps now hoping he comes down for the RC next year.

 

[Tomikin]

Out:

Moore

Moore signed for 2 years with the Brumbies, so don't think he be gone straight away.

 

[BDA]

We haven't seen the last of Kepu in a Wallabies jersey. I'd bet my house on it.

 

[Gnostic]

hmm I don't know if I'd be intentionally resting next year. 2016 and 2017 are probably the best chances to win back the Bledisloe. I think our 2016 team could be basically our world cup side with a few more kinks ironed out. New Zealand lose McCaw, Carter, Nonu. Hard to see them reaching the same highests as their 2015 team, at least not immediately. Let's strike while the irons hot.

With that said, some of the players you named as possible replacements are worth a run. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) and Mitchell are no longer necessary. We have three excellent wingers who were a part of the world cup squad that can take things from here. Likewise I'd like to see To'omua transition to starting 12, although it couldn't hurt to have Giteau come down for TRC, even if just for his influence on the squad.

No way I'd rest Foley or Folau. madness

Who are these excellent wingers that can kick effectively and provide the exit strategies required? Please don't say Speight, Horne and Tomane. They have a lot of work to do in this aspect to "excellent" wing options.