The Wallabies Thread

[TOCC]

Stiles is a good line-out coach, Reds had one of the better line outs between 2014-2016 when he was forwards coach.

Ledesma wasn’t the forwards coach, he was set piece coach with the focus on scrums. Cheika does a lot of the forward stuff apparently.

Im not advocating Stiles for the job, but I don’t agree with this knee-jerk reaction that he shouldn’t be considered.



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[Rugbynutter39]

Disappointing considering how many of the guys in the video above speak about how hard Timani goes at training


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Yes I think many of us had expectations Timani would have gone better in Wallaby colours than has to date...sadly appears to be fading out as other options step forward.

 

[Braveheart81]

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sp...s/news-story/b6d78fe043dcaf38e4a46205ca554f42

Panda suggesting Laurie Fisher could be the leading candidate to replace Ledesma.

 

[Tomikin]

Stiles is a good line-out coach, Reds had one of the better line outs between 2014-2016 when he was forwards coach.

Ledesma wasn’t the forwards coach, he was set piece coach with the focus on scrums. Cheika does a lot of the forward stuff apparently.

Im not advocating Stiles for the job, but I don’t agree with this knee-jerk reaction that he shouldn’t be considered.



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It's not knee jerk reaction.. He can be considered I'm sure his a good coach.. I, just don't rate his win, loss record, thought it was shit at the Force, was shit at the Reds and, is still shit...as an assistant and as head coach.. Let him go overseas coach over there then come back better.

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[upthereds#!]

Ledesma wasn't hired on his win/loss record as a coach, he was hired for his ability to add value to the scrum and to the value of Aus u20 and Super Rugby scrums as required. On that, Stiles would be a positive candidate.

 

[TOCC]

It's not knee jerk reaction.. He can be considered I'm sure his a good coach.. I, just don't rate his win, loss record, thought it was shit at the Force, was shit at the Reds and, is still shit.as an assistant and as head coach.. Let him go overseas coach over there then come back better.

Sure his win/loss ratio teams he coached at were crap, but the set piece of those teams was first rate. And Ledesma was the set piece coach...

 

[Braveheart81]

We need a temporary forwards coach to be appointed within a month for the EOYT. Stiles could work well with that time frame and give himself a good opportunity to show his wares first hand as they look for a permanent option.

In my initial post about this I was suggesting that the ARU shouldn't rush to hire Stiles because he is available and it would be good for him as he's just lost his job. He is certainly worth considering as a candidate in a proper recruitment process.

 

[dru]

We need a temporary forwards coach to be appointed within a month for the EOYT. Stiles could work well with that time frame and give himself a good opportunity to show his wares first hand as they look for a permanent option.

In my initial post about this I was suggesting that the ARU shouldn't rush to hire Stiles because he is available and it would be good for him as he's just lost his job. He is certainly worth considering as a candidate in a proper recruitment process.

Agree with everything said here. No need to throw the baby out with the bath water, no need to gift a temp role (let alone a permanent role) - but Stiles may well suit for a temp role and following reasonable review may well suit the WBs longer term. Just make sure Fisher has a shot at it too.

 

[TOCC]

Depends what they're after, if they want set piece coach then Stiles as set piece coach is first rate, if they're after an overall forwards then Fisher would be my choice. But my understanding Cheika is the forwards coach and Ledesma only focussed on the set piece, additionally earlier this year they said they're aren't going to employ part-time wallaby coaches anymore so Fisher would have to exit his Brumbies contract for 2018.

 

[Lindommer]

Hiring Stiles as AC in charge of set pieces for the Wallabies could be a very good move. This'd be a step in his rehabilitation to the senior Oz coaching ranks; we're desperately short of talented coaches in this land, and Stiles proved at Brisbane City he CAN coach. Getting caught up in the clusterfuck which is the QRU at the time wasn't a good career move.

 

[Derpus]

Harsh to judge stiles on the poisoned chalice that is the QRU head coach role.

 

[Braveheart81]

Are forwards and set piece coaches at the professional level pretty much the same thing now?

Without having much first hand knowledge of watching training, I would have thought that set piece practice is the time when the forwards and backs separate and a lot of the rest of the time the team is together.

With the pod system pretty much all teams use and spacing the forwards across the field in attack, the concept of breakdowns, cleanouts and realignment is far more of a whole team issue.

Compared to previous eras where the forwards played as a group far more and focus on the breakdown was far more forward-centric, it would seem to me that now, the forwards coach is really just focusing on set piece and then having input towards the whole team in general play.

My guess of how training as a full side works is as follows:

Cheika - running the overall show. Attitude, support, breakdown etc.
Larkham - shape of the backs and how they realign between phases, positioning and interaction with forwards as link players
Grey - running the defence of the team not in possession and dealing with turnover realignment.
Ledesma - breakdown technique for all players.

I think whoever is hired to replace Ledesma has the primary role of set piece but isn't limited in their involvement to that.

 

[upthereds#!]

Ledesma is the scrum coach. That's literally his job. Wallabies Scrum Coach, not wallabies forwards coach - doesnt do cleanout technique etc. If he is, then clearly he isnt good at it coz we suck at it. Contact and breakdowns is often a forwards coach role, though there are set piece specialists, just like there are skills coaching and kicking specialists

 

[Braveheart81]

I'm not at all convinced his involvement is only limited to scrummaging sessions.

 

[RoffsChoice]

Grey showed his ability with the Waratahs in 2013 and 2014, and it seems that he's taken criticisms onboard and improved over the Rugby Championship this year. He's not back to his peak, but he's on his way. Larkham was the same with backs at the Brumbies from 2012 to 2015, but started to fall off in 2016 and was pretty hopeless this year. But, like Grey, he's clearly taken some criticisms, made some changes, and performing well again.

Stiles was a fantastic forwards coach from 2014 to 2016, but lost his way this year. Give him room to take some of those criticisms on board and I expect he'll be back to those earlier standards before too long. Sign him to the Wobs post Bledisloe 3, give him the end of year tour, and see if there's something in it.

 

[Jets]

I'm not at all convinced his involvement is only limited to scrummaging sessions.

Why do you think this? Any reason for these thoughts?


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[Braveheart81]

Why do you think this? Any reason for these thoughts?


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He has been a full time Wallabies coach. I just don't think he would not be involved for the majority of every training session. I think his role (and the role of his replacement) is more substantial than just running the scrum sessions.

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[jimmydubs]

He has been a full time Wallabies coach. I just don't think he would not be involved for the majority of every training session. I think his role (and the role of his replacement) is more substantial than just running the scrum sessions.

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If he is only doing scrums as a full-time coach they missed a trick. Could've been involved in breakdown or other work. If nothing then they shouldve had him preparing a whole cow asado at each session.

 

[Slim 293]

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sp...s/news-story/b6d78fe043dcaf38e4a46205ca554f42

Panda suggesting Laurie Fisher could be the leading candidate to replace Ledesma.

Dan McKellar says it's not happening.........

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/rug...fisher-joining-wallabies-20171008-gywtzw.html

"It's not happening. I'm sitting next to the bloke as we speak. It's rumour and it's incorrect," McKellar said.

"There's been no discussion in and around it. Laurie is committed to the Brumbies and the Brumbies only, and that's how it will be."

 

[Jets]

He has been a full time Wallabies coach. I just don't think he would not be involved for the majority of every training session. I think his role (and the role of his replacement) is more substantial than just running the scrum sessions.

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He spent time with the Super teams working on their scrums too. If they were smart he'd help out with the 20's players before they leave for the JRWC, but I'm not sure about that. From the sessions I've watched he's only done scrum work but again this is only a small sample size. Chekia seems to do the breakdown work.


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