The Israel Folau saga

[Braveheart81]

This bloke pointed that out a year ago

"In my opinion, Rugby Australia would have been better to play a straight bat by saying Folau is entitled to express his opinion and let him be judged accordingly. End of story."

I think this is a bit simplified. I don't think Rugby Australia could ever cleanly separate themselves from Folau while he remains a very visible part of rugby in Australia and expect that any blowback is only going to be felt by Folau.

 

[Ignoto]

"In my opinion, Rugby Australia would have been better to play a straight bat by saying Folau is entitled to express his opinion and let him be judged accordingly. End of story."

I think this is a bit simplified. I don't think Rugby Australia could ever cleanly separate themselves from Folau while he remains a very visible part of rugby in Australia and expect that any blowback is only going to be felt by Folau.

Peter FitzSimons through twitter has given a different take on the post by Israel;

From the moment he put that post up, his career in Australian rugby was over. And wouldn’t your career be over, too, if you tried the same thing? As someone else noted on Twitter, how many people across Australia, if they turned up for work at 9am on Monday with a T-shirt saying ALL GAYS ARE GOING TO HELL would get through to 9.05 am and still be in a job?

​

My office doesn't have a dress code persay, but I can't imagine I'd be allowed back to work if I rocked up wearing a similar shirt.

 

[barbarian]

It is possible to express your religion or political views in a way that doesn't vilify others. That is the basic substance of RA's policy, and the law more broadly.

If Israel came out and advocated for superannuation reform, nobody would really care. If he called for an end to Muslim immigration then we'd have problems, as he'd have likely breached the inclusion policy.

Likewise when he just posts about God's love or the glory of Jesus or whatever, it's all good. He can post bible verses for days. But once he starts doing anything that can be perceived to be vilifying minority groups he is in trouble.

I'd suspect we'd have the same issue if he started quoting bible verses on women being subservient to men.

So really this isn't about banning all religious speech, or all political speech. It's just a small subsection of both which involve the vilification of minority groups.
.

 

[liquor box]

https://www.news.com.au/sport/rugby...l/news-story/718463003293b7df792183bac4bc7db1

Rugby Australia bungled its contract negotiations with Israel Folau by failing to insert social media restraints, according to a report.
The Daily Telegraph says Folau, who inked a $4 million four-year deal last year, refused to have the additional clauses retrospectively inserted into the contract.

The story continues and talks about RA's position and why they think they would win.



Would anyone be surprised if RA stuffed up?

 

[D-Box]

Here is a nice take on the Freedom of Speech vs Freedom of Speech without consequences from The West Australian https://thewest.com.au/opinion/gemm...ow-our-freedom-comes-at-a-cost-ng-b881170846z

 

[fairplay]

Nope, and I am starting to think there might be a possibility Izzy will get his $4million and quite a bit more. His legal team has to be foaming at the mouth with excitement at this point.

https://www.news.com.au/sport/rugby/report-social-media-blunder-in-folaus-4m-deal/news-story/718463003293b7df792183bac4bc7db1





The story continues and talks about RA's position and why they think they would win.







Would anyone be surprised if RA stuffed up?

 

[KOB1987]

Game on.

 

[The Honey Badger]

Well I am rooting for Izzy.

If that means I burn in hell. So be it.

 

[Slim 293]

His contract would still stipulate that he had to abide by RA’s guidelines, and that is what he is in breach of, again.

 

[Slim 293]

So, code of conduct hearing next week...........

His position has become untenable in Australian rugby, so regardless of which way the panel rules he’ll be gone, the difference being whether or not he receives a large payout.

 

[Derpus]

Any remaining respect i had for Israel has evaporated. Wants to be the virtuous zealot proselytizing his religion but without accepting any of the consequences of his decision. How noble.

 

[Ignoto]

https://www.news.com.au/sport/rugby...l/news-story/718463003293b7df792183bac4bc7db1

The story continues and talks about RA's position and why they think they would win.

Would anyone be surprised if RA stuffed up?

Turinui confirmed on the latest rugby ruckus that the Collective Bargaining Agreement that all Australian Rugby Players are on the same contract which cannot be altered. Therefore no such clause could be inserted into Folau's latest contract.

Interesting that it appears the only news agencies running this social media clause comes from News Corp....

 

[Lorenzo]

The standard contract inevitably has clauses around social media etc. Any confusion around amendments to folau's deal probably reflect verbal or other non-contractual assurances that were offered (which may or may not be binding).

 

[Juan Cote]

Folau's own words

"I told Raelene if she felt the situation had become untenable – that I was hurting Rugby Australia, its sponsors and the Australian rugby community to such a degree that things couldn’t be worked through – I would walk away from my contract, immediately."
Read more at https://www.playersvoice.com.au/israel-folau-im-a-sinner-too/#1swussZBsUwFFBFp.99

I guess the Lord works in mysterious ways.

 

[fatprop]

Any remaining respect i had for Israel has evaporated. Wants to be the virtuous zealot proselytizing his religion but without accepting any of the consequences of his decision. How noble.

He has the same rights you do to be treated fairly under the law and to defend those rights by going to court and testing whether RA are acting lawfully in terminating his contract

 

[Derpus]

He has the same rights you do to be treated fairly under the law and to defend those rights by going to court and testing whether RA are acting lawfully in terminating his contract

So?

See his own comments above. I don't assert he is acting unlawfully or in some other inequitable way. I'm just saying that the only respect i had left for him was based on his willingness to accept the consequences of his actions (i.e. being fired) if RA thought that was the appropriate punishment.

He hasn't done that, therefore, i don't respect him.

 

[The Honey Badger]

His position has become untenable in Australian rugby, so regardless of which way the panel rules he’ll be gone, the difference being whether or not he receives a large payout.

Why so?

Why can't he face a suspension from AU rugby.

Say 6 or 12 months. If he stops the social media crap he may be eligible in the future (I am thinking more under Giteau rule)

Leave the door open.

 

[KOB1987]

OK so I'm going back to the sidelines and watch it play out till the next stage. This thread will just continue on with the same people airing their same point of view, none of which will affect what actually happens. People who think it will end with Folau just losing his job are naive.

Later.

 

[fatprop]

So?

See his own comments above. I don't assert he is acting unlawfully or in some other inequitable way. I'm just saying that the only respect i had left for him was based on his willingness to accept the consequences of his actions (i.e. being fired) if RA thought that was the appropriate punishment.

He hasn't done that, therefore, i don't respect him.

and if the current consequences of his actions are unlawful?

 

[Derpus]

and if the current consequences of his actions are unlawful?

Again, i was making an assessment of his character not legal position (public character - i obviously don't know the bloke).

If his sacking was unlawful then RA crafted a shite contract.

Edit: please delete this if it's against the rules.