Take Captaincy off Elsom: Tim Horan (Foxsports article)

[TOCC]

Currently sitting on top of the Australian table...

It reeks of provincial bias... it's just like when Bob Dwyer suggested in 2006 that the entire Australian forward pack should be Waratahs...

Cant really blame him can you?
The Brumbies have performed poorly for 2 seasons now(real madrid??), NSW have questionable leadership in the absence of Phil Waugh, the only other real option would be Nathan Sharpe and David Pocock from the Force.

 

[vidiot]

Sharpe is a good captain and a good forward leader though I wonder if the force is struggling to turn competitiveness into points because of discipline, game and ref management.

Hard to pick the pick the captain from the others - waratahs, brumbies or rebels - if their captains are dubious picks for the run-on wallabies. And nice to pick someone who has played as captain at a high level.

 

[El Gamba]

Well if you look at every team to ever win a RWC they have come into the tournament after a long period of stability and continuity. No team has ever won the RWC with a captain appointed that year.



Possibly. But it is too late to change now IMO. It would affect the balance and team dynamic hugely, and after a succesful spring tour it seems to be working OK. I don't want to tamper with the dressing room dynamic in a World Cup year.

The only reason to tamper would be if improvement is possible. I'd argue that the spring tour wasn't that successful, a thrashing of French team that didn't turn up made it look a lot better than it actually was. I'd argue that improvement is possible.

 

[Slim 293]

Cant really blame him can you?
The Brumbies have performed poorly for 2 seasons now(real madrid??), NSW have questionable leadership in the absence of Phil Waugh, the only other real option would be Nathan Sharpe and David Pocock from the Force.

I think the problem is that he conveniently left out names from the other franchises...

I don't see Horwill as a Wallaby captain to be honest...

He's only captained the Reds a handful of times due to his inability to stay on the field and in my opinion they've done better under the leadership of Genia...

 

[Aussie D]

When did Francois Pienaar take over the 'boks prior to WC1995? I distinctly remember Tiaan Strauss captained them when they were here in 1993 but not sure when the changeover actually took place.

Not sure about changing the captain now but I would like to see co-captains appointed next in the form of Stephen Moore and TPN whichever of the two is on the field is captain.

 

[vidiot]

Better add Fainga'a S.:fishing

History may reflect our inability to get our best hookers on to the park for extended periods.

 

[fatprop]

If Elsom can return and find the form he finished the November tour, he deserves to captain the side.

It comes down to his form when he starts playing, till then Sharpe is the best captain in the side.

 

[barbarian]

The only reason to tamper would be if improvement is possible. I'd argue that the spring tour wasn't that successful, a thrashing of French team that didn't turn up made it look a lot better than it actually was. I'd argue that improvement is possible.

But in my opinion the benefits are not incredibly obvious, and thus it is a risk not worth taking. Improvement MAY be possible by changing the captain, but the amount of improvement would not be that much compared with the potential damage to dressing room dynamics and team ethos if the new captain is not weel liked or respected.

The poll indicates that there is no obvious successor to Rocky, and because of this I don't want to be fucking around with different captains in a world cup year.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Elsom for me. If we were going to fiddle with the side and especially the captaincy, last year was the time to do it. We've got a short test season before the RWC and I don't think now is the time for tinkering. This is all contingent on Rocky being fit of course. I'm starting to worry a bit about that.

 

[El Gamba]

But in my opinion the benefits are not incredibly obvious, and thus it is a risk not worth taking. Improvement MAY be possible by changing the captain, but the amount of improvement would not be that much compared with the potential damage to dressing room dynamics and team ethos if the new captain is not weel liked or respected.

The poll indicates that there is no obvious successor to Rocky, and because of this I don't want to be fucking around with different captains in a world cup year.

I suppose it is all a moot point until Rocky gets back on the park and we can see how he goes and how he affects the Brumbies woeful teamsmanship.

 

[Joe Mac]

Sharpie should be our captain

 

[Scotty]

If Elsom ends up sitting out most of the Super 15 season, would you then think about changing back?

Lets face it, Pocock is a guaranteed starter for the wallabies, Elsom is almost, but not quite.

The Wallabies could do worse than having Sharpe as captain as well.

 

[Scotty]

But in my opinion the benefits are not incredibly obvious, and thus it is a risk not worth taking. Improvement MAY be possible by changing the captain, but the amount of improvement would not be that much compared with the potential damage to dressing room dynamics and team ethos if the new captain is not weel liked or respected.

The poll indicates that there is no obvious successor to Rocky, and because of this I don't want to be fucking around with different captains in a world cup year.

Maybe the poll is indicating there are several other options outside of Elsom?

 

[Ruggo]

If selected on the merits of form he should be captain but in no way do I want the captaincy to be a free ticket for a player not up to standard.

All the names mentioned are capable of being a good Wallaby captain.

 

[Godfrey]

I love all this "no team in history has done X to win a world cup" when there have only been 6 World Cups. That's too small a sample and, let's not forget, correlation does not equal causation.

 

[waratahjesus]

And my belief is that Pocock would be a better captain in the the RWC than Elsom. He appears to handle referees much better than Elsom and also give more of the one field talks. I also suspect that the players would react better to him.

sorry scotty, besides your first line there, how do you know he talks more and on what basis do players care more about him than elsom?

Richie Mccaw hasnt played yet and are the all blacks even questioning it.
Elsom is the best six in the country and if he is even near form at the end of super rugby there isnt a decision to be made.

 

[barbarian]

I love all this "no team in history has done X to win a world cup" when there have only been 6 World Cups. That's too small a sample and, let's not forget, correlation does not equal causation.

But in this case it is logical that teams that have won the World Cup have not chopped and changed in the World Cup year.

I can't see how so many of you advocate elevating Pocock in a World Cup year when he has never captained at Super level. There is just too much risk in this move- how will Sharpe react? How will JOC (James O'Connor) react? Cohesion and stability are kings in RWC years, and changing ou captain to Pocock throws a vicious, rabid cat amongst the pigeons.

As I said if Elsom cannot hold his place in the side then there obviously needs to be another Captain. But if he is good enough for the XV he should be captain.

And yes I am aware Elsom had no S14 captaincy experience before his appointment, but it was not a RWC year. We ahve had years to experiment with leadership and playing combinations, now we have a settled side which needs to be kept.

 

[Jnor]

I cant vote in this poll until Sharpe is up as an option. as much as I want to see Pocock as captain eventually, and I'm sure it will happen at some point; right now, we have Elsom and if he's out of form or still injured or whatever I think the only sensible option is Sharpe.

Haven't we seen enough of the consequences of throwing players in the deep end before they're ready in Australian rugby?

 

[Godfrey]

But in this case it is logical that teams that have won the World Cup have not chopped and changed in the World Cup year.

I can't see how so many of you advocate elevating Pocock in a World Cup year when he has never captained at Super level. There is just too much risk in this move- how will Sharpe react? How will JOC (James O'Connor) react? Cohesion and stability are kings in RWC years, and changing ou captain to Pocock throws a vicious, rabid cat amongst the pigeons.

As I said if Elsom cannot hold his place in the side then there obviously needs to be another Captain. But if he is good enough for the XV he should be captain.

And yes I am aware Elsom had no S14 captaincy experience before his appointment, but it was not a RWC year. We ahve had years to experiment with leadership and playing combinations, now we have a settled side which needs to be kept.

Agree in this case it's logical, but there aren't really any "definites" I suppose.

Anyway, my position on this is that it's silly to change, but for the right reasons whereas everyone else who thinks that thinks it for the wrong reasons.

 

[Ged]

If Elsom can return and find the form he finished the November tour, he deserves to captain the side.

It comes down to his form when he starts playing, till then Sharpe is the best captain in the side.

This ^
If he can't find fitness or form, I'd vote for Sharpie, or Pocock. No way on God's earth it will be Sharpie though, if the ARU don't even see fit to offer him a top up. He's a bloody good captain, and to my eye, he did most of the gee-up talks last year, not Pocock (whose leadership abilities I also have an enormous admiration for)