Subbies 2023!

[Prodigy]

Here's an idea. I think it might work. Each division is 10 clubs divided into two pools. Pools decided by standing on Cowboy Cup ladder
DIVISION 1 (4 grades & Colts)
POOL A: Lindfield, Drummoyne, Blue Mountains, Mosman, Forest
POOL B: Colleagues, Hunters Hill, Waverley, St Pats, Petersham/UNSW
DIVISION 2 (3 grades & colts)
POOL A: UNSW, Hills, Knox, Barker, Briars
POOL B: Beecroft, Newport, Harlequins, Epping, Hawkesbury Valley
DIVISION 3 (2/3 grades)
POOL A: Merrylands, Redfield, Sydney Harbour, Northern Saints, Old Ignatians
POOL B: Sydney Irish, Rockdale, Wakehurst/Brothers, Renegades, Manly Savers?

Home & Away series within your pool for Rounds 1-8
Play everyone in the opposite pool Round 13.
Club Championship is awarded for all thirteen rounds.

Top 6 teams in each grade into the finals.
Week 1
QF1: 2nd Pool A vs 3rd Pool B
QF2: 2nd Pool B vs 3rd Pool A
Week 2
SF1: 1st Pool A vs Winner QF2
SF2: 1st Pool B vs Winner QF1
Week 3
GF: Winner SF1 vs Winner SF2

Division 4 would then be a 13/14 club competition, where you play everyone once and then the same finals series applies.

 

[TheBigArvo]

Here's an idea. I think it might work. Each division is 10 clubs divided into two pools. Pools decided by standing on Cowboy Cup ladder
DIVISION 1 (4 grades & Colts)
POOL A: Lindfield, Drummoyne, Blue Mountains, Mosman, Forest
POOL B: Colleagues, Hunters Hill, Waverley, St Pats, Petersham/UNSW
DIVISION 2 (3 grades & colts)
POOL A: UNSW, Hills, Knox, Barker, Briars
POOL B: Beecroft, Newport, Harlequins, Epping, Hawkesbury Valley
DIVISION 3 (2/3 grades)
POOL A: Merrylands, Redfield, Sydney Harbour, Northern Saints, Old Ignatians
POOL B: Sydney Irish, Rockdale, Wakehurst/Brothers, Renegades, Manly Savers?

Home & Away series within your pool for Rounds 1-8
Play everyone in the opposite pool Round 13.
Club Championship is awarded for all thirteen rounds.

Top 6 teams in each grade into the finals.
Week 1
QF1: 2nd Pool A vs 3rd Pool B
QF2: 2nd Pool B vs 3rd Pool A
Week 2
SF1: 1st Pool A vs Winner QF2
SF2: 1st Pool B vs Winner QF1
Week 3
GF: Winner SF1 vs Winner SF2

Division 4 would then be a 13/14 club competition, where you play everyone once and then the same finals series applies.

That’s some progressive thinking that doesn’t belong in Subbies!

 

[Prodigy]

That’s some progressive thinking that doesn’t belong in Subbies!

Sorry.

 

[HogansHeros]

Here's an idea. I think it might work. Each division is 10 clubs divided into two pools. Pools decided by standing on Cowboy Cup ladder
DIVISION 1 (4 grades & Colts)
POOL A: Lindfield, Drummoyne, Blue Mountains, Mosman, Forest
POOL B: Colleagues, Hunters Hill, Waverley, St Pats, Petersham/UNSW
DIVISION 2 (3 grades & colts)
POOL A: UNSW, Hills, Knox, Barker, Briars
POOL B: Beecroft, Newport, Harlequins, Epping, Hawkesbury Valley
DIVISION 3 (2/3 grades)
POOL A: Merrylands, Redfield, Sydney Harbour, Northern Saints, Old Ignatians
POOL B: Sydney Irish, Rockdale, Wakehurst/Brothers, Renegades, Manly Savers?

Home & Away series within your pool for Rounds 1-8
Play everyone in the opposite pool Round 13.
Club Championship is awarded for all thirteen rounds.

Top 6 teams in each grade into the finals.
Week 1
QF1: 2nd Pool A vs 3rd Pool B
QF2: 2nd Pool B vs 3rd Pool A
Week 2
SF1: 1st Pool A vs Winner QF2
SF2: 1st Pool B vs Winner QF1
Week 3
GF: Winner SF1 vs Winner SF2

Division 4 would then be a 13/14 club competition, where you play everyone once and then the same finals series applies.

Could you make the pools geographically based as best as possible?

 

[Denistone_Dennis]

Could you make the pools geographically based as best as possible?

More risk one pool being stronger/weaker than the other.

 

[Pfitzy]

More risk one pool being stronger/weaker than the other.

Also you get a situation where guys then aren't accustomed to travel, then won't travel as a result.

It's one reason some clubs can't field 2nd grade

 

[Pfitzy]

Home & Away series within your pool for Rounds 1-8
Play everyone in the opposite pool Round 13.
Club Championship is awarded for all thirteen rounds.

Or could have the crossover games in the middle. Pool games first 4 and last 4

 

[LRUsoldier]

If subbies believe in the pool system, it would be best to put the best 16 clubs into two evenly divided by pools. There would be no complaints if it was done this way.

 

[HogansHeros]

If subbies believe in the pool system, it would be best to put the best 16 clubs into two evenly divided by pools. There would be no complaints if it was done this way.

And you could call them divisions?

 

[Pfitzy]

Profound!

 

[Prodigy]

Could you make the pools geographically based as best as possible?

Geographically, Division 1 split by the harbour
Pool A: Colleagues, Waverley, St Pats, Drummoyne, Petersham
Pool B: Blue Mountains, Lindfield, Hunters Hill, Forest, Mosman

Division 2 much more of a shitfight
Pool A: Hills, Epping, Briars, Harlequins, UNSW
Pool B: Valley, Beecroft, Barker, Knox, Newport

Division 3
Pool A: Renegades, Redfield, Northern Saints, Wakehurst/Brothers, Manly Savers
Pool B: Merrylands, Rockdale, Sydney Harbour, Sydney Irish, Old Iggies
I know which pool I'd prefer to play in here.....

 

[Northies]

Spoke to a mate who's been at Hills last few years (hope he sees the light soon). Announced at their presentation night, head coach and a couple other coaches moving on. A stack of their 3s squad pulling up stumps. Sounds like plans already well in advance for 2024 though.

 

[Prodigy]

Spoke to a mate who's been at Hills last few years (hope he sees the light soon). Announced at their presentation night, head coach and a couple other coaches moving on. A stack of their 3s squad pulling up stumps. Sounds like plans already well in advance for 2024 though.

Andrew Cox, one of their star third grade players, has been announced as the 1st Grade Colts coach at the Two Blues, so it will be interesting to see if he manages to coach and play. My guess is that the 3rd grade premiership might see him hang up the boots or go back to playing 4s at Two Blues.

 

[Prodigy]

Spoke to a mate who's been at Hills last few years (hope he sees the light soon). Announced at their presentation night, head coach and a couple other coaches moving on. A stack of their 3s squad pulling up stumps. Sounds like plans already well in advance for 2024 though.

Shame about their head coach. Great guy, good rugby man. Will be missed.

 

[TheBigArvo]

Enough about divisions and who goes where. I want to move on to another big issue I see with Subbies.
Why have we regressed back to having every meeting and Judiciary hearing at David Phillips and moved away from Online? It was a fantastic step forward during COVID that freed up volunteers times.

When Jack Whighton bit a player (fairly serious incident) he attended the judicary via Zoom link rather than driving up to Sydney to appear in person. Why are we asking our players and time poor volunteers to drive all the way to Daceyville to spend 15 mins on site to plead guilty or hear info that’s been the same for the last 10 years?

I understand the desire to make people accountable and understand the severity of the incident and act as a deterrent but all it does is put more pressure on over worked volunteers to take another night out of there already busy weeks.
Why when so many other businesses and organisations are embracing the online options. Are we going back to the face to face option?

 

[Prodigy]

Enough about divisions and who goes where. I want to move on to another big issue I see with Subbies.
Why have we regressed back to having every meeting and Judiciary hearing at David Phillips and moved away from Online? It was a fantastic step forward during COVID that freed up volunteers times.

When Jack Whighton bit a player (fairly serious incident) he attended the judicary via Zoom link rather than driving up to Sydney to appear in person. Why are we asking our players and time poor volunteers to drive all the way to Daceyville to spend 15 mins on site to plead guilty or hear info that’s been the same for the last 10 years?

I understand the desire to make people accountable and understand the severity of the incident and act as a deterrent but all it does is put more pressure on over worked volunteers to take another night out of there already busy weeks.
Why when so many other businesses and organisations are embracing the online options. Are we going back to the face to face option?

We have asked a number of times for this to be the case, as our players find it so difficult. The fact that we train on Wednesday night and our volunteers/committee all assist with coaching and training make it near impossible.
Unfortunately, I believe that, at times, Subbies has not moved forward and is stuck in the old ways of thinking. I am incredibly appreciative of the work that Tim and Angus put into the competition, however, I feel like it needs to look at new ideas to engage and support clubs.

 

[HogansHeros]

Geographically, Division 1 split by the harbour
Pool A: Colleagues, Waverley, St Pats, Drummoyne, Petersham
Pool B: Blue Mountains, Lindfield, Hunters Hill, Forest, Mosman

Division 2 much more of a shitfight
Pool A: Hills, Epping, Briars, Harlequins, UNSW
Pool B: Valley, Beecroft, Barker, Knox, Newport

Division 3
Pool A: Renegades, Redfield, Northern Saints, Wakehurst/Brothers, Manly Savers
Pool B: Merrylands, Rockdale, Sydney Harbour, Sydney Irish, Old Iggies
I know which pool I'd prefer to play in here.....

A Div 2 Pool of Hills, Epping, Beecroft, Barker and Knox would be alright. Just a mess for the rest.

 

[Pfitzy]

Re: Judiciary - first thing to note is that zoom was introduced during the Covid era as a measure to solve the concerns around spacing etc.

Speaking as a Club Secretary: I agree there are difficulties with getting into Daceyville. Having had to do it a couple of times this year, it can be hard to organise, particularly where players work night shifts. I know we're not the only club in this boat and we've noted our issues with it.

The basic line of thought is that some were not treating the situation with the gravity it deserved in the comfort of an internet forum.

Like keyboard warriors, but they have to show their ID first

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Re: Judiciary - first thing to note is that zoom was introduced during the Covid era as a measure to solve the concerns around spacing etc.

Speaking as a Club Secretary: I agree there are difficulties with getting into Daceyville. Having had to do it a couple of times this year, it can be hard to organise, particularly where players work night shifts. I know we're not the only club in this boat and we've noted our issues with it.

The basic line of thought is that some were not treating the situation with the gravity it deserved in the comfort of an internet forum.

Like keyboard warriors, but they have to show their ID first

Do people really take it any more serious in person? Anyone not taking it seriously online doesn’t give a shit sitting their either.

 

[TheBigArvo]

Re: Judiciary - first thing to note is that zoom was introduced during the Covid era as a measure to solve the concerns around spacing etc.

Speaking as a Club Secretary: I agree there are difficulties with getting into Daceyville. Having had to do it a couple of times this year, it can be hard to organise, particularly where players work night shifts. I know we're not the only club in this boat and we've noted our issues with it.

The basic line of thought is that some were not treating the situation with the gravity it deserved in the comfort of an internet forum.

Like keyboard warriors, but they have to show their ID first

Understand the issue around people not taking it seriously and doing it on there phones whilst at training etc. But as a club in Western Sydney Pfitzy your volunteers are looking at an hour drive each way plus tolls and fuel etc. for a hearing that may take 15 mins on weeknight after working all day and taking other nights out for training etc.

If we want to do it in person maybe we need to look at doing some weeks elsewhere to make it easier for the Western clubs. Maybe Concord, TG or Eric Tweedle? Surely there is a spare room?

For me the question should always be how can we reduce the load on the club volunteers and also the people who volunteer to be in roles like the Judiciary or board members.