SRP (Super Rugby Pacific) Trials: QLD Reds v Western Force, Ballymore, 3/2/24 @ 3:00pm AEST

[Oracle83]

Stewart or Creighton?

Creighton - I highly rate Stewart

 

[PhilClinton]

True - but ii think that is why we have to temper expectations for a first year coaching team. New structures and better execution around breakdown do take some tine to bed down.

This is where Australian coaching has fallen down.

Fair enough new coach, new gameplan, player alignment etc. but it shouldn’t be his job to re-train players how to be effective at a breakdown, a core skill of our game.

This squad has been together as a core group for a long time. I mentioned in the Reds general thread that I feel we are lacking some additional key support in the backs. Kiss should be given some breathing room but a few of these players need to aim up or be moved aside.

 

[dru]

Creighton - I highly rate Stewart

Do you remember just how much time a space was given to Stewart to build in to the 10 role? Creighton was far from sharp and all things being equal will want to make sure the cob webs are properly blasted off in order to have a confident start for the season proper.

I'm not sure that "all things are in fact equal". HMP looked good for a trial, Lynagh is returning from injury, JOC (James O'Connor) would step in, and even Campbell is being discussed more often as a play maker.

I'd give Creighton time, but it is not as if the Reds are short on options at fly half.

 

[TSR]

This is where Australian coaching has fallen down.

Fair enough new coach, new gameplan, player alignment etc. but it shouldn’t be his job to re-train players how to be effective at a breakdown, a core skill of our game.

This squad has been together as a core group for a long time. I mentioned in the Reds general thread that I feel we are lacking some additional key support in the backs. Kiss should be given some breathing room but a few of these players need to aim up or be moved aside.

It shouldn’t be - but I read recently that the 5 Australian teams were all in the bottom 6 for winning their own ruck ball, so it seems like it is.

Whether the players there are good enough to be re-trained or whether they need to be moved on I don’t have a firm view on.

 

[KOB1987]

That has always been the case Wilson, but this year most sides are going in with close to their top side at the start. I would start to feel uneasy if the top side was being beaten even in trials. Not so much a comment on the Reds who only went down by a point, but not a good sign say for the RA Tahs who seem to have had the cleaners put through them by the Rebels.

Never miss an opportunity.

 

[wamberal99]

Never miss an opportunity.

And they wonder why their team is so unpopular.

 

[Merrow]

And they wonder why their team is so unpopular.

What’s the fans got to do with the team? I’m bloody nice

 

[Spamnoodle]

They love mentioning any force player who is from NSW or Qld lol

Aren't they all?

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Just read through the entire thread and I think most saw the game pretty similarly. Watched it last night and for what’s its worth….


Bit of a stinker for the 1st 20mins but it then warmed up and wasn’t a bad game.

Reds
Pros

• Paisami & Flook played well. Paisami looking fit. Stewart found holes around him though in defence.
• Back Row + Uru very effective.
• Werchon looks a prospect. Really nice pass. Better than Kalani IMO.
• Bench players really added punch.

Cons

• Back 3 in the first period very clunky. Is Aubrey up to this level?
• Creighton didn’t do himself any favours in trying to lock down the 10. Bit all over the shop but it is a trial.

Force
Pros

• Clean ball movement to start the game.
• Recruits are going to strengthen this side. Potter ready to go.
• Depth in key positions should place them well as injuries happen.

Cons

• Back Row. A lot of missed tackles all bad arms tackles from Harris and Anstee. Tate was aware of it. Harris still gassing out quickly. Anstee is should be the 6 with Wells or Harris to the bench.
• Standard dropped when bench came on in the 2nd period.

Good to see everyone has been practicing their place kicking

 

[dru]

Just read through the entire thread and I think most saw the game pretty similarly. Watched it last night and for what’s its worth….

Counter thoughts:

Stewart found holes around Paisami? What about Creighton and the loose forwards? Seems odd to single Paisami. Stewart though was very good.

+1 on Werchon.

I think you are being a tad tough on both Anstee and Harris. If I were primarily a Force fan I'd be getting very excited about Anstee in particular.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Probably am being harsh but a few of the misses were bad arms being stuck out. Tiredness, likely the culprit but they were lazy attempts. I like Anstee at 6 personally.

Think the holes Stewart found were more in backline v backline situations. Unlikely the Reds backrow are going to ever be able to cover that situation. Creighton did look a bit lost at sea which is strange as he's played plenty with these guys now.

 

[SouthernX]

Counter thoughts:

Stewart found holes around Paisami? What about Creighton and the loose forwards? Seems odd to single Paisami. Stewart though was very good.

+1 on Werchon.

I think you are being a tad tough on both Anstee and Harris. If I were primarily a Force fan I'd be getting very excited about Anstee in particular.

Paisami has never been known for his defense but he is remembered for his big one on one crunching tackles.

in offense attack I thought Paisami added punch and return to old form

 

[hawko07]

Few more thoughts from the ground yesterday:

- Aside from a good late play Creighton was disappointing. He'll likely get more time next week and hopefully turns it around, but I'd be leaning to Lynagh for his control for round 1.
- Aubrey doesn't really look to have progressed from last year, I know I've said it before but I think he really needs a stint in 7s or failing that a pro(ish) comp at a level between super and club - NPC in the off season or maybe MLR/Japan.
- Along with Tate, Werchon looked very good in his brief stint. Didn't see as much from Kalani but he was great against Saitama last year. Very happy with our options at 9.
- Scrum was an absolute monster, particularly once Hodgman came on, need to see it against more sides to really know, but given it was a problem area for much of last year it's comforting to see that improvement.
- Lineout went well, particularly considering we were running a two hookers on the bench that are no higher than 4th string and likely won't get many minutes there this season. I don't remember the Force getting too much in the way of clean ball from theirs either, but given there were no screens at Ballymore I didn't have the best view of all of them.
- Petaia was a bit rusty but still had plenty to show - that 50/22 was fantastic. That said I still think Campbell was the better option at 15 and having him there as a playmaking option might have helped Creighton find his feet early on. Off the back of this game I'd be looking at a back 3 with Flook and Petaia on the wings and Campbell at fullback. Vunivalu could definitely push his way in given his attributes, but he was way too inaccurate yesterday.
- I thought Paisami was running with aggression, force and fair bit of sting. Defence needs work, but new coaches and new systems will require that and he looks absolutely up for it this year. I'd be leaning towards him at 13 with O'Connor coming in at 12 assuming he's good for game one (and to help out our young 10s). If not it does become a bit of a toss up between Henry at 12 or sliding Pasisami and Flook in one.
- New stand is a winner and the vibes from the crowd were great, even in uncomfortably hot conditions. Can't wait for them to get the eastern stand redone. Most of our group are already talking about getting back in March for the Super W.


Finally, it was fantastic to see Vest take the field again after his injury last year. Love that Kiss gave him the captaincy for the end of the game too.

Agree with all of this. A couple of my observations:
- For the Force I thought Ben Donaldson looked really good (new coach?), Stewart too
- How good were the 2-3 times Paisami ran straight at Anstee and bumped him off
- Hodgman really looks like a good team man, I saw plenty of him getting around the boys pre/during/post game

 

[Wilson]

Agree with all of this. A couple of my observations:
- For the Force I thought Ben Donaldson looked really good (new coach?), Stewart too
- How good were the 2-3 times Paisami ran straight at Anstee and bumped him off
- Hodgman really looks like a good team man, I saw plenty of him getting around the boys pre/during/post game

Donaldson was not bad at all and the change will probably suit him well this year. As much as he had an ordinary season for the tahs last year, part of that was his form dipping at the same time as Gordon's and that connection really falling apart. Getting to reset and having a stronger set of halfbacks feeding him should give him the best opportunity to step up. He's still got to fight to hang onto that starting 10 jersey, but he's looking more confident in himself at the Force.

From all the media I've seen Hodgman (and Toomaga-Allen) look to have bought plenty to the team off the field in addition to what they offer on it. Really good to get that experience coming in in key positions where we were so depleted last year.

 

[Hogan]

Donaldson was not bad at all and the change will probably suit him well this year. As much as he had an ordinary season for the tahs last year, part of that was his form dipping at the same time as Gordon's and that connection really falling apart. Getting to reset and having a stronger set of halfbacks feeding him should give him the best opportunity to step up. He's still got to fight to hang onto that starting 10 jersey, but he's looking more confident in himself at the Force.

From all the media I've seen Hodgman (and Toomaga-Allen) look to have bought plenty to the team off the field in addition to what they offer on it. Really good to get that experience coming in in key positions where we were so depleted last year.

Couldn’t agree more re Donaldson. To be fair, I don’t think the Waratahs very structured game plan and insistence on playing off a dominant 9 (Gordon) to their forwards helped Donaldson or Edmed get early touches and much front foot ball. Probably affected their confidence early on and it carried on throughout the season. Plus chopping and changing from 15 to 10 probably wouldn’t have helped. The Force’s backline combinations during the first 30min stanza looked very cohesive and fluent. Good signs early on. And considering the Reds had the majority of possession, it was a gutsy win.

 

[Cookie Cutter]

Few more thoughts from the ground yesterday:

-
- Lineout went well, particularly considering we were running a two hookers on the bench that are no higher than 4th string and likely won't get many minutes there this season. I don't remember the Force getting too much in the way of clean ball from theirs either, but given there were no screens at Ballymore I didn't have the best view of all of them.

I agree with most of your thoughts but the lineouts close to the tryline were not great - I think 3 of 4 throws went over the back and let the force off the hook. The 4th throw was to 2 in the lineout.
I'm a big fan of Matt Faessler's - his chase to help stop a Force try in the first 1/3rd was fantastic - but the throws to 4 or 6 (or jumps) have to be better.

 

[TSR]

I thought he missed one and the rest were after he’d left the field

 

[Adam84]

He definitely did one bad throw early on, might have been crooked? one cracking throw to the back and a couple of others weren’t overly convincing.

For an attacking platform for the backs to work off, a long throw to the back is the best, I’d like to see him nailing those. Short throws to the front secure the ball but make it hard work for the inside backs.

 

[TSR]

I think some inaccuracy in the lineout at the start of the season is foregivable.

Would be good to have fixed by round 1 though (or even better by this weekend). Reds have no reason not to have a strong lineout as they should always have 4 capable good jumpers on the field.

 

[Derpus]

Score?