Sport (schoolboy) experts help?

[PaarlBok]

Dont know if I have to put this one up at the active rugby thread but I think this one have a special place on the forum. A bit personal if the experts can give AussieD woman advice I sure can ask some expert sportlovers advice.

Myself have three kids, two boys. Myself as a passionate sport lover teach them from baby day all about sport and specially heart in sport. Been blessed with two pretty talented sport boys I have this small one, a 10 year old really talented in hockey. Think I did the best thing for them putting them in a sport mad enviroment school like Paarl Gym. So this kid of mine plays A team for in rugby (physical), cricket (skills) and hockey (more skill then physical). Myself never believe in forcing sport on them and also not a spesific one. My oldest one pick hockey, a sport I never played, and I did the good thing in supporting him all the way, altho he was good in rugby aswell. Well he played provincial hockey and my small one sort of grow up along the hockey field and myself think he was born with a hockey stick in hand.
Knows all the skills as a 10 year old and those of you know your bit about the sport will know a kid that can do a Indian dribble in a mini game as a 10 year old is pretty special. He played his second last game of the year yesterday and playing in a pretty special age group, the lost 1 rugby game and 2 hockey games all season. Well the hockey orginaser (a woman) watched him yesterday and after the game had a talk to him , his coach and us. She want to put him in the schools first team , U13. He'll be a 11 year old on 30 November and is phiscally pretty small. This all lead to my question to you lot.
1. Do I let him play against and with 13 year olds? or
2. Do I keep him in his age group U11?

Myself think there is two things that needs to be adress. His mother (my Mrs) tells me he is way to young emotionally and my oldest son , who coach Paarl Gyms U14 boys hockey say if he is good enough I have to let him play. So its emotional and skills to take into consideration.

Thoughts?

 

[Scarfman]

Ask him, I suppose.

 

[Jury]

Yeah I'd talk to him. I'd talk to his coach(es) etc before making the decision. You could ask the coach for a trial period i.e. let him play in the U13s and if it works out leave him there, but if it doesn't you want the option of putting him back into his own age group. Then I'd let him have a go (if he wants to do it).

 

[Virgil]

Ask him, I suppose.

Genius,ladies and gentleman...our esteemed leader

 

[PaarlBok]

Ask him, I suppose.

Ja have done that but myself think he is a bit young. Times like this you as a parent have to make this desitions on his behalf. Had the same kind of problem with the oldest one. He was picked as a grade 9 (16 year old) to play for Paarl Gyms U18 A group. Myself let him decided and he wanted to play with his mates U16. Think it was the wrong one because it took a years skill development away from his game.

Now he think totally otherwise as a 21 year old and doing the coaching thing. According to him (the oldest one) is that you compare a hockey players to his skills level and not age. He thinks (he took the younger one with him when he coach the U14s) is that the small one rounded many of the 14 year olds and should play with the U13s. Paarl Gym will have a astro turf next year and he thinks it will give the small one much more oppertunities to play on it to develop his talent.

Listen to the Mrs (Ok they are always biased with getting hurt) she is sort of scare he is way to young emosionally. Think hockey have a lot of sledgeing like cricket.

 

[PaarlBok]

Yeah I'd talk to him. I'd talk to his coach(es) etc before making the decision. You could ask the coach for a trial period i.e. let him play in the U13s and if it works out leave him there, but if it doesn't you want the option of putting him back into his own age group. Then I'd let him have a go (if he wants to do it).

His current coach immediate reaction was that the origaser is mad and only want to poach her best player. That dont work in my books. We had the same thing with his cricket. They picked him to bat at 3 in his first U11 game as a U10. The opposition could get him out and he batted for 25 overs for his 30 odd runs. Pretty special if you take into account that it was his first 11 men full field cricket match. The next game they put the kid in nr10 on the batting list. When I ask WTF? they told me the 11 year old kids parents moan and groan their bloeitjies havent got a change to bat ecause of his batting. Anyone that know a bit about cricket should know thats crap.

 

[PaarlBok]

Picture of the kid in hockey action at our interschools

 

[PaarlBok]

and in the rugby

 

[PaarlBok]

Ja and our kids do scrum from U10s

 

[the gambler]

Yeah I'd talk to him. I'd talk to his coach(es) etc before making the decision. You could ask the coach for a trial period i.e. let him play in the U13s and if it works out leave him there, but if it doesn't you want the option of putting him back into his own age group. Then I'd let him have a go (if he wants to do it).

His current coach immediate reaction was that the origaser is mad and only want to poach her best player. That dont work in my books. We had the same thing with his cricket. They picked him to bat at 3 in his first U11 game as a U10. The opposition could get him out and he batted for 25 overs for his 30 odd runs. Pretty special if you take into account that it was his first 11 men full field cricket match. The next game they put the kid in nr10 on the batting list. When I ask WTF? they told me the 11 year old kids parents moan and groan their bloeitjies havent got a change to bat ecause of his batting. Anyone that know a bit about cricket should know thats crap.

Yes and No PB. Why did your kid bat for 25 overs and only score 30? I hope for his sake the team won otherwise thats just extremely selfish batting and if I was in the team I would be pretty pissed off as well. When I was at school you had to retire after 24balls in the U9 and 10s, then you had to retire at 30 in the 11's and 12's. Wasnt till you got to Senior School and started playing 2 day matches that you could bat as long as you wanted.

As for the hockey issue your kid looks pretty small for a 10yr old. Hence it would be a big step up but as they say if he is good enough he is old enough. But while I understand you wanting to do whats best for him, I think you need to put aside thoughts of skill development and go purely on what he wants. If he wants to play with his mates in the 11's let him. Schoolboy sport is about enjoyment. If he doesnt have the drive to play up in the age groups, but you force him to anyway, surely that is only going to turn him off the sport. But if he wants to try it out you should be encouraging but more important supportive whether he suceeds or not.

But anyway, you and I clearly have very different views about schoolboy sport.You said on the Fern that you are more concerned with winning than the behaviour of the teams. As I said then, I find that disgusting so I understand if you dont listen to my opinion.

 

[PaarlBok]

Gambler thanks for the advise and good that we can disscuss this even futher. Trust me I do respect your sentiments. I do rate enjoyment but when he go in a game you play to win, just to get more enjoyment. The kid is in a pretty special age group & team. Lost 1 rugby match all season & 2 with the hockey. Regarding the cricket I taught him the basics of rather try to stay in as long as possible. Being small he wont play some big shots and got that runs via 1s and the odd 2. He want to go to the U13s if getting picked. At this stage he is grade 3 and doing his sport with the grade4s. Birthday at 30 November and we decided to rather keep him one year back before grade 1. Did the same with the older one and myself thought it was a good thing because one year make a big differense for a grade oner.

Feel free to question me, will never just throw it away and specially those who have experiense in this regard.

Myself never to old to learn.

 

[the gambler]

Sorry PB, just reread my post and realised I sounded pretty negative.

Obviously we have different views but thats no excuse for the attitude I may have given in the last post.

But I still think you should follow scarfmans advice and listen to your kid. At school I was great mates with a kid that was a cricket star and is now a professional rugby player. We fell out because his old man forced him to play cricket outside of school at a higher level and thus leave his mates behind. He and many others may have thought it was jealousy, but i can honestly say it wasnt. I just thought he was going for personal glory rather than playing with his mates and for his school. But I do believe that it was because he was being forced to take cricket so seriously from such a young age that he ended up choosing rugby over cricket.

But I will summarise my views to this point.

If your kid wants to play up the age, then let him have a shot at it. If it works out then great, if not he can go back and take the experience with him and know that he gave it his best shot but the time wasnt right.

If however he wants to stick playing with his mates, then let him. You cant create the drive/will that only a very few athletes have. If you do try to create it artificially it will only backfire and your kid will be burnt out and will give the sport away without even giving it a full shot. Enjoyment is the key. Let him love whatever sport he plays in and his natural talent/desire will determine how far he goes with it. But trying to dictate that at such a young age is only a recipie for danger.

I would suggest that if he is part of such a special age group, why not let them develop as a team and enjoy the beauty of team sports together, because nothing can replicate the enjoyment of winning with your mates, even if it is playing at a higher level.

 

[Pfitzy]

Ask his coaches PB - they've seen more kids go through the process than just about anyone, and its a sad fact that if you want to give yourself a shot at the big time these days, you have to specialise earlier than ever!

I'd also say to take Mrs PB's advice about emotional sensitivity with due consideration, but also remember she's a mother so she'll always want to protect her little man.

Part of the issue you're going to have is due to success: he is in a winning environment more often than not, so its hard to tell how he will feel after a loss - especially if its for the U13s. How will he feel if he is in a losing team and THEN gets told to go back to U11? He might feel like its his fault and suffer a blow to his confidence.

Personally, I've coached junior cricket and seen kids promoted based on the fact they're bigger than other kids - it works well because it toughens them up mentally. Looking at the photos, the little guy isn't the biggest so I'd be tempted to leave him at U11 level for another year and see if he starts to grow, then chuck him at the older boys. It also gives him time to develop leadership skills with his peer age group rather than being "the little kid" of U13.

 

[PaarlBok]

Sorry PB, just reread my post and realised I sounded pretty negative.

Obviously we have different views but thats no excuse for the attitude I may have given in the last post.

No sweat broer, we may have a different view regarding the win story but for me its not just winning, losing for a kid is also important. The lessons in it and I can promise you it teach them life lessons. Myself always like the losing part in sport for kids to use it positively because I have a outlook that losing in sport make them use to the losses in life also. They are going to deal with that many times in their everyday life. Play to win but be the first one to shake and hands and lose with a smile!

 

[PaarlBok]

We fell out because his old man forced him to play cricket outside of school at a higher level and thus leave his mates behind. He and many others may have thought it was jealousy, but i can honestly say it wasnt. I just thought he was going for personal glory rather than playing with his mates and for his school. But I do believe that it was because he was being forced to take cricket so seriously from such a young age that he ended up choosing rugby over cricket.

But trying to dictate that at such a young age is only a recipie for danger.

I'll never force any sport on my kids. He recieved tennis classes from age 3 and it end in a disaster. Not by my doing but with the coach. She wanted to give him that and he short of told me on a day he dont want to do it any more. I stopped it immediately and he never touched a tennis racket again. You must understand myself never played hockey and I am a firm believer that a prymary school kid have to do as many kind of sport as possible. Also I do believe sport for a kid is just as important as academy in prymary school. In High School he can specialize. The more he did in prymary school the more options he have in High School. My 21 year older was also a versatile sport kind of kid and was a even better rugby player. He picked hockey (I never try to pursaude him otherwise)and the small one grew up along the hockey field. Thats where he got the skills and of course in my backyard. A firm believer thats where kids learn their trade. Practising in school time not enough but backyard with the older one be it cricket, hockey or touchies the important trade one.

 

[Lindommer]

PB, I've been involved in junior sport as a parent, administrator, manager and coach for all of the past 12 years, due to my son playing rugby, cricket and basketball. He's played for junior clubs and school teams and managed to make a district under 10 representative cricket team when he was nine. The one thing I've noticed is some boys shine at one age and are passed by others when they get older while others take more time develop into representative sportsmen.

Ten is far too young to be pushed into doing something "better". It's crucially important all children at this age enjoy sport for the sake of having organised fun and playing with their friends should be paramount. If he's good enough there's plenty of time for him to develop his skills and shoot for higher honours.

 

[PaarlBok]

Thanks Lind, some very good advice. Think the reason why some do grow quicker then others is when kids get it very easy to get in the so called A team. Those tending to work harder seems to go the full Monty. My kid wont get that big head syndrome and I try my outmost best to keep his feet on the ground and be a humble

 

[PaarlBok]

Photo of the rugby team

 

[PaarlBok]

After Thomo visit me today (glad to finally met my Boere Ier) we both decided the leave this desition till next season , next year. Think we'll just see where he end and if they invite him to the trials at the start of the season, take it from there.

 

[PaarlBok]

Kid plays his last cricket match of 2008 tomorrow. In his first year as U11 and made the B team. Next year he'll be a geniune U11 and will defnitely play in the A team. His dad has encourage him into spin bowling. Like you all know not many around of them in SA and he being a small one, myself try and teach him the art of off spin. He did not make much amends in his matches (they only played 3 this season from July) and their coach and capt as U11s havent learn to catch like they should or to place a field for slow bowling and neither know the wickey to stand close for his bowling at this age. But I am keen that he take it futher and will get results once he learn the trade to bowl line and length first , before trying to do something with the ball. He is quite a natural batsman and have all the shots in the book. I usually take him on sundays in the nets and give him a bit of cricket practise.