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Spiro's article today

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Richo

John Thornett (49)
Opinion has been divided on Deans since day 1. No surprise the critics are baying now.

The thing is, those who've been criticising Deans for the last year or two (in particular) turned out to be right. Inexperience was no doubt a huge factor, but the team was rudderless, tactically inferior in almost every game, repeatedly scrummaged into trouble, lacked structure in attack, and demonstrated poor skills, including passing, taking the high-ball and line-out throwing. Many - if not all - of these were pointed out by critics of Deans over the last year plus.
 

fatprop

George Gregan (70)
Staff member
I disagree. Continually making basic factual errors suggests that other aspects of his claims must be questioned also. Why accept as true one part, knowing others are plain wrong, meaning he either researches poorly, or is having a lend? It speaks to his credibility.
And anyway, as Gnostic said, why do we hear of this for the first time in 10 yrs now? Who knew rugby circles kept secrets so well?

It is more about the internet meme that a minor factual error completely discounts an argument completely.

To me Spiro is biased and has a clear agenda, but all I do ensure that I raise my bull shit meter a bit higher when reading his stuff.
 

darkhorse

Darby Loudon (17)
3) When a scribe resorts to belittling and personally attacking his/her opposition (Bolshies) it shows that have little substance to their arguments. I find it highly amusing that he selected this term as my friend and I have been referring to the ARU and their cosy no critique relationship (or we will restrict your access to players etc) with some scribes being the Kremlin/Pravda like. Spiro was a chief Comrade. Very amusing indeed, Spiro have you been reading my mail again, please get your own ideas. Giteau has always been the perfect Gen Y boy tweeting and facebook when he has a crap so I don't know why anybody is surprised at his comments. At least he is being honest, and I say that from the POV of somebody who didn't and still doesn't support him for a test spot and thought his test career stretched two years too long on merit.

So in the end I think the Kremlin needed a diversion for some of the heat directed at the Master Coach. So being a senior Pravda writer Spiro dutifully did his best for his Comrades. When is your next exclusive with The Master Coach or Senior Players Spiro?

What are you doing by referring to the ARU as the Kremlin? ;)
 

Gnostic

Mark Ella (57)
What are you doing by referring to the ARU as the Kremlin? ;)

One is a factual observation, the other a derogatory comment. The use of the slang term reinforces his derision of those he is talking about.

But yes I am a simple person with lots of contradictions. :)
 

Roundawhile

Billy Sheehan (19)
One of the things I liked about Link this year was his ability to change his game plan depending on the opponent :- work out how to neutralise their strengths and how we need to attack their weaknesses.

Robbies plan for the RWC (virtually every game) was to kick when in our half. That is not a plan based on the opposition that is a plan based on non belief in your team.

Why after 4 years of developing an attacking side did he throw it out the window for the RWC? I don't understand.................
 

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
The Rod McQueen allegation is bizarre: I know his business partner, and 3 blokes who all know him + 1 bloke who was senior at the ARU. I've heard many stories - including one about the identity of the bloke who drove the Lions gear truck around Australia in 2001 - and no one has ever suggested that disenchantment with the players had anything to do with him going.
In addition McQueen was the founding coach of the Brumbies. He set up the "player power" arrangement and fostered it. It seems unlikely that he would have resented it, particularly when he ran a ship in a way that was quite detached from the ARU compared to the present arrangements, anyway: JON is never far from the centre stage in press conferences.
My recollection is that he left the Tahs in the early 90's when he had taken them as fas they could go - but I stand to be corrected on that one.
On the Luke Burgess box kick - maybe Spiro had a premonition about how popular they were about to become with the wallabies......
 

waratahjesus

Greg Davis (50)
One of the things I liked about Link this year was his ability to change his game plan depending on the opponent :- work out how to neutralise their strengths and how we need to attack their weaknesses.

Robbies plan for the RWC (virtually every game) was to kick when in our half. That is not a plan based on the opposition that is a plan based on non belief in your team.

Why after 4 years of developing an attacking side did he throw it out the window for the RWC? I don't understand.................

Not to start an anti reds thing or anything, but every team has different game plans, in theory most of them work. QLD had going for it this year Quade Cooper in the form of his life and he won three or four games off individual skill that had nothing to do with team work. Take away those moments and QLD don't factor in the finals.

That's not to say they didn't deserve the win, they did, it's just a fact, if he goes out of form they lose the boil.
 

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Preaching to the converted here, but Super success does not always translate into Test Success.

Joe Rocokoko looked awesome in a couple of ITM games I happened to catch this year. As did $BW and Fruen (last season) for Canterbury ITM.

These awesome gamewinning ITM level players do not get Test Starts or even Test recalls.
 

Dark Shark

Alex Ross (28)
The player power that undermined MacQueen at the end of his reign and then Eddie Jones is mentioned in Growden's book "Inside the Wallabies". I thought this was well known because I thought I remembered hearing it at the time and was not surprised when I read it / confirmed it in this book.

The Rod McQueen allegation is bizarre: I know his business partner, and 3 blokes who all know him + 1 bloke who was senior at the ARU. I've heard many stories - including one about the identity of the bloke who drove the Lions gear truck around Australia in 2001 - and no one has ever suggested that disenchantment with the players had anything to do with him going.
In addition McQueen was the founding coach of the Brumbies. He set up the "player power" arrangement and fostered it. It seems unlikely that he would have resented it, particularly when he ran a ship in a way that was quite detached from the ARU compared to the present arrangements, anyway: JON is never far from the centre stage in press conferences.
My recollection is that he left the Tahs in the early 90's when he had taken them as fas they could go - but I stand to be corrected on that one.
On the Luke Burgess box kick - maybe Spiro had a premonition about how popular they were about to become with the wallabies......
 

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
The player power that undermined MacQueen at the end of his reign and then Eddie Jones is mentioned in Growden's book "Inside the Wallabies". I thought this was well known because I thought I remembered hearing it at the time and was not surprised when I read it / confirmed it in this book.

You've got the drop on me: I become nauseous just reading growdens ruck and maul column......a whole book of his and I'd be in intensive care.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

Slim 293

Stirling Mortlock (74)
Fair enough. The Daily Telegraph then.

The Telegraph used to have their own Grumbies in Peter Jenkins.

In fact, Jenkins was far worse.

Now he's head of Media & Communications at the ARU!

Maybe Grumbles will follow in his footsteps?
 

Hawko

Tony Shaw (54)
Opinion has been divided on Deans since day 1. No surprise the critics are baying now.

But in saying that I find myself agreeing that the Wallabies under performed. While I loved seeing their character and defence vs Boks, no one could be so deluded as to think that game showed all black beating form. The Irish game was woeful, and the second half of the Russia game an embarrassment.
I've seen so many different views as to why they were outplayed on Sunday. Many here say it was a stifled attack. Others, a poor tactical plan. Others an outplayed forward pack. Some even blame Quade.

Spiros' view is they're a young (read: inexperienced at RWC) team.

I think he has a point, but I can't help wondering how McQueen or McKenzie would have prepared the team for last Sunday
.

I more than agree with this. When you have a young/inexperienced team the VERY FIRST thing you have to do is set out a series of guidelines and limits so that youthful exhuberance does not run away with the show. That was the basis for the Reds win in the Super comp this year. There was clear structure on which to build the play of what was a very young and talented team.

The reason there are so many views on what caused our loss is that there were a number of contributing causes. All of those you listed are in the top five. In the forwards, we turned up to play with intensity. Unfortunately the other team had even more intensity. The NZ team knew this was the last big hurdle and played with a forward intensity we could not match. And yet our efforts in staying close on the scoreboard kept us in the match. Digby's run in the first half showed that there were vulnerabilities there that could be attacked. But we didn't do it enough to break down the defense and change the momentum. Instead we kicked (badly) for field position.

On the backline, what Deans did instead of instilling a plan of attack was to take the principles he had been building for the team and threw them in the trashcan. Out went the glorious running game that had the NZ team quaking with fear, to be replaced by two defensive centres who had no passing or running skills. Then Cooper was allowed to operate further away from the gainline so he and Genia could kick away any and all possession that didn't get swallowed up by the forward pods. Our backline play, although we had no Kurtley, was what made us so distinctive and what made us such a threat. Deans essentially neutered it.

I don't belong in the Dean's as traitor school. When examining a disaster, 99% of the causes will be down to incompetence and mistakes, only 1% might even be a conspiracy. Dean's failure was one of hubris. He so believed in his own abilities that he chose poor assistants who would not challenge him and he would not change tactics he had chosen even when they were obviously not working.

Sadly its time to move on. Our WC is basically over and despite a Wales test in November so is this year's international program. JON will not change Dean's appointment (another overly-stubborn leader who won't address mistakes) so its time to look forward to Super 15. Hopefully some grounds for optimism, especially with the the Tahs and Reds having so much potential this year.
 

Bullrush

Geoff Shaw (53)
It's not that hard is it.

Deans should have kept George Smith, Stirling Mortlock, maybe Phil Waugh and have Nathan Sharpe more involved. How many RWCs do you have to see before you realise that having that experience in your team is simply invaluable. Talent, training, preparation, money, whatever you want to list.....none of it can replace big game experience.

I've always thought that Graham Henry should have found some way to get Tana Umaga back for the 2003 RWC.....
 

Ruggo

Mark Ella (57)
Mortlock would of been a god send. I shook my head in dismay when they sent Turner over. It is nothing against Turner but he wasn't what was needed.
 
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