South African Rugby - Proper Dinkum Ridgy Didge Broken

[PaarlBok]

Blou with all due respect, the coaching is only one factor. SA rugby is entering a whole new era after the World Cup. I am expecting our top level to be much weaker from then. Expecting it to get to go to CC level. CC level to Vodacom level, Vodacom even weaker. The writing was on the wall when they change the S14 to the current format. Just have a look at the the last few weeks attendances at Newlands and Loftus. We killed the goose that lay the golden eggs. Bulls vs Stormers 6 times per year is a overkilling.

For all your reasons you can add the chicken runners. We wont be able to see any of our Bok stars playing which mean a drop in attendances. Its like a sick cycle.

Tap yourself on the back, you have just acknowledge that you support overseas teams before your own.

You got what you deserve and blaming coaching is only a very small part of it.

I'll watch schoolboy rugby or sport anyday before this S18 junk being dished up. You know why? Because schoolboy rugby in SA is still strong and healthy and good to watch. As long as this stay, SA will produce world class players, maybe not for SA but surely for the rugby world. Just as we do in cricket.

 

[PaarlBok]

Paarl got pissed at me for not supporting his team. Sorry. I can't support the Stormers.

You put yourself in the same league as the Cape Crusaders fans, those with the passion gap supporting the All Blacks on Newlands.

I mean, I am one of Meyers most hectic critics, di this mean I cant support the Springboks?

You are chicken runner, support the Wallabies.

 

[PaarlBok]

And, while we're here, is there still a bit of Voortrekker vs Soutie going on in SA rugby?

Voortrekker, vrekken hell!

 

[Blue]

You put yourself in the same league as the Cape Crusaders fans, those with the passion gap supporting the All Blacks on Newlands.

I mean, I am one of Meyers most hectic critics, di this mean I cant support the Springboks?

You are chicken runner, support the Wallabies.

You are the quintessential South African supporter. You just will not believe that anything internal is wrong. It's everyone else's fault.The boys on the boardroom love your type of supporter becuase not matter how much they keep screing up you will just come back, cap in hand, telling them how wonderful everything is.

If you seriously believe that the structure is to blame you are really delusional.

Do you mean to tell me that for the last five years you think Alistair Coetzee and Frans Ludeke did a good job? No. You can't say it. If they are able to WIN the stadiums will be filled. The Bulls filled the ring when they won.

Cluck cluck.

Hell will freeze over before I stop supporting the Boks. Bit this doesn't mean I can't be pissed of and disillusioned. It's my opinion. People have them. Deal with it

 

[PaarlBok]

You are the quintessential South African supporter. You just will not believe that anything internal is wrong. It's everyone else's fault.The boys on the boardroom love your type of supporter becuase not matter how much they keep screing up you will just come back, cap in hand, telling them how wonderful everything is.

If you seriously believe that the structure is to blame you are really delusional.

Do you mean to tell me that for the last five years you think Alistair Coetzee and Frans Ludeke did a good job? No. You can't say it. If they are able to WIN the stadiums will be filled. The Bulls filled the ring when they won.

Cluck cluck.

Hell will freeze over before I stop supporting the Boks. Bit this doesn't mean I can't be pissed of and disillusioned. It's my opinion. People have them. Deal with it

Deal with what? You dont have a clue whats going on in SA Rugby, not even close.

Wake up Boet, you blame the coaches, there wont be superugby quality players left in 2016. Thats much worse.

Cluck vokken cluck ja.

 

[Pfitzy]

Quickly off the top of your head
name 10 Lions players. See my point?

Even if I could name them, I couldn't fucking pronounce them...

 

[Blue]

Deal with what? You dont have a clue whats going on in SA Rugby, not even close.

Wake up Boet, you blame the coaches, there wont be superugby quality players left in 2016. Thats much worse.

Cluck vokken cluck ja.

Ok then. You're right. They're great coaches. All the good players have left.

Thank goodness I was wrong eh?

 

[PaarlBok]

Ok then. You're right. They're great coaches. All the good players have left.

Thank goodness I was wrong eh?

Vok must I spell it out. Its not only the players or the coaches, its vokken both. Coaches is just a part of it.

No go get yourself a Wallaby jersey.

 

[qwerty51]

 

[Hawko]

To return to my question: Why is Ackermann not more highly regarded in South Africa? He clearly has the ability to get the best out of his players and to form a cohesive group for his franchise that works together to get the optimum possible result.
Genuine question, not wanting to start a shit fight.

 

[Wilson]

Wikipedia has him winning SARU coach of the year in 2014. His major issue is probably not long enough spent coaching to have runs on the board. As far as I am aware he's only coached the lions (super and Currie) and his best result has been Currie cup runner up. Rightly or wrongly it'll be hard to progress without a title to his name.

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk

 

[Blue]

To return to my question: Why is Ackermann not more highly regarded in South Africa? He clearly has the ability to get the best out of his players and to form a cohesive group for his franchise that works together to get the optimum possible result.
Genuine question, not wanting to start a shit fight.

Oh with Paarl you'll get one.

I have no idea whether he is highly regarded or not.

If SA rugby is anything to go by probably not becuase performance as a coach in South Africa does not matter.

 

[Blue]

Vok must I spell it out. Its not only the players or the coaches, its vokken both. Coaches is just a part of it.

No go get yourself a Wallaby jersey.

Of course it's both.

The one is easy to fix though. Have a guess which one. Go on. Give it a shot.

You don't think the players who do not stay behind can perform better with improved coaching? Obviously you don't.

"No go get yourself a Wallaby jersey"

Exactly like you say it there, boet. NO. NEE.

 

[Blue]

Wikipedia has him winning SARU coach of the year in 2014. His major issue is probably not long enough spent coaching to have runs on the board. As far as I am aware he's only coached the lions (super and Currie) and his best result has been Currie cup runner up. Rightly or wrongly it'll be hard to progress without a title to his name.

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk

Maybe he doesn't come from the right school or kiss the right ass? Probably. Bus if he has another season like he did this year her will be poached by someone.

 

[RugbyFuture]

To be fair, Australian rugby has been facing these same problems for years from the sounds of it, its just now we're getting over our depth issues and poaching issues, SA Rugby sounds like its just gotten to a point now with the new super rugby teams etc that it has to face the same things.

 

[Blue]

With all due respect .I think what SA is facing is eons worse than anything Australia has ever had to face.

The player exodus is much worse and has been for years.

The coaches are under qualified and of sub-standard quality.

Quotas are real and have caused issues

 

[fatprop]

Yeah, for context here is a list of a few of their players playing overseas

France Top 14 (56):
JC Janse van Rensburg (Bayonne)
Steven Kitshoff (Bordeaux)
Berend Botha (Bordeaux)
Jandré Marais (Bordeaux)
Heini Adams (Bordeaux)
Pat Barnard (Brive)
Kevin Buys (Brive)
Peet Marais (Brive)
Johan Snyman (Brive)
Petrus Hauman (Brive)
Rory Kockott (Castres) - France
Flip van der Merwe (Clermont)
Daniel Kötze (Clermont)
Scott Spedding (Clermont) - France
Hendrik Roodt (Grenoble)
Charl McLeod (Grenoble)
Gio Aplon (Grenoble)
Enrico Januarie (La Rochelle)
Albertus Buckle (Lyon)
Wian du Preez (Lyon)
Coenraad Basson (Lyon)
Deon Fourie (Lyon)
Frans Viljoen (Lyon)
Bismarck du Plessis (Montpellier)
Jacobie Adriaanse (Montpellier)
Jannie du Plessis (Montpellier)
Schalk van der Merwe (Montpellier)
Jacques du Plessis (Montpellier)
Paul Willemse (Montpellier)
Wiaan Liebenberg (Montpellier)
Pierre Spies (Montpellier)
Cameron Wright (Montpellier)
Demetri Catrakilis (Montpellier)
Robert Ebersohn (Montpellier)
Wynand Olivier (Montpellier) - Leaving but no indication where to
CJ van der Linde (Montpellier)
Jody Jenneker (Oyonnax)
Pedrie Wannenburg (Oyonnax)
Johan Goosen (Racing Metro)
Juandré Kruger (Racing Metro)
François van der Merwe (Racing Metro)
Sean Robinson (Racing Metro)
Bernard Le Roux (Racing Metro) - France
Antonie Claassen (Racing Metro) - France
Heinke van der Merwe (Stade Francais)
Gerhard Mostert (Stade Francais)
Willem Alberts (Stade Francais)
Meyer Bosman (Stade Francais)
Morne Steyn (Stade Francais)
Juan Smith (Toulon)
Gerhard Vosloo (Toulon)
Bakkies Botha (Toulon) - Retired
Duane Vermeulen (Toulon)
Bryan Habana (Toulon)
Schalk Ferreira (Toulouse)
Gert Müller (Toulouse)
Gurthrö Steenkamp (Toulouse)

France Pro D2 (27):
Ruaan du Preez (Agen)
Burton Francis (Agen)
Johann Sadie (Agen)
Lee Adriaanse (Aurillac)
Delkeith Pottas (Aurillac)
Jakobus Kemp (Aurillac)
Eugene Van Staden (Biarritz)
Edwin Hewitt (Biarritz)
Philip van der Walt (Biarritz)
Rudi Brits (Colomiers)
Len Olivier (Colomiers)
Andries Kruger (Carcassonne)
André Pretorius (Carcassonne)
Wouter Moore (Béziers)
Henk Eksteen (Béziers)
Danré Gerber (Béziers)
Hermanus Grobler (Tarbes)
Cecil-John Kemp (Bourgoin)
Wessel Jooste (Bourgoin)
Nicolas Strauss (Narbonne)
Jacques Naude (Dax)
Jacques-Louis Potgieter (Dax)
Marius Delport (Dax)
Ashley Clarke (Massy)
David Byrnes (Montauban)
Wesley Dunlop (Montauban)
Brendon Snyman (Montauban)

English Premiership (17):
Francois Louw (Bath)
Shaun Malton (Exeter Chiefs)
Tim Swiel (Harlequin)
Sebastian de Chaves (Leicester Tigers)
Matthew Dobson (London Welsh)
Ben Pienaar (London Welsh)
Patrick Howard (Northampton Saints)
Ashley Johnson (Wasps)
Schalk Brits (Saracens)
Jared Saunders (Saracens)
Brett Sharman (Saracens)
Petrus du Plessis (Saracens)
Alistair Hargreaves (Saracens)
Michael Rhodes (Saracens)
Nic de Jager (Saracens)
Ernst Joubert (Saracens)
Neil de Kock (Saracens)

Pro12 (31):
Quinn Roux (Connacht)
Danie Poolman (Connacht)
Rossouw de Klerk (Glasgow Warriors)
Josh Strauss (Glasgow Warriors) - Scotland squad
BJ Botha (Munster)
CJ Stander (Munster)
Gerhard van den Heever (Munster)
Rynier Bernardo (Ospreys)
De Kock Steenkamp (Ospreys)
Hanno Dirksen (Ospreys)
Wiehahn Herbst (Ulster)
Franco van der Merwe (Ulster)
Ruan Pienaar (Ulster)
Louis Ludik (Ulster)
Zane Kirchner (Leinster)
George Earle (Scarlets)
Allan Dell (Edinburgh) - Scotland squad
WP Nel (Edinburgh) - Scotland squad
Anton Bresler (Edinburgh)
Cornell du Preez (Edinburgh)
Andries Strauss (Edinburgh)
Brok Harris (Newport Gwent Dragons)
Rynard Landman (Newport Gwent Dragons)
Sarel Pretorius (Newport Gwent Dragons)
Duncan Naude (Benetton Treviso)
Braam Steyn (Benetton Treviso)
Jean Cook (Zebre)
Johan Meyer (Zebre)
Dries van Schalkwyk (Zebre)
Ulrich Beyers (Zebre)
Kayle van Zyl (Zebre)

Japan Top League (9):
Andries Bekker (Kobe Steel Kobelco Steelers)
Jaque Fourie (Kobe Steel Kobelco Steelers)
Heinrich Brussouw (NTT Docomo Red Hurricanes)
Wimpie van der Walt (NTT Docomo Red Hurricanes)
Riaan Viljoen (NTT Docomo Red Hurricanes)
Louis Fouche (Ricoh Black Rams)
Justin Downey (Suntory Sungoliath)
Fourie du Preez (Suntory Sungoliath)
Dewald Potgieter (Yamaha Júbilo)
Keegan Daniel (Kubota Spears)

Japan Currie Cup season only (6):
Elton Jantjies (NTT Shining Arcs)
Willie Britz (NTT Shining Arcs)
JP Pietersen (Panasonic Wild Knights)
Schalk Burger (Suntory Sungoliath)
Frans Steyn (Toshiba Brave Lupus)
Jean Deysel (Toyota Verblitz)
Handre Pollard (NTT Docomo Red Hurricanes)
Ryan Kankowski (Toyota Industries Shuttles)
Andries Ferreira (Toyota Industries Shuttles)

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Would I be correct in saying that the Saffer players are also a more attractive target because of Kolpak regulations in Europe, meaning that they don't have to count against overseas player restrictions?

 

[PaarlBok]

Would I be correct in saying that the Saffer players are also a more attractive target because of Kolpak regulations in Europe, meaning that they don't have to count against overseas player restrictions?

Most Saffers players do the chicken run for the same reason Blue did. Career and income. In SA players have three ways to a rugby career:
A. The High Road: Get a professional contract from the province while still in school. The best lot get a contract in their u16 year already. Go to the province academy, play via Varsity/Voda/CC to S18 and then do the chicken run.
B. The Medium Road:Get a varsity and academy bursary. Go via Varsity Cup to Voda/CC , get a degree, go to S18 franschise and do the chicken run.
C. Low road: Do the chicken run straight straight after school to your new country and work and play.

Nowadays they run in their 1000s all over the world.

Coaches are a minor worry. Our National coach Meyer even ask them to do the chicken run, he'll select them from where ever.

 

[PaarlBok]

To return to my question: Why is Ackermann not more highly regarded in South Africa? He clearly has the ability to get the best out of his players and to form a cohesive group for his franchise that works together to get the optimum possible result.
Genuine question, not wanting to start a shit fight.

He is highly regard but he is still new in his job.

If I had to appoint a S18 coach I'll look no further then Jimmy Stonehouse.