Shute Shield 2025

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Think the only thing I'd say would be cost per month on a place around there more likely to be nudging 6-7k minimum for anything 3 bed+

What Clubs would't be spending that? Two Blues, Pirates and Hunter? I'd think the rest would be getting pretty close to that and seem to be after the Premiership over building.

Can't imagine Scholarships would count. Sydney Uni only one that direct, but Gordon has UTS and Randwick UNSW as sporting partners. So many options of full scholarship, part or I know of a guy given access to the course he wanted but didn't get into but as a full fee student.

It is a substantial cap for the level of the sport. I don't have an issue with it but I would like to see the 100 point system more forcefully in play.

 

[Pfitzy]

(im not sure if that comes into the salary cap as a payment, as its technically done with the university and player, rather than the rugby club)

I'm assuming a phone call to an employer is also outside the salary cap?

 

[Steve_Grey]

Think the only thing I'd say would be cost per month on a place around there more likely to be nudging 6-7k minimum for anything 3 bed+

What Clubs would't be spending that? Two Blues, Pirates and Hunter? I'd think the rest would be getting pretty close to that and seem to be after the Premiership over building.

Can't imagine Scholarships would count. Sydney Uni only one that direct, but Gordon has UTS and Randwick UNSW as sporting partners. So many options of full scholarship, part or I know of a guy given access to the course he wanted but didn't get into but as a full fee student.

It is a substantial cap for the level of the sport. I don't have an issue with it but I would like to see the 100 point system more forcefully in play.

Do Super Rugby players, that end up playing for their Clubs rather than Super Rugby [as they don't make the 23] get paid by the Shute Clubs also?

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

No idea mate.

I do recall hearing about Folau getting some big cash from Syd Uni whilst not playing a game though. Berrick Barnes also got a neat chunk of change.

I feel like they should have to like everyone else. Otherwise you buy a side to make finals and then lump in all the Super Rugby players for an almost guaranteed title. They like winning comps regardless.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Does anyone have access to the SRU operations manual? Would love to see what the official position is?

 

[HarryElite]

Do Super Rugby players, that end up playing for their Clubs rather than Super Rugby [as they don't make the 23] get paid by the Shute Clubs also?

Yes, which is why most of those guys end up at the richer clubs

Think the only thing I'd say would be cost per month on a place around there more likely to be nudging 6-7k minimum for anything 3 bed+

What Clubs would't be spending that? Two Blues, Pirates and Hunter? I'd think the rest would be getting pretty close to that and seem to be after the Premiership over building.

Can't imagine Scholarships would count. Sydney Uni only one that direct, but Gordon has UTS and Randwick UNSW as sporting partners. So many options of full scholarship, part or I know of a guy given access to the course he wanted but didn't get into but as a full fee student.

It is a substantial cap for the level of the sport. I don't have an issue with it but I would like to see the 100 point system more forcefully in play.

True, they may all spend that. I would say Souths, Two Blues and Wests probably wont get anywhere near that money on players. But the other clubs probably get there, if not far off it.

 

[LevitatingSocks]

I'm assuming a phone call to an employer is also outside the salary cap?

15 suspiciously athletic blokes sitting in beach chairs on a job site like in the Sopranos

 

[Strewthcobber]

Interesting article on the Roar about this, Hoiles obviously not that happy about Easts' success.

https://www.theroar.com.au/2024/08/29/therell-be-an-asterisk-ex-wallaby-calls-for-shute-shield-teams-to-be-audited-or-risk-harming-wallabies/

TLDR; $200k salary cap, each team signs stat dec saying they are meeting their obligations, no one ever checks if this is true

 

[Pfitzy]

Interstating article on the Roar about this, Hoiles obviously not that happy about Easts' success.

I agree with his points about the purpose of the competition: to develop prospective Waratahs and Wallabies. Foreign players don't necessarily help that.

Will it develop players in its current form? Unless you're on a pathway by the time you hit 19-20 I don't think SRU form is necessarily going to boost your credentials as a pro player.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Look I'm very 'Impressed' with what Easts put together but Hoiles can eat a bag of dicks with talking about making the competition equal. He's a pure blood of the most kissed on the dick Club in Australian Rugby.

7 different premiers in a decade. It's better than described or the fear he'd like to instil and hide behind being the White Knight for Hunter and DC up there. He's dirty the local rival got the comp and it happened to be the year after Randwick as well.

 

[LevitatingSocks]

I agree with his points about the purpose of the competition: to develop prospective Waratahs and Wallabies. Foreign players don't necessarily help that.

Will it develop players in its current form? Unless you're on a pathway by the time you hit 19-20 I don't think SRU form is necessarily going to boost your credentials as a pro player.

It could be argued that the presence of high level foreign players helps with development and standard setting.

The point where the snake might start eating its tail is when they're clustered at certain clubs and in sufficient numbers to crowd out Australia eligible talent.

A solution might be scraping the points system and simply making Australian players cheaper from a cap perspective. E.g. if the salary cap is 200k, then only 75% of payment values to Australian players count against the cap while foreign talent payments count for their full 100% value. You could throw in a further discount for payments to players that are your own juniors.

You can play around with the exact numbers but it adds an incentive to develop native talent and retain your juniors.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Is there a foreign player cap? I wouldn't count NZ as many come here to live and play footy secondary.

I like the idea of bringing in rules like that but you would need to then make sure Clubs did get randomly selected or checked every year. Something I think is beyond them right now. Love the Junior idea but imagine places like Uni and even Norths not loving that since they build Clubs with other Clubs juniors. Easts are pretty good with that too even though they have plenty of juniors.

 

[noknowledgeatall]

Seems there are 5-6 Hospital Cup players moving down from QLD to play SS. QLD rugby is broke and a few hundred a game has all the young blokes talking in Brisbane.

 

[Steve_Grey]

It could be argued that the presence of high level foreign players helps with development and standard setting.

The point where the snake might start eating its tail is when they're clustered at certain clubs and in sufficient numbers to crowd out Australia eligible talent.

A solution might be scraping the points system and simply making Australian players cheaper from a cap perspective. E.g. if the salary cap is 200k, then only 75% of payment values to Australian players count against the cap while foreign talent payments count for their full 100% value. You could throw in a further discount for payments to players that are your own juniors.

You can play around with the exact numbers but it adds an incentive to develop native talent and retain your juniors.

"You could throw in a further discount for payments to players that are your own juniors."

I like this a lot (50% discount for Australian U23s?) - real incentive to include Colts in Grade.

If the points system is kept, then U23s could gain a discount, while own Juniors could be zero points?

 

[LevitatingSocks]

"You could throw in a further discount for payments to players that are your own juniors."

I like this a lot (50% discount for Australian U23s?) - real incentive to include Colts in Grade.

If the points system is kept, then U23s could gain a discount, while own Juniors could be zero points?

The other benefit would be that players can earn more playing for the clubs that developed them.

Hypothetically if you were a Two Blues junior, Two Blues could pay you more than Randwick could for the same salary cap hit.

It would be huge for keeping less wealthy clubs competitive and stocked with talent.

The downside would be the administrative complexity.

 

[Steve_Grey]

The other benefit would be that players can earn more playing for the clubs that developed them.

Hypothetically if you were a Two Blues junior, Two Blues could pay you more than Randwick could for the same salary cap hit.

It would be huge for keeping less wealthy clubs competitive and stocked with talent.

The downside would be the administrative complexity.

"The downside would be the administrative complexity."

Yes - easy to see the potential benefits (keeping Australian U23s in the system, and rewarding own Junior Development), but probably too much administration.

 

[Strewthcobber]

The other benefit would be that players can earn more playing for the clubs that developed them.

Hypothetically if you were a Two Blues junior, Two Blues could pay you more than Randwick could for the same salary cap hit.

It would be huge for keeping less wealthy clubs competitive and stocked with talent.

The downside would be the administrative complexity.

The other downside is the less wealthy clubs can't afford to pay the salary cap in the first place, so increase chances of blowing themselves up trying to retain their players

 

[noknowledgeatall]

Hearing around Brisbane that Sydney clubs are recruiting hard, picking off the better Hospital Cup players from 2024.

 

[Crashy]

How about they develop their own players..

 

[noknowledgeatall]

How about they develop their own players..

Problem is the Reds don't support local talents and the Hospital Cup has no cash. Players can go to Sydney and at least get a small payment which makes it more attractive