Shute Shield 2014

[Rugby Central]

Club Rugby (soon to be 4T) will have a very important role to play. Particularly as there's a whole season of footy before 3T kicks off.

It will however cause some serious adjustment. I think one of the main drivers should be a recreation of Sydney Division 2. With Subbies bringing in stricter adherence to amateurism this will leave a lot of the ambitious Clubs with nowhere to go.

Bring SS back to 8 teams with a second division of 8 teams you will have a more manageable season for the Clubs facing the challenges 3T throws up. Have a promotion relegation system so that Clubs that want to push up, can, those that can’t or don’t want to, lose the protected status that currently enables underperformance. It will also finish at the right time regarding the 3T competition. It means that 3T is an extension of Club rugby, not a competitor.

 

[Done that]

Club Rugby (soon to be 4T) will have a very important role to play. Particularly as there's a whole season of footy before 3T kicks off.

It will however cause some serious adjustment. I think one of the main drivers should be a recreation of Sydney Division 2. With Subbies bringing in stricter adherence to amateurism this will leave a lot of the ambitious Clubs with nowhere to go.

Bring SS back to 8 teams with a second division of 8 teams you will have a more manageable season for the Clubs facing the challenges 3T throws up. Have a promotion relegation system so that Clubs that want to push up, can, those that can’t or don’t want to, lose the protected status that currently enables underperformance. It will also finish at the right time regarding the 3T competition. It means that 3T is an extension of Club rugby, not a competitor.

Club Rugby already has a very important role to play as the current 3T, that's nothing new,but where is the support or recognition of club Rugby by the ARU?
Who can deny that club Rugby is & has been , on the slide for a number of years.
And where is the current development of Rugby at a club level,with the aim of spreading the game?
Some supporters of the new 3T model seem to think that it will magically result in the spread & growth of Rugby in Australia ,while at the same time glibly noting that club Rugby
will in future be demoted to the 4th tier,with no reference to the likely negative effects that such a demotion will have on recruitment & development which club Rugby
currently,if inadequately, provides.
Why would the demotion of club Rugby not simply accelerate it's demise?
We all know why club Rugby is important in the overall scheme of things,but I for one,am apprehensive that it ,& all the club stalwarts etc. who are responsible for it's ongoing
existance ,will be taken for granted & assumed to always be there & carrying out its/their current function.

 

[Blackers13]

Club Rugby already has a very important role to play as the current 3T, that's nothing new,but where is the support or recognition of club Rugby by the ARU?
Who can deny that club Rugby is & has been , on the slide for a number of years.
And where is the current development of Rugby at a club level,with the aim of spreading the game?
Some supporters of the new 3T model seem to think that it will magically result in the spread & growth of Rugby in Australia ,while at the same time glibly noting that club Rugby
will in future be demoted to the 4th tier,with no reference to the likely negative effects that such a demotion will have on recruitment & development which club Rugby
currently,if inadequately, provides.
Why would the demotion of club Rugby not simply accelerate it's demise?
We all know why club Rugby is important in the overall scheme of things,but I for one,am apprehensive that it ,& all the club stalwarts etc. who are responsible for it's ongoing
existence ,will be taken for granted & assumed to always be there & carrying out its/their current function.

I agree with the NRC as a concept, it has worked exceptionally well in NZ and SA, I just think it has been rammed through without considering the points you make Done That. Many clubs have survived, or in our case come back from the dead, on the back of hard working volunteers. Our funding has been cut 2 years in a row yet we've all managed to put a pretty good product on the field. With expressions of interest in fielding and NRC team closing on January 14, our resources and time is now turned into forming alliances and developing heads of agreement at a time when most clubs are going on a break. I can't help but think there's some ulterior motive to the rush and haste, I hope it's not to give those clubs with the cash resources an armchair ride while those less cashed up clubs need to do a considerable amount of work to form a potential tender in a very short and interrupted period of time.

 

[refugee]

Shute Shield Predictor for 2014
Eastwood
Uni
Gordon
Randwick
Manly
Southern Districts
Norths
Easts
West Harbour
Warringah
Parramatta
Penrith

or without s15
Manly
Eastwood
Sth Districts
Easts
Uni

Randwick
Gordon
west harbour
warringah
parramatta
norths
penrith

 

[Crashy]

I’m not exactly sure why people are seeing the creation of the 3rd tier as some sort of death-nell for club rugby – In my opinion Club Rugby will only get stronger as a result.
Main points
The club season will remain as is. It will start a bit earlier that previously which will present some challenges for those clubs who share their ovals with a cricket club. I’ve done some rough calcs and half the comp have fields that don’t have cricket pitches on them, meaning that 6 clubs might see a couple of home games in a row at the start.
Therefore during the season, apart from Super Rugby, each state will have its premier rugby comps as the premier-rugby-comp-in-each-state.
The NRC only goes for 12 weeks and is to be played at a time when there was no rugby apart from the Wallabies. Therefore no conflict with the clubs.
As it appears, each of the NRC teams will be made up of club players. For example the North Harbour team will comprise of players from the 4 clubs who are north of the harbour. Each club will supply the same amount of players therefore all clubs will have their roster protected.
The Shute Shield will not contain any top line Super Rugby players or Wallabies meaning the playing field will be level. The days of Uni hoarding all the best Wallabies and Super Rugby players and trotting them out for the finals series will be over. How good will it be to possibly see a Manly vs West Harbour GF.
The Shute Shield will now most likely become largely amateur as it always was – meaning club funds will be directed towards coaching, facilities, S&C etc rather than mercenaries, mungos and journeymen.

I for one as a life long rugby player through juniors, schools and subbies will support this whole-heartedly. I just hope everyone else does.

 

[Rugby Central]

Hey DT,

I admire your passion but I disagree with much of what you’ve said. I’m addressing your comment directly.

“Club Rugby already has a very important role to play as the current 3T” Yes it should, and after nearly 20 years of professionalism they still can’t manage to do the job.

“Some supporters of the new 3T model seem to think that it will magically result in the spread & growth of Rugby in Australia” I don’t think anyone has mentioned said magic but a pay TV deal that covers costs is a major leap forward on the status quo.

“Why would the demotion of club Rugby not simply accelerate its demise?”

1. There is a gap between Club and Super Rugby and it has to be filled.
2. By having Clubs feed into 3T it creates a pathway that quality players have to go down to be recognised. No Club, no way to prove you’re up to 3T
3. With academies abandoned players have no chance of developing their game to the necessary level without playing for the Clubs
4. This puts Clubs squarely back in the mix of player development. Unlike the recent situation where the only place a player could come from was directly from an ARU development program. Surely that’s a good thing

This is not the way I would have chosen to do it. I would definitely have utilised the premier clubs better. But by the evidence of the last 15 years or so, Clubs have not been able to make the transition to professionalism and act as the appropriate 3T required.

This is about the game and how as a nation we can address the decline.

 

[Crashy]

Gordon issued a press release today stating that they will form part of a 4 club club, North Harbour NRC team - very smart and a good sign that most shute shield clubs will do the same.
Uni obviously won't but hey, they're uni....

 

[RugbyReg]

I remember when the NRL became "N" back in the late 80s with the Broncs and Gold Coast coming in and the local Brisbane RL club stalwarts came out saying itd be the death of grassroots league in Brisbane with Wally, Geno et al no longer playing that club rugby.

And to be fair the comp deteriorated a bit and clubs failed, but its back and pretty bloody strong now. Its a true breeding ground and in fact an actual state wide comp now too.

Hopefully we can replicate its success in club rugby.

 

[the coach]

Gordon issued a press release today stating that they will form part of a 4 club club, North Harbour NRC team - very smart and a good sign that most shute shield clubs will do the same.
Uni obviously won't but hey, they're uni..

I thought they'd only lodged an EOI?
None of the clubs will be announced until February as I understand it.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I remember when the NRL became "N" back in the late 80s with the Broncs and Gold Coast coming in and the local Brisbane RL club stalwarts came out saying itd be the death of grassroots league in Brisbane with Wally, Geno et al no longer playing that club rugby.

And to be fair the comp deteriorated a bit and clubs failed, but its back and pretty bloody strong now. Its a true breeding ground and in fact an actual state wide comp now too.

Hopefully we can replicate its success in club rugby.

There could be real opportunity for the likes of the SS to look to involve the more centralized country regions plus the ambitious subbies clubs with NSW Subbies going back to strict amateurism. Could allow for Rugby to build an identity in new areas of the city.

It could actually be a very exciting time for Rugby at that level if they embrace the change and look to find new opportunities.

 

[I like to watch]

The agreement between the Northern Sydney clubs seems interesting.
The Gordon website indicates there will be equal numbers of players from each of the clubs and there will be a strict non poaching agreement between them.
How will they deal with say Manly players who misses out on the T3side, on the quota issue and wants to move to a weaker partner to increase his chance of selection?

 

[lily]

A quota system is not at all fair. That said, if they don't then look at it I think in a year or two half of the clubs wont be in a position to be involved in the first half of the season due to migration. If one team has a higher representation as well as te notion that people like playing with their mates, it'seasy to suggest that they will want to play together all year round.
Finally how many Gordon players on merit do you think deserve to start in a composite team?

 

[turnovertwopasses]

What i dont understand is how all these rugby clubs have no money after most used to have licensed clubs/pokies...

 

[Dave Beat]

A quota system is not at all fair. That said, if they don't then look at it I think in a year or two half of the clubs wont be in a position to be involved in the first half of the season due to migration. If one team has a higher representation as well as te notion that people like playing with their mates, it'seasy to suggest that they will want to play together all year round.
Finally how many Gordon players on merit do you think deserve to start in a composite team?

It should be a rep team and you need to make selection, imagine if the Tahs had to select 2 players from each SS team. I'd be surprised if all clubs agreed equal quota for the Nth Harbour team.

Shouldn't they be the aspiring players in the 3T and not 23 / 4 teams? If you warrant selection you should be in the team, it will create disharmony if you not (IMO).

If Sydney Uni stand alone will they pick 6 players from each grade - I think not.

 

[I like to watch]

A quota system is not at all fair. That said, if they don't then look at it I think in a year or two half of the clubs wont be in a position to be involved in the first half of the season due to migration. If one team has a higher representation as well as te notion that people like playing with their mates, it'seasy to suggest that they will want to play together all year round.
Finally how many Gordon players on merit do you think deserve to start in a composite team?

It's going to be interesting!
From say,a Gordon POV why should they subsidise 25% of the costs if none of their players are gaining any benefit/experience from this new entity?
And from a Manly POV why should one of their guys miss out on quota grounds?
They are going to need the wisdom of Solomon to solve some of these issues.

 

[Dave Beat]

It's going to be interesting!
From say,a Gordon POV why should they subsidise 25% of the costs if none of their players are gaining any benefit/experience from this new entity?
And from a Manly POV why should one of their guys miss out on quota grounds?
They are going to need the wisdom of Solomon to solve some of these issues.

It should be a rep team and you need to earn selection, as I said above;
imagine the Tahs selecting 2 players from each SS team, or,
the Wobs having to select 6 players from each Soup team.

Not aware of all clubs balance sheets, or the required funding at this stage.

If all clubs are supporting it and we are winning and playing entertaining rugby it will garner more interest, if we are getting our arses spanked it could have the opposite effect. It should be best players being selected.

 

[turnovertwopasses]

What will Sydney Uni do if they are knocked back and can't enter it alone?

 

[Dave Beat]

What will Sydney Uni do if they are knocked back and can't enter it alone?

Gordon UTS and Sydney Uni may merge and split the quota of players and scholarships.

 

[turnovertwopasses]

What i dont understand is how all these rugby clubs have no money after most used to have licensed clubs/pokies.

 

[Zander]

Only a couple own their grounds, they pay rent to local councils.