Sharks v. Tahs - 2011R15

[cyclopath]

Just watching the replay.

Sharks 7 should be suspended for the remainder of the season. He could have broken carters neck with that move. If Carter had been seriously injured I think he would have had a case for a civil suit. Even worse than the move that injured pocock against the same team. These dangerous wrestling moves need to be eradicated before someone gets put into a wheel chair.

Also noted how poor turners effort was on Pieterson at the start of his run away try. Defense is meant to be a strong point of his game but that effort was average.

Did you see the episode in the Lions / Highlanders game? Lions player flipped 'Landers guy through 180 degrees over a ruck by his neck!! I'm happy to say the 'Landers player got up and landed 2 good shots right on the guy's chin. One of the few times I was cheering for someone to really punch on - absolutely disgraceful play by the Lions man. Looks like wrestling is on the up in the Republic. Needs to be stopped and fast.

 

[spectator]

I've only seen some brief Foxtel highlights of the game but Halangahu looks like he went alright.

Unlike the Tah's not to close out a tight one when they had their heads in front.

 

[Gnostic]

Just watching the replay.

Sharks 7 should be suspended for the remainder of the season. He could have broken carters neck with that move. If Carter had been seriously injured I think he would have had a case for a civil suit. Even worse than the move that injured pocock against the same team. These dangerous wrestling moves need to be eradicated before someone gets put into a wheel chair.

Also noted how poor turners effort was on Pieterson at the start of his run away try. Defense is meant to be a strong point of his game but that effort was average.

What I noted regarding Deysel's headlock on Carter was that it went on well past the time the ball was gone and both players were away from the ruck. The grip was obviously very very tight as well, there can be no defence as to intent and IMO should be a minimum of 6 weeks if he has no prior history. If Deysel has previous form for any foul play wipe him for the remainder of the year ie 6 months. Same for the Lions player with the throw against the Highlanders.

 

[Hawko]

What I noted regarding Deysel's headlock on Carter was that it went on well past the time the ball was gone and both players were away from the ruck. The grip was obviously very very tight as well, there can be no defence as to intent and IMO should be a minimum of 6 weeks if he has no prior history. If Deysel has previous form for any foul play wipe him for the remainder of the year ie 6 months. Same for the Lions player with the throw against the Highlanders.

I agree with this.

Did anyone else notice that Bismark did the same thing but in the middle of a ruck so it was less obvious. It looks to me like the Sharks are making it a feature of their play..

 

[Gnostic]

If the kids hadn't been in bed I would have been yelling at the TV with Kraplan. WTF was he thinking regarding the scrum penalty in the Sharks 22? The bloke is a very poor Ref. and always has been. I have said it before and will say it again, the Tahs should simply refuse to play with Kraplan, tell SANZAR that they will not accept him as an official as he is obviously biased.

That being said the Tahs again show why the fans have been booing them. Their basic skills execution is poor and directly lead to many of the turnovers including the last one the Sharks scored from to take the game. The endeavour and energy were up for this game and I think this was the "one" game Hickey had targetted.

Next year I am looking forward to a cleanout, Hickey will be gone as will Burgess and I truly hope to see the last of Phil Waugh, Mumm, Cross and Carter. I hear the cries of protest beginning but these players are predictable limitted individuals. Yes they give their all each game but they offer nothing new and are very easily countered by the opposition to the point they are a liability. Carter is supposed to be the big bash 12 to get the Tahs over the gain line, well he does a touch over 50% of the time but invariably dies with the ball and presents slow ruck ball. Waugh and Mumm are part of the "professional culture" of the Tahs that produces tradesmen like performances where enough effort to get the job done is produced (if the opposition produces that bit more the stats will show they played well). Cross - is just slow and displays poor skills.

 

[Shiggins]

Good too see the love for kaplin. Paka missed that vital try.
Tahs played not too bad though. Hangers was great! Apart from some defense.

Kaplin wasn't that bad I thought.

Go the force!!!!

 

[whatty]

Good win by a average Sharks team. For a minute I am sure you said they train for those types of tackles hawko, that would have been a bit silly.

 

[cyclopath]

Good win by a average Sharks team. For a minute I am sure you said they train for those types of tackles hawko, that would have been a bit silly.

Well, maybe they don't dedicate a session each week to headlock throws, we saw 2 awful ones this weekend which had potential for serious, permanent injury, we saw the one involved in the Pocock injury earlier in the year (and yes, I know the injury was a by-product of the sleeper hold and an unfortunate accident) but the headlock itself is a blight. Circumstantially, all 3 performed by SA players, 2 from the Sharks. I haven't seen the headlock throw being used in previous years, so it must be coming from somewhere. It needs to be stopped, and quite frankly, whether they train to do it or not is irrelevant.

 

[matty_k]

Adam Freier on Offsiders said it is something they practice but around the chest not the neck.

 

[DPK]

Adam Freier on Offsiders said it is something they practice but around the chest not the neck.

I've practiced this before, and that was in schoolboy rugby. It is quite easy to accidentally slip onto the neck, but it's easy to let go of the bloke.

 

[Bowside]

I've practiced this before, and that was in schoolboy rugby. It is quite easy to accidentally slip onto the neck, but it's easy to let go of the bloke.

We practised it as well, but it was always more around the stomach area and we use to roll them sideways.

 

[whatty]

Adam Freier on Offsiders said it is something they practice but around the chest not the neck.

Sounds about right I would say.

If I had to get into the debate re how bad the tackles looked and what suspension they should get I would agree with most (4-6 weeks) , however taking into consideration above that they got it WRONG.
Then saying they purposely practice the Neck rather than the chest then omg I don't think i will bother with this thread.

 

[Jnor]

As far as I can tell no-ones saying that. Just in the process of watching the game on and off over the arvo (while pretending to work) and have to say I thought TC made more metres, more effectively than I've seen for a while

 

[cyclopath]

Sounds about right I would say.

If I had to get into the debate re how bad the tackles looked and what suspension they should get I would agree with most (4-6 weeks) , however taking into consideration above that they got it WRONG.
Then saying they purposely practice the Neck rather than the chest then omg I don't think i will bother with this thread.

I didn't say that. I said the practice of headlocking is bad and should be stamped on. Saying they aimed for the chest and unfortunately twisted some guy by the neck does not make it good. If "wrestling" techniques end up doing this, then they ought not try them. And seriously, the one by the Lions guy was no miss - he grabbed the guy by the neck from the start and went on with it. No justification at all, Whatty, say what you like.

 

[Richo]

The only way to stop that type of play is with harsh penalties. I completely agree with Gnostic's suggestion. If you can get a month for a high shot, then 6 weeks should be the absolute minimum for play like that.

 

[Gnostic]

There can be no doubt at all of the ntent in either of the cases highlighted in this thread. In both cases the offender must have known they had the opposition player around the neck and played on in the Deysel case continuing to exert pressure in a choking act (a UFC type move it looked to me to chole an oponent out) and in the Lions case he grappled around the neck and threw the player by the head. As Richo says if you can get a month for a careless high shot with no intent these dangerous acts which demonstrate intent, and really have no function in the game except to injure or incapacitate opponents must be met with the highest sanction possible.

 

[Blue]

The good thing about the Deysel and Lions flanker's clearouts is that it has brought this technique to the attention of refs, and that thankfully nobody got hurt. Clampdown definitely in order.

Justin Marshall also commented that he has seen the players in training practice this type of cleanout. I have seen it used very effectively this season by a number of teams.

Simple concept, engage the opposition player as you would in a scrum, grip, and roll your body over. Very effective but there have been a few that have been borderline already this year but not blown up.

I think to suggest that Deysel or the Lions flanker deliberately went for the neck is just being silly. They tried to execute the "roll" but did so poorly and in both cases could have pulled out but didn't. For that reason deserve whatever ban they receive.

But please, let's just stop "Judogate" in its track before it even hatches and be thankful that everybody got up and walked away.

 

[Blue]

There can be no doubt at all of the ntent in either of the cases highlighted in this thread. In both cases the offender must have known they had the opposition player around the neck and played on in the Deysel case continuing to exert pressure in a choking act (a UFC type move it looked to me to chole an oponent out) and in the Lions case he grappled around the neck and threw the player by the head. As Richo says if you can get a month for a careless high shot with no intent these dangerous acts which demonstrate intent, and really have no function in the game except to injure or incapacitate opponents must be met with the highest sanction possible.

I think you are wrong. There is a whole lot of doubt. This is a techique players are using more often and in both cases they should have let go and as I said have to pay for it.

To suggest there intent was to physically maim the opposition player is a tad hysterical.

 

[Blue]

The only way to stop that type of play is with harsh penalties. I completely agree with Gnostic's suggestion. If you can get a month for a high shot, then 6 weeks should be the absolute minimum for play like that.

Oh I think 6 or even more because it falls in the most dangerous category possible,

 

[Gnostic]

Blue,

There can be no doubt the first piont of grip was around the neck and head and then they executed their roll when they could have had no doubt where they had taken hold of their opponent. And then the fact is that after the "clear out" neither offender released their head/neck grip but instead continued on, Deysel in particular was intent on choking Carter out. Their actions are indefensible as both clearly attacked the head in a premeditated fashion unlike a swing arm or careless high tackle and continued the action in a dangerous manner.

Have both players been cited?