RWC23 - Pool C - AUSTRALIA, Wal, Fiji, Georgia, Portugal

[Tomthumb]

Not sure I agree, I think talent wise they were better in 2019, coaching is a tough one, Raiwailai was a failure with us. John McKee was highly rated and people forget just before 2019 they beat France????

Problem for them will always be backing up performances in pools. Like, they lost to Uruguay ffs.

They lost to Tonga, Samoa and Japan back then, now they beat them for fun and play a completely different lineup each week and look just as good

I haven’t forgot about France in 2018, that French team was putrid and led to a mass culling of old average players

 

[dru]

The "bands" or seedings had Aus placed in Band 1. On current rankings it is arguable whether we deserve even to be in band 2. England are in the same favoured position not deserving to be Band 1. Both South Africa and France aught be band 1 and for that matter Scotland should either be band 1 or head band 2. Wales don't deserve to be band 2 ahead of Argentina, but I suppose ditto Australia. These weird bands have provided a draw that simply pushes Australia ahead. One of South Africa, Ireland or Scotland must fall during the group stage, while both Australia and England are likely to go through just due to the draw.

The draw sits massively in our favour.

If we top C (which really we should) we meet either England or Argentina in the QF
If we are runners up in C we meet either England or Argentina in the QF
The only way I see Japan squeezing in there is if England are as shite as they seem and more. And surely facing down Argentina as our greatest threat to progressing to the SF has to be the best draw we've had in the history of the RWC.

I'd expect to be favourite over England. Though I don't mind the idea of facing Japan if that were necessary. Argentina could be a surprisingly tough encounter given the longer term history between the teams. But surely we favour ourselves there. A whole lot more appealing than meeting say, France, NZ, SA, Ireland or even a Scotland on fire. We can't meet any of those teams until the semi final. Wallaby fans aught be anticipating going deep into this RWC - the semi certainly. An utterly shit draw with us perplexingly on the advantage everywhere there is advantage to be found in the draw.

Of course Wales could simply luck it against their boogie-team, Fiji rip it up with WBs having insufficient rugby nous to counter it, and Georgia might luck a wet pitch to make life uncomfortable for the Wallabies. Still, that is a whole string of things to happen to challenge our favoured draw.

I'm hopeful that in spite the on-going desire from despondent fans for the Wallabies to do something like voice the depression that 5-0 could build - but we've got an HC who is all over pumping up the players and so far it seems positive attitude is winning out.

With any luck we meet England in the QF, and we only need to worry about the top teams once we hit the SF.

There is a reason that EJ (Eddie Jones) is optimistic. We should be to.

 

[qwerty51]

Absolutely wild to want to face England over Argentina in the quarter. Stop overreacting to low sample sizes of warm-ups.

Give me that Cheika revenge. Arg’s scrum is much more there for the taking than Eng’s

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

The thing about England is that they are rubbish at the minute. Their attack is shit and appear to have no dynamism on the park at all. And yet. AND YET: they've traditionally played this bore people to death style that we find it hard to match up with. I hate it.

 

[Mr Pilfer]

Absolutely wild to want to face England over Argentina in the quarter. Stop overreacting to low sample sizes of warm-ups.

Give me that Cheika revenge. Arg’s scrum is much more there for the taking than Eng’s

Argentina are ranked 6th and Fiji 7th, England 8th and Wales 10th

Those rankings are not just based off the warm up games as you suggest but longer term performance. England and wales have been bad for a few years whereas the others have been stonger and more consistent.

I believe Argentina will beat England comfortably

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

I think England v Argentina will be pretty tight and I reckon Cheik's mob can win. I'd love to see England out at the group stage.

 

[Dan54]

The overreactions have been nothing short of incredible and fucking absurd. Apparently, beating a team makes you instantly better than them. Look forward to that reasoning if we managed to knock over a big scalp in the semi-final. They will hear from me.

I agree qwerty, I keep saying these games really mean didley squat when the cup starts. I agree Fiji were bloody good, and Poms poor, but what happens when there's something on it?

 

[Tomthumb]

I agree qwerty, I keep saying these games really mean didley squat when the cup starts. I agree Fiji were bloody good, and Poms poor, but what happens when there's something on it?

There was something on the 6 nations this year and England were just as bad to be fair

 

[Slim 293]

Apparently, beating a team makes you instantly better than them.

It... doesn't?

 

[KevinO]

I agree qwerty, I keep saying these games really mean didley squat when the cup starts. I agree Fiji were bloody good, and Poms poor, but what happens when there's something on it?

That's the thing, Fiji bloody good but only managed a 8 point win over a team that played poor.

If England manage to find any form they would beat a good Fiji by 20, same goes for Wallabies, Wales etc. Samoa beat the Wallabies in 2011, went on to finish the group stage in 3rd and the Wallabies went onto the semis.

These matches are lucky to be counted as tests, and should not be rewarded any rankings points.

 

[Slim 293]

To be fair, right now...

Australia is shit... complete basket case...

England is shit... LOL...

Wales is shit... the shittest Welsh team in twenty years...

Fiji are probably the best they've been since 2007, possibly better...

Georgia have improved, and beat Wales last year...

It's quite possible that any one of Australia, Wales or Fiji top the pool... or finish third.

 

[Tomthumb]

That's the thing, Fiji bloody good but only managed a 8 point win over a team that played poor.

Mate I'd take an 8 point win over Madagascar at this stage

 

[KevinO]

Mate I'd take an 8 point win over Madagascar at this stage

If it was in Madagascar you would struggle, if you have never looked up Madagascar rugby it's worth a look on you tube, national sport with good crowd sizes.

 

[shaquille_oatmeal]

That's the thing, Fiji bloody good but only managed a 8 point win over a team that played poor.

If England manage to find any form they would beat a good Fiji by 20, same goes for Wallabies, Wales etc. Samoa beat the Wallabies in 2011, went on to finish the group stage in 3rd and the Wallabies went onto the semis.

These matches are lucky to be counted as tests, and should not be rewarded any rankings points.

The 8 points could've very easily been 13 or 15 depending on the offside call (was very close), also the ranking points are really just an indicator of form given the frequency at which they're updated, going into the RWC the teams will decide the outcome, not the arbitrary ranking given beforehand. I wouldn't be certain on any specific outcome at this point.

 

[KOB1987]

World rankings mean precisely zero at the start of a RWC tournament. Double points throughout so at the end of the tournament they will approximate the finishing positions.

 

[wamberal99]

Not sure I agree, I think talent wise they were better in 2019, coaching is a tough one, Raiwailai was a failure with us. John McKee was highly rated and people forget just before 2019 they beat France????

Problem for them will always be backing up performances in pools. Like, they lost to Uruguay ffs.

Is Mick Byrne in their coaching team?

 

[Highlander35]

World rankings mean precisely zero at the start of a RWC tournament. Double points throughout so at the end of the tournament they will approximate the finishing positions.

IDK about that.

If you look at where "substantial" points gap exists, the teams go:

Ireland, South Africa, France, NZ
Scotland
Argentina, Fiji, England, Australia
Wales
Georgia, Samoa, Italy
Japan
Tonga
Portugal, Uruguay, Romania, Spain
Namibia, Chile

Is that not a fairly accurate take on how teams have performed over the past 6-18 months?

 

[KOB1987]

I worded that badly - I didn’t mean they aren’t a fair representation of the current performances, only that they will likely look different after the tournament.

 

[qwerty51]

It... doesn't?

You’d really struggle with American 7 match playoff series.

 

[Digestif Palu]

England

You’d really struggle with American 7 match playoff series.

Fair but when there is only one recent game to go off, you have to go with the fact that Fiji won, so they are currently the better team. That's how it works right? There are plenty of games where you could say the better team lost but even in that case, the point of keeping the score is to decide a winner and determine which team is better at the end of the game. Saying anything like England would win 7/10 games means absolutely nothing because it's purely speculation. We can all believe that it is is true but it makes no difference in reality. Or am I taking crazy pills? Maybe you could go off rankings as an alternative?

Getting out of the pool for us will be an achievement. Any one of Georgia, Fiji and Wales are capable of beating us on the day. We're going into this 0-5 and we're definitely currently closer in quality to the teams in our pool than the top 5. I'd argue Fiji are always up there in terms of talented individuals, if they come together as a team and end up more than the sum of their parts they will be very hard to beat. I say that every world cup though...