RWC QF 4 AUS v SCO (Twickenham) 19th Oct 0200 AEDT

[Highlander35]

I've not picked up footage of thè incidents, does anyone know when they occurred? I, along with 4 match officials and several hundred thousand fans seem to be completely unaware that they happened.

If Fraser can play 70+ minutes, we'll be OK in the Hooker department, the big drop is Brown to Bryce not Ford to Brown.

Jonny will be much harder. The drop to Swinson is not insignificant for starters, while Gilchrist was replaced with an Openside, meaning one of Denton, Strauss and Wilson will have to be lock cover. They've all done it before, to varying degrees of success, but there's a reason that they're all backrowers.

Hopefully it ends up being off field yellows, but that's just optimism.

 

[Joeleee]

RE the nationality, every time an Australian is cited by a NZer with no NZ game coming up there are numerous (admittedly plenty tongue in cheek) comments on this site.

I must admit I feel like all officials should be, and likely are professional enough to not allow their country of birth to get in the way of doing their job. Having said that, I think the purpose of that rule is to combat perception, and they should probably have a look at doing the same thing for citing officers.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

RE the nationality, every time an Australian is cited by a NZer with no NZ game coming up there are numerous (admittedly plenty tongue in cheek) comments on this site.

I must admit I feel like all officials should be, and likely are professional enough to not allow their country of birth to get in the way of doing their job. Having said that, I think the purpose of that rule is to combat perception, and they should probably have a look at doing the same thing for citing officers.

Plus if someone does feel their player has been railroaded there's an appeal process. To mis-quote Churchill, the only thing worse than the system we have is any of the alternatives.

 

[Pfitzy]

RE the nationality, every time an Australian is cited by a NZer with no NZ game coming up there are numerous (admittedly plenty tongue in cheek) comments on this site.

I must admit I feel like all officials should be, and likely are professional enough to not allow their country of birth to get in the way of doing their job. Having said that, I think the purpose of that rule is to combat perception, and they should probably have a look at doing the same thing for citing officers.

I agree.

But when Skelton and Latu got done for their effort on Whitelock at Homebush this year (Tahs v Cru) then not long afterward, Robbie Fruean dumped NMS on his head and got but a yellow card, you have to wonder.

 

[Highlander35]

Found the incident.

https://streamable.com/t5rp

For mine, I think Jonny will get away with an off field yellow, but as the assist, Ford will have a lot more scrutiny and miss a week or two.

 

[Joeleee]

I agree.

But when Skelton and Latu got done for their effort on Whitelock at Homebush this year (Tahs v Cru) then not long afterward, Robbie Fruean dumped NMS on his head and got but a yellow card, you have to wonder.

Sorry, my post was horribly worded. I was trying to say that the Scots have as much right to be antsy about the citing officer's nationality as we do in situations like that one. In fact, probably more so since we're about to play them in a RWC quarter final.

I agree that the process is far from perfect, but as Waiopehu alluded to, I'm not sure World Rugby is capable of implementing anything better (even if a better system were designed).

 

[Strewthcobber]

Found the incident.

https://streamable.com/t5rp

For mine, I think Jonny will get away with an off field yellow, but as the assist, Ford will have a lot more scrutiny and miss a week or two.

Bugger, that's unfortunate. Think you are going to lose both of them though. Both have hands between the legs which is a red flag

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[Highlander35]

It's a lottery. Cautious optimism is always the order of the day.

 

[Pfitzy]

Found the incident.

https://streamable.com/t5rp

For mine, I think Jonny will get away with an off field yellow, but as the assist, Ford will have a lot more scrutiny and miss a week or two.

Hmmm...

They've both grabbed a leg and almost wishboned the bloke. The fact that Ford has him over the shoulder might make things look worse for Ford, but I don't think his impact is any worse.

Its one of those situations where they've both tried the same thing - and I've seen it in this world cup - where you take a leg and roll them off the side ruck. Problem is they've done it together.

Reminds me a little of the incident that ended BOD's 2005 Lions tour.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Once again it raises the different opinions that refs and citing officers hold for dangerous play.

The officer is now saying they should have both had red cards, which would have destroyed the game and caused meltdowns all over the place.

The red card threshold process has to change. Its undermining everybody.

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[TahDan]

Very much agree with others here that Folau and Pocock shouldn't be on the field for either their own good or the good of the team.

Hooper and McCalman will work nicely, whilst Beale at the back will be more than a handful (given Folau's ankle has made his high ball work less secure anyway), and possibly bringing Speight onto the bench, where his power game could do some real damage in the last 20.

 

[FrankLind]

I agree.

But when Skelton and Latu got done for their effort on Whitelock at Homebush this year (Tahs v Cru) then not long afterward, Robbie Fruean dumped NMS on his head and got but a yellow card, you have to wonder.

Let is go Pfitzy, let it go.
We all know the citing commissioners are "independent", except when it involves anti-Aussie or pro-NZ decisions

 

[Groucho]

Firstly he's an INDEPENDENT Citing Commissioner, not an Australian one & where do you draw the line? If he can't be an Aussie cos that's who Scotland are playing then surely he can't be Irish or Argentinian cos that's who they potential play next; nor South African nor New Zealander cos that's who they potentially play after that. Drains the pool of ICC's pretty quickly which is why they're INDEPENDENT in the first place

You're right about the place going into meltdown if the nationalities of ICC & the cited players were reversed but that's just human nature, innit? Doesn't make it right & certainly doesn't mean anyone should do things differently just to appease people who'd find fault in any alternative cos that's just the way they are.

The ideal Citing Commissioner would come from Rampant, Paranoia.

 

[Groucho]

Once again it raises the different opinions that refs and citing officers hold for dangerous play.

The officer is now saying they should have both had red cards, which would have destroyed the game and caused meltdowns all over the place.

The red card threshold process has to change. Its undermining everybody.

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I agree. The term "red card threshold" has to go. It leads to linguistic confusion.

This is an example. When the citing officer does his thing he's not saying they should have got onfield red cards. Citing offences by their nature often get picked up after the event, and referees are generally (and rightly) conservative when issuing reds on the field.

The actual process is fine. Off field penalties can be harsher using the same thresholds because they don't run the risk of ruining games.

 

[Lindommer]

Cheika has spent nearly all his time as Wallaby coach testing those in gold as he rotated players in and out of his various match squads. TBH I don't think he knows, or cares, what his best 23 players are, he wants the whole squad to be or feel they're in gold and on the paddock. This is done deliberately to foster competition in the squad as well as ensuring there's good flexibility for different game strategies and/or injuries. Admittedly, Pocock and Folau are probably among the two first selected for any test, but I think the team loses very little by having McCalman and Beale start instead of them. Even against the ABs or Bokke.

If Pocock and Folau aren't 98% fit I sincerely hope they aren't selected.

 

[A mutterer]

But its critical to make sure that we don't provide Scotland with ammunition that we are dismissive by not playing two of our best players.

Never forget Newcastle (or wherever it bloody was), it's largely removed from my memory

 

[qwerty51]

I don't get that thinking. Scotland are at 100% motivation to win already.

If we straight out said to them, we think you're shit and will lose by 100. Are they going to really play better than if we said nothing?

 

[fatprop]

No, it's not juvenile to call out obvious trolls on obvious trolling.....

You're just upset because you owe someone $50:

Slim

If you have an issue with a post or poster, report it

Less accusations about who is or isn't "trolling"

thanks

FP

 

[Lindommer]

Motivation? If our "A" team, the one which beat England, could beat the Sweaties by 30 I reckon the "B" team would put 50 on them. The Oz players not looking like getting selected will be mightily motivated if they get the chance.

 

[Quick Hands]

Aussie citing commissioner citing two Scottish players the week before a QF between Scotland and Australia doesn't look great. Won't affect the result in a month of Sundays because Scotland are rubbish but it doesn't inspire confidence.

Nothing in the citing process either at the RWC or at SANZAR has ever inspired me with any confidence.