Rugby League players who could have/could make the switch

[Up the Guts]

Well no, it’s factually incorrect and is a complete different grouping of players

It’s not really a big deal though whether you call him an inside or outside back, he’s definitely one of the most talented young players in either code. His game against the Tigers in May was one of the best individual performances you’ll see. He’s almost impossible to tackle front on.

 

[Lorenzo]

His ceiling is so high why wouldn't we be willing to invest time in him? We invest in young players all the time, how is this any different?

The 800k+ price tag for a guy that hasn't played (that I am aware of) a game of organised rugby in his life? Are you seriously saying those kind of investments are made all the time?

Complete speculation.

As is "He’d be huge for rugby as a player and a spectacle." For a season maybe. How long did the Folau dopamine hit last? Any long term converts to rugby as a result of us bringing him over? Not according to crowds, tv or the apparent general attitude towards the game. He certainly didn't get us over the hump from a results perspective.

Not true at all. Radradra, Laumape, and Te'o have all performed well at test level in the last year or two alone.

Don't know much about Te'o, but Laumape and Radradra were chosen for representative rugby teams before they ever played league. I think if you play rep footy, you can claim some rugby pedigree. They weren't simply trotting out for the Epping Rams.

Is it that unreasonable to suggest that we ought not chuck what would be close to our maximum contract at a guy who has never played the sport before?

If he was cheap, or if he had spent two years in Europe, then sure.

I'd be shocked if this happens, anyway. His agent wants another party at the table to boost the terms a bit, and I doubt Rennie is wild about spending that much payroll on a guy with possible character issues and no record in the sport.

He was offered deals from the Tigers and Roosters that were rescinded given he looked at other options after that. North Queensland and South Sydney are also looking at making an offer. It’s not like he was off-contract and can’t find anywhere to go.

This isn't really an explanation. It's not unusual for players to test the market and solicit a number of offers, but it is unusual for offers to be rescinded simply because the players are looking elsewhere. There is seemingly something else going on.

There are 16 teams in the NRL. You are making him out to be LeBron James. Something doesn't fit here. I would hazard a guess that for whatever reason(s), he is asking for more than most of the teams think he is worth.

 

[Adam84]

This isn't really an explanation. It's not unusual for players to test the market and solicit a number of offers, but it is unusual for offers to be rescinded simply because the players are looking elsewhere. There is seemingly something else going on.

There are 16 teams in the NRL. You are making him out to be LeBron James. Something doesn't fit here. I would hazard a guess that for whatever reason(s), he is asking for more than most of the teams think he is worth.

Well yeah, as mentioned theres a few factors.

First one is that he is currently a centre, and the only outside backs who are paid $800k+ in the NRL are fullbacks, clubs would be signing him as a fullback or even 5/8, not as a centre. So they’re banking on his value in been able to switch positions and play a role which he isnt proven in.. Thats probably the single biggest factor in clubs been reluctant to sign him.

Second one is, his hot cold form this year, especially around the rep teams like NSW and Australia. He crumbled for NSW at Origin, which might be excuseable given his age but again it adds doubt to offering him that much.

 

[Lorenzo]

Well yeah, as mentioned theres a few factors.

First one is that he is currently a centre, and the only outside backs who are paid $800k+ in the NRL are fullbacks, clubs would be signing him as a fullback or even 5/8, not as a centre. So they’re banking on his value in been able to switch positions and play a role which he isnt proven in.. Thats probably the single biggest factor in clubs been reluctant to sign him.

Second one is, his hot cold form this year, especially around the rep teams like NSW and Australia. He crumbled for NSW at Origin, which might be excuseable given his age but again it adds doubt to offering him that much.

So if they aren't convinced he can change positions....

 

[Adam84]

So if they aren't convinced he can change positions..

Don’t know, but It certainly creates an element of risk for any club

 

[Up the Guts]

The 800k+ price tag for a guy that hasn't played (that I am aware of) a game of organised rugby in his life? Are you seriously saying those kind of investments are made all the time?

No, I didn't say that at all. I said we make investments in players based on talent all the time before they have results to show for it.

As is "He’d be huge for rugby as a player and a spectacle." For a season maybe. How long did the Folau dopamine hit last? Any long term converts to rugby as a result of us bringing him over? Not according to crowds, tv or the apparent general attitude towards the game. He certainly didn't get us over the hump from a results perspective.

It's almost unquestionable signing one of the biggest stars in the NRL would generate interest in the game and is completely different to making up something about how he's just going to defect from rugby in a couple of years as you did. That's also some pretty heavy-handed revisionism of Folau's career. Pointing at poor crowd numbers doesn't really say anything about the effect of Folau, we don't know what those numbers would have been like without him. I'd say the fact that the majority of RA's marketing campaign was based on him until his public image went off the cliff demonstrates that those in the know believed he was a pretty valuable asset in sparking interest in the game. Ditto for his playing career, it's pretty hard to suggest that the only three-time winner of the John Eales Medal, leading Super try-scorer, and one of the leading Wallaby try-scorers didn't have a large effect on the performance of the team.

This isn't really an explanation. It's not unusual for players to test the market and solicit a number of offers, but it is unusual for offers to be rescinded simply because the players are looking elsewhere. There is seemingly something else going on.

There are 16 teams in the NRL. You are making him out to be LeBron James. Something doesn't fit here. I would hazard a guess that for whatever reason(s), he is asking for more than most of the teams think he is worth.

You originally said "why can't he get any deals?" I'm saying he has been made large offers and not taken them, which is very different to someone who comes off-contract and isn't made any offers at all. If your real concern is why clubs are now rescinding their deals, I'd say it's a pretty basic strategic move in a multi-bidder contest to say you're taking your offer off the table to force the hand of the target.

 

[Lorenzo]

No, I didn't say that at all. I said we make investments in players based on talent all the time before they have results to show for it.


It's almost unquestionable signing one of the biggest stars in the NRL would generate interest in the game and is completely different to making up something about how he's just going to defect from rugby in a couple of years as you did. That's also some pretty heavy-handed revisionism of Folau's career. Pointing at poor crowd numbers doesn't really say anything about the effect of Folau, we don't know what those numbers would have been like without him. I'd say the fact that the majority of RA's marketing campaign was based on him until his public image went off the cliff demonstrates that those in the know believed he was a pretty valuable asset in sparking interest in the game. Ditto for his playing career, it's pretty hard to suggest that the only three-time winner of the John Eales Medal, leading Super try-scorer, and one of the leading Wallaby try-scorers didn't have a large effect on the performance of the team.


You originally said "why can't he get any deals?" I'm saying he has been made large offers and not taken them, which is very different to someone who comes off-contract and isn't made any offers at all. If your real concern is why clubs are now rescinding their deals, I'd say it's a pretty basic strategic move in a multi-bidder contest to say you're taking your offer off the table to force the hand of the target.

1.As I've said multiple times now, I'd be happy to invest in Mitchell at the right price.

2. For all the hype, juice and cereal boxes with his face on them, tries he scored and medals he won, where did Folaubactually get us? If we had played a 15 that could execute a halfway competent clearing kick, maybe we wouldnt have leaked 26 points a fucking game? We were 47 percent with folau in the side. Can you find a >50 cap wallaby in the pro era with a shittier percentage than that? Id wonder. No, not all his doing but again, hardly a ringing endorsement. As for those in the know that decided to hire him and put his face everywhere, is that the same group of people that we generally acknowledge have ridden the game into the dirt in the last 20 years? Maybe they haven't got all the answers?

I would say there was considerable new interest in the game in folaus first season. After that, it petered off until the gay fiasco. People lost interest because the product was shit, even with folau scoring all the tries.

The exact same thing would happen with Mitchell. There'd be a short term hit, until people lose interest because they still don't like the game, or because we still suck, or because they see that unlike in league, superstar backs don't get 25 touches a game to demonstrate their skills. Then all those people go back to league because they have a new Lattrell Mitchell they can watch there. Meanwhile we are paying him 800 plus so he can learn the sport, knowing that at the end of his deal we are competing with league for his signature (assuming we even want him).

As for assuming he is a flight risk, it's not a stretch. He's indigenous with a young family and has already spoken publicly about missing his hometown. Query how he goes with the SA/Arg/Euro road trips.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Article in telegraph saying 14m reasons lattrel won’t get any interest from RA (ie risk of Folau winning and RA having to make payout.

Makes sense - wonder if that is why also gone quiet on signing that other Fijian Melbourne storm winger

 

[Rebels3]

Article in telegraph saying 14m reasons lattrel won’t get any interest from RA (ie risk of Folau winning and RA having to make payout.

Makes sense - wonder if that is why also gone quiet on signing that other Fijian Melbourne storm winger

Vunivalu is in contract for this coming season for the Storm they also aren’t looking to move him on as the Roosters are with Mitchell. Don’t think you’ll hear much more on the Vunivalu situation until well into the season. It could lead to a shift in the rosters with Maddocks seriously been looked at by the Tahs for the season 2021, which will create another domino of Crichton joining the Tahs 2022

 

[Adam84]

The issue for outside backs in league... is that even the best wingers in the game aren’t worth more then $500k per year. NRL wingers either want to shift to centre, or preferably fullback if they have the skill.

Someone like Vunivalu, who is good but not one of the best wingers in the league won’t ever earn more then $300k-$400k a year, unless he swaps positions. That’s where Latrell stands out, because at $800k-$900k a year he would be the highest paid centre in the game, earning more then fullbacks who arguably have more involvement, that’s why a salary like that would go along with the expectation he either plays 5/8 or fullback.

 

[Pfitzy]

The biggest issue for outside backs in league is they've got no fucking idea how to defend.

 

[chasmac]

Don't touch Latrell.
He needs to learn the code.
He might be at the standard of ARC but that would only be on individual skills.
He has no Rugby team skills and sounds like he needs alot of coaching attention to get his game right in league.
RA needs to focus on home grown // Grassroots before this game we love goes into a deep decline.
It would be a poison challis for any team at any level to sign him.
Run.

 

[wamberal]

Article in telegraph saying 14m reasons lattrel won’t get any interest from RA (ie risk of Folau winning and RA having to make payout.

Makes sense - wonder if that is why also gone quiet on signing that other Fijian Melbourne storm winger

RA do have some sort of insurance cover for this risk, so I read somewhere along the line. The chances of him being awarded 14 mill are about the same as the chance of me being the next Wallaby fullback in his place.


So if he wins (which is in the lap of the you know whats) it will be a hit, but not a 14 million dollar hit. Mind you, legal costs for both sides will be pretty significant. So if by some miracle he wins the full damages of 14 mill, we can actually add a fair bit to that.

 

[Up the Guts]

No doubt posted elsewhere but Vunivalu hopping across in 2021. Two years for him to learn the game before the World Cup then. I reckon the Tahs/Ra would also have their eyes set on Crichton that year when he goes off contract with the Chooks.

 

[KOB1987]

No doubt posted elsewhere but Vunivalu hopping across in 2021. Two years for him to learn the game before the World Cup then. I reckon the Tahs/Ra would also have their eyes set on Crichton that year when he goes off contract with the Chooks.

I think it might be more that Crichton has his eyes set on RWC2023 ;-)

 

[wamberal]

I think it might be more that Crichton has his eyes set on RWC2023 ;-)

If he he has his eyes set on '23, he would have to be playing our game for a couple of seasons before then, wouldn't he?

 

[Adam84]

If he he has his eyes set on '23, he would have to be playing our game for a couple of seasons before then, wouldn't he?

He is signed to the NRL until 2021, which gives him only a full season in 2022 and then the Super Rugby season in 2023 to press his case for the RWC.

Crighton will be taking a pretty significant pay cut to return to rugby, he is on $900k a year as it is

 

[cyclopath]

If he he has his eyes set on '23, he would have to be playing our game for a couple of seasons before then, wouldn't he?

He has played it for quite a few seasons at school, and reached a very high level. He'll probably pick it up pretty well, I reckon.

 

[Dctarget]

Rennie during his few days in Aus sat down with 16 year old Joseph Sua'ali'i. Joseph is contracted with the Rabbitohs till 2021 and is currently in year 11 at Kings...

https://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/...t/news-story/ed889508950c8c3b239202fc7a17f6ec

 

[Up the Guts]

Rennie during his few days in Aus sat down with 16 year old Joseph Sua'ali'i. Joseph is contracted with the Rabbitohs till 2021 and is currently in year 11 at Kings.

https://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/...t/news-story/ed889508950c8c3b239202fc7a17f6ec

Cheika was working on him before he left. Where it says he is contracted to Souths till 2021 I think that basically means they’re paying for his schooling. He’s definitely going to play both codes over the course of his career when and for how long is another matter. As a Souths and Wallabies supporter I’m not really fussed what code he goes for straight out of school.