Rugby Championship in an Aussie bubble?

[dru]

The RSA govt won’t let them out.

> yeah but what’s it got to do with the govt?!?

The RSA govt won’t let them out.

>> FFS but is it the govt that won’t let them out!!!

The RSA govt won’t let them out.

>>> yeah but what’s it got to do with the govt?!!


The RSA go... oh never mind.

 

[Ulrich]

But what bearing does that have on player welfare? Sure, it would be completely acceptable to say 'hey we are coming pending our fuckwit government letting us'.

But the circumstances in which you are to play have not changed.

SARU was hoping contact training would resume sooner, so that play could resume sooner, so players could leave well prepared.

That didn't happen.

Maybe the franchises are playing mini games internally to prep the players at the behest of SARU? Maybe SARU is delaying an answer depending on whether they can get warmup games in AUS?

Just because Argentina jumped in the fire doesn't mean SARU needs to follow them. Still, we don't have a definitive answer as yet.

In the meantime we don't know if they are perhaps trying to get their Euro boks involved, figuring out the logistics around that, I.E, will we send 30 local guys over and wait 2 weeks for 15 euro boks?

Will we send 45 local guys?

 

[qwerty51]

I think a combined side made up of non 23 squad members of Aus NZ is a fantastic idea. They might throw hospital passes to each however.

 

[dru]

South Africa is massively different to Aus. And NZ. Their ability to cope With and implementation of COVID practices are a different place. Their risk and exposure are chalk to our cheese. The culture and governmental strengths are a world apart to Aus. And ANY rugby issue becomes political faster than you can say ANC.

I’ve no doubt that both players and SARU will want the Bokke here if there is any way possible. The Euro players are another matter as we can expect a Springbok squad without them to effectively be the Bok Bs. And that being considerably underprepared.

Some of the whining here about the Saffers has been petulant. I’d suggest they could use some support for the effort. Should they make it I for one will be appreciative.

Come on Saffers, we need you.

 

[Derpus]

SARU was hoping contact training would resume sooner, so that play could resume sooner, so players could leave well prepared.

That didn't happen.

Maybe the franchises are playing mini games internally to prep the players at the behest of SARU? Maybe SARU is delaying an answer depending on whether they can get warmup games in AUS?

Just because Argentina jumped in the fire doesn't mean SARU needs to follow them. Still, we don't have a definitive answer as yet.

In the meantime we don't know if they are perhaps trying to get their Euro boks involved, figuring out the logistics around that, I.E, will we send 30 local guys over and wait 2 weeks for 15 euro boks?

Will we send 45 local guys?

Australia and NZ are using local guys. I get that there are a lot of logistics involved.

I just don't get how they didn't sit down, think about whether it was feasible and say yes if it's not. But eh. I guess there is always next year - if they crack a vaccine.

 

[sendit]

Australia and NZ are using local guys. I get that there are a lot of logistics involved.

I just don't get how they didn't sit down, think about whether it was feasible and say yes if it's not. But eh. I guess there is always next year - if they crack a vaccine.

If we’ve learnt anything from SA involvement in super rugby, it’s that they aren’t the most logical or considerate organisation going around

 

[Dan54]

They have previously indicated that they would participate so there could be legal ramifications. If someone is gunna lose a wad of cash i'd rather it be them.

Isn't it amazing, a number in here (I think I looking at you Derpus among others) were calling for Wallabies to be pulled from games in NZ because they had to quarantine in rooms for 3 days, over 2 weeks before test? And now saying the Bokke ahould be here with virtually no rugby behind them, half the squad in Europe and can't even train together?
Mate I have to much respect for test rugby to see any kind of pressure put on them to play. As it is I really can't see how the RC can have any proper integrity, there is just so many odds against SA and Argentina.
We should never be so desperate to see Wallabies (or ABs) win that we want patently unfair comps.

 

[Dctarget]

Isn't it amazing, a number in here (I think I looking at you Derpus among others) were calling for Wallabies to be pulled from games in NZ because they had to quarantine in rooms for 3 days, over 2 weeks before test? And now saying the Bokke ahould be here with virtually no rugby behind them, half the squad in Europe and can't even train together?
Mate I have to much respect for test rugby to see any kind of pressure put on them to play. As it is I really can't see how the RC can have any proper integrity, there is just so many odds against SA and Argentina.
We should never be so desperate to see Wallabies (or ABs) win that we want patently unfair comps.

Nah we were just suggesting we still play the games just in Aus where we don't have arbitrary quarantine rules. Game goes on.

I'm understanding SA rugby might not want to come because they'll get thumped, doesn't make good viewing and probably doesn't teach them much. But to pull out on the eve of the tournament under the guise of 'player welfare' is bollocks. Just 'fess up the real reason and I'll be more sympathetic.

 

[RebelYell]

With Fiji playing in the 8 Nations, is there any way to have Samoa/Tonga involved on short notice?

 

[Blue]

Soft - could have had plan b

Like what?

Covid 20 instead of 19? A healthcare system that could cope? A non-corrupt political system and an economy not failing? Less than 70% of people starving in shanty towns?

Dying to hear.

 

[Blue]

Australia and NZ are using local guys. I get that there are a lot of logistics involved.

I just don't get how they didn't sit down, think about whether it was feasible and say yes if it's not. But eh. I guess there is always next year - if they crack a vaccine.

You seem to be adamant that you are point blank going to ignore the facts. Last attempt:

1. SANZAR negotiated with the 4 partners and everyone knew the facts
2. SA said sure we will try our best but a) we do not know if out guvment will let us out and b) we have no idea when we can train let alone play. We will keep you posted. So they made it clear that their participation was dependent on these factors.
3. Contact training started on 8 Sep. A MONTH AGO.
4. Medial advice given to the Boks is that should think twice if players have not had 400 minutes of competitive rugby before you dump anyone, let alone rookies into the fire.
5. On 10 October the government says ok you can travel.
6. Saru is negotiating with the NH clubs who are playing silly buggers. They need to know who they can have and when before they actually finalise a squad, knowing that replacements are impossible. Unlike Aus and NZ, SA has a LOT of high quality players up North. It's simple fact.
7. They need to ACTUALLY SEE people play a little before deciding on who to pick because a lot of them will be rookies. Are the new Boks in SA actually fit (they looked EXTREMELY undercooked in the two local games I watched this weekend and in the trial match they looked worse).
8. Of the 23 WC final boks, only 5 are available immediately. The rest are in Europe, injured, or the Japanese players have not played or trained so they are out. You want them to pick replacements from local rookies based on seeing three warmup games and compete with battle hardened Aus and Kiwi players?

I can go on and on but I'll stop there.

The ignorance on display in this thread is nothing short of fucking breathtaking.

 

[Blue]

Nah we were just suggesting we still play the games just in Aus where we don't have arbitrary quarantine rules. Game goes on.

I'm understanding SA rugby might not want to come because they'll get thumped, doesn't make good viewing and probably doesn't teach them much. But to pull out on the eve of the tournament under the guise of 'player welfare' is bollocks. Just 'fess up the real reason and I'll be more sympathetic.

You are ignoring the facts.

 

[Dan54]

You seem to be adamant that you are point blank going to ignore the facts. Last attempt:

1. SANZAR negotiated with the 4 partners and everyone knew the facts
2. SA said sure we will try our best but a) we do not know if out guvment will let us out and b) we have no idea when we can train let alone play. We will keep you posted. So they made it clear that their participation was dependent on these factors.
3. Contact training started on 8 Sep. A MONTH AGO.
4. Medial advice given to the Boks is that should think twice if players have not had 400 minutes of competitive rugby before you dump anyone, let alone rookies into the fire.
5. On 10 October the government says ok you can travel.
6. Saru is negotiating with the NH clubs who are playing silly buggers. They need to know who they can have and when before they actually finalise a squad, knowing that replacements are impossible. Unlike Aus and NZ, SA has a LOT of high quality players up North. It's simple fact.
7. They need to ACTUALLY SEE people play a little before deciding on who to pick because a lot of them will be rookies. Are the new Boks in SA actually fit (they looked EXTREMELY undercooked in the two local games I watched this weekend and in the trial match they looked worse).
8. Of the 23 WC final boks, only 5 are available immediately. The rest are in Europe, injured, or the Japanese players have not played or trained so they are out. You want them to pick replacements from local rookies based on seeing three warmup games and compete with battle hardened Aus and Kiwi players?

I can go on and on but I'll stop there.

The ignorance on display in this thread is nothing short of fucking breathtaking.

Can't like that post enough mate! Geez the comments that have been made about this have really disappointed me so much!

I can guarantee the squeals if Wallabies (or ABs) were asked to play under same conditions, it is not only unfair in sporting sense , but I agree player welfare is a huge issue, you cannot have players that are not match fit! Geez we even have preseason games down at club level to make sure majority of players are able to handle the game, and this that x20!!

 

[Dan54]

With Fiji playing in the 8 Nations, is there any way to have Samoa/Tonga involved on short notice?

No same thing, how could anyone possibly get a competitive team together. It's only a bloody game of rugby we are going to miss!!

 

[Derpus]

You seem to be adamant that you are point blank going to ignore the facts. Last attempt:

1. SANZAR negotiated with the 4 partners and everyone knew the facts
2. SA said sure we will try our best but a) we do not know if out guvment will let us out and b) we have no idea when we can train let alone play. We will keep you posted. So they made it clear that their participation was dependent on these factors.
3. Contact training started on 8 Sep. A MONTH AGO.
4. Medial advice given to the Boks is that should think twice if players have not had 400 minutes of competitive rugby before you dump anyone, let alone rookies into the fire.
5. On 10 October the government says ok you can travel.
6. Saru is negotiating with the NH clubs who are playing silly buggers. They need to know who they can have and when before they actually finalise a squad, knowing that replacements are impossible. Unlike Aus and NZ, SA has a LOT of high quality players up North. It's simple fact.
7. They need to ACTUALLY SEE people play a little before deciding on who to pick because a lot of them will be rookies. Are the new Boks in SA actually fit (they looked EXTREMELY undercooked in the two local games I watched this weekend and in the trial match they looked worse).
8. Of the 23 WC final boks, only 5 are available immediately. The rest are in Europe, injured, or the Japanese players have not played or trained so they are out. You want them to pick replacements from local rookies based on seeing three warmup games and compete with battle hardened Aus and Kiwi players?

I can go on and on but I'll stop there.

The ignorance on display in this thread is nothing short of fucking breathtaking.

Simple fact hey?

I've already dropped the issue. If you don't come, so be it.

 

[Dctarget]

You are ignoring the facts.

I agree with most of your post and it all points to SA getting rolled. I understand that you won't want to see that and it might be better to pull out, I just disagree with this 400 minutes stuff. Sure you might need 400 minutes to play well and hold your own but it's not about injuries. If that was the case Nic White wouldn't have started the in the toughest match of the year so far in Wellington. Retallick will be parachuted back into international rugby after playing half an ITM game. It's bollocks that they're doing this to protect the players, maybe from embarrassment.

 

[Blue]

Simple fact hey?

I've already dropped the issue. If you don't come, so be it.

Yes. South African Rand is about 20 to the USD and a crumbling economy. You can pick a competitive bok 23 tomororw from NH players.

What is your point?

 

[Blue]

I agree with most of your post and it all points to SA getting rolled. I understand that you won't want to see that and it might be better to pull out, I just disagree with this 400 minutes stuff. Sure you might need 400 minutes to play well and hold your own but it's not about injuries. If that was the case Nic White wouldn't have started the in the toughest match of the year so far in Wellington. Retallick will be parachuted back into international rugby after playing half an ITM game. It's bollocks that they're doing this to protect the players, maybe from embarrassment.

Look I agree they player welfare issue is a bit overblown.

The logistics and selection issues are much bigger.

 

[Derpus]

Yes. South African Rand is about 20 to the USD and a crumbling economy. You can pick a competitive bok 23 tomororw from NH players.

What is your point?

We could do the same. Just as an example, three to four of our best locks are currently playing in Europe or Japan. It aint just you.

 

[Dctarget]

Look I agree they player welfare issue is a bit overblown.

The logistics and selection issues are much bigger.

Yeah as you said it's a fucker of a year. We're trying to get an international comp going in a global pandemic. Probably all need some compassion and compromise.

But surely it would be better to send a team of rookies across with 5 of the RWC winning 23 than pulling up stumps and going home? It won't have any affect on RWC23, it will get much needed money. I'm sure there could be some handshake agreement that Wallabies and NZ put on their B side for the first match. Like there are alternatives to stiffing the entire thing.