Rugby Boys playing Jnr Representative League

[Quick Hands]

The things with boys who play both these days is many have the opportunity to double dip. Crichton has 2 years to see if he can make a success of himself in league. If he reaches the end of the road at the end of 20s when he is presumably half way through his degree at Uni then he can no doubt jump in to uni for the final 2 years and still has a shot at a super 15 career.

The NRL 20s competition is a good option for them money wise in comparison to colts or shute shield.

 

[abe01]

There isn't a lot of money in nrl 20s for players but like rugboy said 2 years to see how you go isn't much when you have been told it's 5 before S15 is a option

 

[Inside Shoulder]

The things with boys who play both these days is many have the opportunity to double dip. Crichton has 2 years to see if he can make a success of himself in league. If he reaches the end of the road at the end of 20s when he is presumably half way through his degree at Uni then he can no doubt jump in to uni for the final 2 years and still has a shot at a super 15 career.

That was my initial point.
The kid played 12 at school this year.
He never actually played Oz schools because of injury.
The next 2 years is when he learns his trade as a backrower in union.
Life's not only about money, let alone what you can make today versus what you'll make later - if it were you'd never go to uni you'd just get a job.
Someone probably told McMahon it'd be 5 years until he played S15.

The NRL 20s competition is a good option for them money wise in comparison to colts or shute shield.

From what I hear the money these kids can pick up coaching at their old schools etc keeps the wolf from the door.

 

[Quick Hands]

There isn't a lot of money in nrl 20s for players but like rugboy said 2 years to see how you go isn't much when you have been told it's 5 before S15 is a option

Not much, but more that colts or shute shield. That's assuming that money is the motivation he might just want to have a go a league to see where it takes him.

 

[Quick Hands]

That was my initial point.
The kid played 12 at school this year.
He never actually played Oz schools because of injury.
The next 2 years is when he learns his trade as a backrower in union.
Life's not only about money, let alone what you can make today versus what you'll make later - if it were you'd never go to uni you'd just get a job.
Someone probably told McMahon it'd be 5 years until he played S15.


From what I hear the money these kids can pick up coaching at their old schools etc keeps the wolf from the door.

True, but I suspect that the mindset of young players has undergone a complete change in the last decade and particularly the past 2 or 3 years. They see SBW, Folau, Brad Thorn, Karmichael Hunt et al changing codes and making a go of both and they see nothng unusual in it. The old ideas of working one's way through colts, grade and then onto representative teams have gone the way of straw boaters and button up shoes.

This is the new paradigm.

 

[abe01]

We have just seen a kid play for the kangaroos after 7 first grade games. The lure of "hitting the big time" in 1 or 2 years would be pretty strong

 

[Inside Shoulder]

We have just seen a kid play for the kangaroos after 7 first grade games. The lure of "hitting the big time" in 1 or 2 years would be pretty strong

but if you are that good, or think you are, why wouldn't you be able to do it union?

 

[abe01]

I'm only assuming that in Crichtons case that some one connected to the Tahs or a S15 club has told him it's 5 years away. I know there is exceptions but it's rare for a 18 or 19 year old to be playing top rugby 1 or 2 years out of school

 

[formerflanker]

I'm only assuming that in Crichtons case that some one connected to the Tahs or a S15 club has told him it's 5 years away. I know there is exceptions but it's rare for a 18 or 19 year old to be playing top rugby 1 or 2 years out of school

Especially if he stays in the forwards. However, he is a prodigious talent and I'm sure we will hear more of him.

 

[Quick Hands]

but if you are that good, or think you are, why wouldn't you be able to do it union?

There's probably no reason why one couldn't. It could just be that there are 5 professional rugby teams in Australia and 16 professional NRL teams - each with a 20s team. The 20s team aren't that highly paid, but they are part of a professional structure with all the resources that go with that. Colts and grade are light years behind that - I've previously spoken to a parent whose boy was in a similar position a couple of years ago and that was what tipped him towards league.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Go to the Gold Standard.

How many NZ Kids make their national Rugby team in less than 5 years after they finish school?

Sometimes a back does.. TJ Perenara f'r'instance but the vast majority spend some time learning their trade in club grade, ITM cup then Super rugby.

5 years for a forward doesn't seem out of order. McMahon has been out of school for 3 years.

 

[Quick Hands]

Go to the Gold Standard.

How many NZ Kids make their national Rugby team in less than 5 years after they finish school?

Sometimes a back does.. TJ Perenara f'r'instance but the vast majority spend some time learning their trade in club grade, ITM cup then Super rugby.

5 years for a forward doesn't seem out of order. McMahon has been out of school for 3 years.

That's true, but NZ don't really have the same league option. 1 NRL team, who incidentally are consistently top 2 in the NRL 20s.

I don't know enough about the NZ set-up below super teams, but maybe the training and development set up for the elite level kids is more akin to NRL 20s than to Sydney colts?

I'm all for players learning their trade through colts, grade, etc.; it doesn't seem to be the way a lot of kids are thinking these days.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I regret to say that I have watched the Bugatti cup for several minutes at a time. I'm heavily biased, I admit.
They may be bigger and stronger and even fitter but it is overall a poor standard, IMO.
Many many missed tackles and high scoring games as a result.
Each to his own I guess.

 

[Quick Hands]

I regret to say that I have watched the Bugatti cup for several minutes at a time. I'm heavily biased, I admit.
They may be bigger and stronger and even fitter but it is overall a poor standard, IMO.
Many many missed tackles and high scoring games as a result.
Each to his own I guess.

I think that's right, but I think it's the perception - by the kids and/or their parents - that the training and preparation is more advanced than is available in rugby. This perception may not even be correct, but nonetheless, it's the percption.

Sydney Uni would be the exception as they have similar resources etc.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I think that's right, but I think it's the perception - by the kids and/or their parents - that the training and preparation is more advanced than is available in rugby. This perception may not even be correct, but nonetheless, it's the percption.

Sydney Uni would be the exception as they have similar resources etc.

And that was my motivation in commenting: I want all these kids to stay in Union and I think a lot of them leave because of misguided perceptions and poor advice.
Of course, if he has a manager (as I suspect he does) he does not cop a percentage of the experience only of the $$$$

 

[Runner]

Some, I suspect, view the NRL as a more challenging competition and along with that perception of a better structure opt that way.

Why are the Wallabies loosing so many good players to Japan and France.? Many are in their prime if take HJ point about time in NZ. One would have to say the dollers, yen etc.

I know a few young guys who now look at sport and say I have X years to max. my income which options will do that best?

 

[BeastieBoy]

What's the problem with them playing under 20's especially if you are a back or a flanker for that matter. Not bad training from professional coaches and management. Where we are losing out is the attitude of us or them that starts at U13 level when we switch the junior club competition to Sunday, in the belief that the kids will drop Sunday league. What we should be doing is maintains the Friday or a Wednesday night junior competition and providing an alternative pathway to the many gifted junior league players. Most won't play NRL. Let's show them we aren't snobs and introduce them to our game. We have such a advantage over the rest of the world with the other codes our children play. Let's tap into it. I have sen it where rugby boys play other codes. You get a product that is much more complete and flexible in their development.

 

[Gary Owen III]

What's the problem with them playing under 20's especially if you are a back or a flanker for that matter. Not bad training from professional coaches and management. Where we are losing out is the attitude of us or them that starts at U13 level when we switch the junior club competition to Sunday, in the belief that the kids will drop Sunday league. What we should be doing is maintains the Friday or a Wednesday night junior competition and providing an alternative pathway to the many gifted junior league players. Most won't play NRL. Let's show them we aren't snobs and introduce them to our game. We have such a advantage over the rest of the world with the other codes our children play. Let's tap into it. I have sen it where rugby boys play other codes. You get a product that is much more complete and flexible in their development.

Premiership U18's colts to be played on a Saturday from 2015 is a step in the right direction and fills a hole in the pathway (for those outside the schools network).

 

[Inside Shoulder]

What's the problem with them playing under 20's especially if you are a back or a flanker for that matter.

The problem is that good players who go to league as flankers, in particular, but inside backs also, will be well trained and coached in the art of league, which involves different angles.
IMHO - angles in league are not all that vital or variable. In union they are both vital and variable - partly because of body shape differentials that lead to mismatches which are less common in league because the body type is in much narrower confines.
From the point of view of rugby that's 2 years of education wasted.

 

[ruggersguruu]

From the Souths SG Ball camp, these are a handful of boys that I am aware of as rugby players who are also working their way through the rugby league system. I'm not sure which side of the fence their priorities fall, but it will sure be a loss to ruggers if the other game can poach them away.
Sepesa Loga Tarogi - 2014 Australian Schoolboy, Newington
Cameron Murray - Newington
Tom Wright - 2014 NSW 2nd XV, Joeys
Harrison Goddard - 2014 Australian Schoolboy, Oakhill
I am lead to believe that there may be another boy of solid build from Oakhill in the squad also but his name not listed
Reece Macintosh - NSW CHS u16 2014, school unknown